[joshdrive]

Originally Posted by Ramsagar

Sorry for hijacking this thread


Endeavor: a bad SUV with no rear seat comfort

Almost all SUVs we have today have bad rear seat comfort. Pajero and Endeavour has same kind of rear seats...

Fortuner, Captiva etc may have better rear seats but they are MUV...They are on different platform

[Ramsagar]

Originally Posted by joshdrive

Almost all SUVs we have today have bad rear seat comfort. Pajero and Endeavour has same kind of rear seats...

Fortuner, Captiva etc may have better rear seats but they are MUV...They are on different platform

Fortuner, Captiva are MUV'sits a news to me.

captiva is good interms of goodies it have.but after sales would suffer.

[ACM]

Overall Rankings the way I look at them:

1) Toyoto Fortuner - Best Overall Package - Coming in Oct.
2) Pajero SFX - Evergreen Looks, true off road ability, lower on engine power & Interiors. Old Design to start with. Funky paint work is quite likeable.
3) Safari - Great Value for money, Very comfy, last row only for kids, can be repared almost anywhere, great waranty, good engine - niggling issues
4) Endeavor - Last Row Seats a joke, Off road capability compromised by wt, good engine, good road presence. New look comming.
5) Scorpio - Cheapest SUV, not a true SUV, Unstable at high speeds, braking suspect, bouncy ride, decent engine, cheapest to run and maintain. Has Auto option.

All above have Deisel options. Not added Landcruiser, Prado, Montero & Range Rover options to keep within the 10-30L price range.



Lux Soft Roaders: 40L - 80L
Audi Q7 - Gigantic road presence and best looks
BMW X5
Merc M- Class
Audi Q5

Value Soft Roaders: 20L-30L
Captiva - Diesel, Has 3rd row seats, Great looks
Grand Vitara - Best Value, Maruti service, but a bit boring, new better engine.
Yeti - Skoda Service? Will be most capable when it arrive next Jan.
Outlander - Mitsubishi low sales, capable, but resale?
CRV - Honda high price, Only for the normal Road, only Petrol, no 3rd row seats. Picey
Tucson & Terracam - Do not sell enought

[D.V.R]

Almost all SUVs we have today have bad rear seat comfort. Pajero and Endeavour has same kind of rear seats...

Fortuner, Captiva etc may have better rear seats but they are MUV...They are on different platform

Mate on what basis did you make the above statement.The Paj and Endy might have the same seat layout but the rear seat comfort of the Paj is way way superior than the Endy.

Except for the scorpio and endy the other suv/muv in that segment have real good rear seat comfort eg-Safari,Paj,Innova,Captiva

[Gurpartap Singh]

So what did you buy, GhettoMAX?

[joshdrive]

Originally Posted by D.V.R

Mate on what basis did you make the above statement.The Paj and Endy might have the same seat layout but the rear seat comfort of the Paj is way way superior than the Endy.

Except for the scorpio and endy the other suv/muv in that segment have real good rear seat comfort eg-Safari,Paj,Innova,Captiva

I own both Endy and Pajero. Pajero 3rd row seats are better but IMHO its not superior. Both have low lying seats.

[joshdrive]

Originally Posted by Ramsagar

Fortuner, Captiva are MUV'sits a news to me.

captiva is good interms of goodies it have.but after sales would suffer.

Hi: I agree. Wrong info. I actually got confused with outlander.Did not see Captiva when I made that statement.

[D.V.R]

Originally Posted by joshdrive

I own both Endy and Pajero. Pajero 3rd row seats are better but IMHO its not superior. Both have low lying seats.

Actually no Suv in the segment has good 3 rd row seats with captiva's a bit good.I was actually speaking of the Paj 2nd row as compared to the low lying in your face knee type seats of Endy.

[freewheelburnin]

Ford service is a suspect as you live in rural punjab.C.R.V is not meant for really bad roads.Fortuner will take more time for delivery.Chevrolet Captiva is not meant for hard use on non existent roads.Pajero is a much simpler and reliable machine and fits the bill perfectly if you plan to drive on really bad roads.Safari can be considered because of ease of service,fuel efficiency,comfort and price.But you should be ready for small issues.Also gear shift quality is the main grey area of safari.Otherwise it is a superb vehicle.

[joshdrive]

Originally Posted by D.V.R

Actually no Suv in the segment has good 3 rd row seats with captiva's a bit good.I was actually speaking of the Paj 2nd row as compared to the low lying in your face knee type seats of Endy.

I didnt feel Endy's 2nd row seating that bad.Infact many people tell me that its very comfortable. Suspension in Endeavour is the thing to worry about.Its very hard and small pot holes create jerk.Its better on bigger patches. Safari's supension is better than Endy and Pajero too.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by ACM

3) Safari - Great Value for money, Very comfy, last row only for kids, can be repared almost anywhere, great waranty, good engine - niggling issues

I agree with all of the above except "can be repaired almost anywhere". This is true of the 2.0 TCIC engine that you have. But not with the 2.2 VVTI. This is a ECU controlled engine and you require a laptop and diagnostic software which is not available "almost anywhere". You will have to take it to the dealer.

[ACM]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

I agree with all of the above except "can be repaired almost anywhere". This is true of the 2.0 TCIC engine that you have. But not with the 2.2 VVTI. This is a ECU controlled engine and you require a laptop and diagnostic software which is not available "almost anywhere". You will have to take it to the dealer.

Yep correctly pointed our, or else one can get one self well equipped and buy a Scanner to self diagonse. (about 35K max)

[mod_to_odd]

Hello every one. I have three options in the SUV range and need some expert opinions on them. They are the Chevrolet Captiva, Toyota Fortuner and the Ford Endeavour. How would you all rate them in terms of average, performance, comfort, features, drive experience, interiors and service. I plan to pick one of them in a month or two but need some insight on it.

[Prakash Gupta]

hi mod_to_odd, whats the present situation. Have you you bought one yet?

I am driving a Captiva Manual. clocked 23k kms. the vehicle is good. In fact a few of my friends who drive the CRV have liked it more, specially for the 3rd row and basically for it's Diesel engine.

GM could really do some good for the car and owners(if they are listening): Better tires, Pure leather seats instead of the Artifical. They make you sweat. A remote controller for the music system. Auto windows on all four doors.

Overall experience hass been good and the cost of service is also very low. Its a little early to say about major services to come.

But a real pity the car comes only with a ONE year warranty. This is too short for an expensive car and that too a CBU. Atleast an option for extended warranty.

[undrkvabrtha]

Looks like Mod_to_odd's no longer around...the last post was in Jan this year...however, this looks like it was an interesting discussion of all kinds of fourbies in The Holy Land.

In the interest of clarity, let us first distinguish between 4WDs and SUVs.
Sport utility vehicle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
As you'll see in the second paragraph, "not all SUVs have four-wheel drive capabilities. Conversely, not all four-wheel-drive passenger vehicles are SUVs"
SUV is simply a media term misused by the American media in an attempt to sell more vehicles.
I for one, would hate to have my Patrol an SUV. It's a Fourbie (in Oz) or a 4WD, or a 4x4.
The GM-Chevrolet Captiva is an AWD and can be called an SUV, though it's more of a crossover, I think.
It's a good car, though - I've seen lots over here since it was released.
I took a look at the Fortuner - I wouldn't buy it - it's a badly disguised Hilux. in Oz and some other countries, the Hilux is Toyota's offer for tradesmen's utility vehicle.
Hiluxes are no fun to drive. They're quite reliable, though. I wouldn't buy one if you paid me to, I have to say.
In India, though, I don't know if they have any competition. Between Nissans, Mitsubishis, Toyotas and Fords, my first choice would be a Nissan.
Why? ask anyone who drives a Jonga. Jongas are essentially Nissan Patrols from the caveman era, built in Jabalpur under license - built specifically to suit the Indian Army.
Or go to Dubai or some other desert city of the world. Anyone who actually does a lot of desert/off-road driving will own a Patrol.
Toyotas are considered 'soft' in the off-road department by many hardcore enthusiasts.
Personally, Landcruisers and Patrols are equally good vehicles with the Landcruisers being more user-friendly, and the Patrols being famous for pure, unbeatable reliability.
Another manufacturer that makes great fourbies is Isuzu. They're not around in many countries, though. I don't think they're in India, anyway.
I'm guessing that the Endeavour is what Ford calls its vehicle there.
I've seen the same car in Malaysia and it was called something else.
GhettoMAX, this entire discussion was fuelled by your query about making a decision.
It's simple - given that most of your driving is on unpaved roads, I'd say go 4WD.
Depending on how many people you're hoping to move in the vehicle, choose the size.
I've gone 4WDing in India a while ago, and you may be surprised at how reliable and capable those little Suzukis are.
Remember - 4WDing is not so much about power outpout (HP/BHP/KW) but rather about how reliable the engine will be when revving at a constant RPM on low range 4WD to drag you out of a muddy road after the rains, and how well the transfer case holds under constant stress.
The best way to ensure a decent ride (for your father, mod_to_odd) is to find a 4WD with independent suspension (Landrovers and Nissan Patrols were the only 4WDs that had this feature decades ago).
Most hardcore 4WDs released in India have leaf-spring suspensions... pretty primitive, and jarring.
I remember having my brains shaken out of my ears in some memorable vehicles including a Tempo Trax, a Mahindra, a Tata Sumo and an Auto-rickshaw.
If I were to buy a practical car in India and money were no object, I'd import a Patrol. Nothing less.
But if money were a hindrance, I would probably get an ex-military hard-top Mahindra that can be fixed anywhere, put in comfy-cushiony seats, rebuild the engine, and air-conditioning.