[condor]

PAVAN KADAM : Well Condor, i quite did not understand what you replied

Well Pavan, why am I not surprised ?

There are feelings, then there are opinions, and then there are bare numbers. Easiest to express and understand are always the numbers. Tangible, measureable details.

Opinions do help a little, but even these have to be based on numbers. Feelings are just that - feelings.


To give an (possibly over-simplified) example :

Person A (driving a car) : I think I am going very fast.
Person B (also in the car) : How do you say that ?
A : I can feel it !!
B : Are you sure ? How fast are you going ?
A : I feel I am going very very fast.

Along comes another car and wooshes past, soon to become just a speck on the road ahead.

Of course Mr A was going fast. But the other car was much faster. If we had all measured the speeds, then Mr A may have been doing 80kph. But the other guy was possibly a Lambo @ 200kph.


Numbers, Pavan, numbers -easiest to convey actual details. We all know how you feel about your Safari. And no one is going to say anything about that .. you're a true petrol head with the love for your Safari. But if you want us to benefit from your experiences, we can do better with something that's more tangible to us.

Hope you get the drift.

[roy_libran]

Originally Posted by Mansat

Me and my brother are looking for a second hand 4X4 Safari for nearly one year now in Delhi, but could not find even a single one so far!
The dearer the product more is the resale value right?

It (4x4) never was a Product of Choice for many, hence it is difficult to come by. The immense overhangs and the GVW, reduce (NOT NULLIFY) its abilities as an Off-Roader. So, the big Torque and Power Output is actually not as big practically. But, it does have fantastic GC.

But, although your last statement holds true in almost all cases, in the case of the Safari, it does not, because of the reputation it has, for being unreliable and high on maintenance. Some other examples: Premier 118NE, Contessa Classic, Yezdi, Uno, Matiz...... None of these have held up their resale prices over the years as well as, for example, CJs, MMs, REs etc. although the former set is also scarcely available.

Looks like I am trying to state facts (as I know them, and have been made aware of them from multiple sources), without stirring up a hornet's nest.

I just WISH, that Tata makes Safari into a vehicle that can give an owner 5 tension-free years of service. They should/could have done this long back. I have suffered in the past and so have many of my friends, but still I'd love to buy another one someday if it gets improved.

[Live To Jive]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

Your reasoning is totally rational, but you have not considered the RISK aspect of buying a Used Safari. Safari, suffers from serious reliability issues, and this can be very unpredictable. Safari is such a great vehicle to own and drive, that the only reason most people would consider selling off a Safari within 2 years of ownership would be because of a Mechanical Problem (Costly) cropping up.

So, you need to be very careful, and you may as well, add some contingency amount to your financial model for buying a Used Safari, and see how well the model still stands.

I, for one, would never think of buying any Tata vehicle, without Warranty and Extended Warranty.

The first few Safari's had some electrical problems. However Tata sorted that out and now the Safari is extremely reliable.

Originally Posted by anujmishra

Do you own Safari? Where you have faced reliability issue? Or this is just you personal assumptions. I own Safari recently and I know atleast 10 persons who is owning Safari (varying from decade) and never faced any reliability issue.

Absolutely right. Although I don't own one, I have many friends who own the Safari. In fact between they, they own every version of the Safari produced. They all share your view.

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

WRT maintenance issues - I am more or less in agreement with you but reconciled to there being some gremlins or the other. As they say there is no such thing as a free lunch - If I save on the depreciation I will need to pay something out of that on the maintenance.

I would weigh the extra cost of maintenance of a pre-owned vehicles against depreciation. The weightage should also include cost of time spent in repairs and of course frustration.

From what I have read in this forum, upto 50K kilometers there is hardly any major maintenance issue, barring cases like bent chassis and deliberately under lubricated engine.

What is pertinent is getting a good piece, and that is where the rub comes, as you may land up buying a grossly neglected vehicle, which has been spruced up for sale.

In my opinion getting a new vehicle is a better option as most of the niggles as well as major maintenance are taken care of by the normal/extended warranty. As you want a vehicle with ABS and other safety features, your seller pool is much smaller.

[druva]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

Folks esp. Condor

The scope of my query is limited to the timing part of the decision.

...
I have more or less decided/made my choice. Now the only issue remaining is the hunt, the implementation.

As far as I can make out , I should embark on this when the 2011 model(new model?) is launched. This too as I desire the vehicle I purchase now should be equipped with ABS+EBD. If that was not the concern, Dicor 2.2 vehicles are presently available at not so generous valuations and I can embark on the search now.

The reason for this post was to validate/invalidate the thought process that I have followed.

Regards

R

Good that you have chosen the Car you want. Its even better that you have chosen the variant you want. In used car search these two are very important.

Used car hunt and in particular finding pre-worshipped one is difficult. So now onwards you should keep track of the Sunday Classified, TBHP and Carwale classifieds. Keep watching the prices even for the variants that you dont intend to buy. If any seller is close by, go drive the car and check the condition of the car. This will help when your model with right price comes up.

Once a while you do get GX, VX variants with low mileage coming up. So keep hunting.

One last bit of advice: Be Patient.

[comfortablynumb]

@RS_DEL: IMO, you would do well to keep a look out for on sale VX variants too, since that has been around right from the time the 2.2 was introduced.

Methinks that a 2.5 - 3 year old VX could be bought for the same price as that of a 1.5 year old GX. If it's been well maintained and has a clean service history, it could be a good bet.

[ACM]

RS Del

Why go for the lower GX go for a preowned VX today itself - why wait

You can get a 2 year old VX 2.2 dicore version for about 6-7L with 2 years of warranty still remaining.

It is the best deal in SUV's

It is the best choice among preowned SUV's.

[RS_DEL]

@Mods: Kindly rectify the query/post location if it is not appropriate.

The intended vehicle is a Safari. Versions I am looking at Vx/Gx depending on availability/budget.

My query stems from my lack of knowledge about need/desirability for 4 X 4.

Given that my intended usage is [1] primarily in the nature of a highway cruiser, [2] to a lesser extent on inclined/hilly roads and finally [3] very seldom if ever off the beaten track on country roads, is 4X4 a must have/desirable/superfluous feature.

Will appreciate inputs from those who have real world experience with 4X4 and non 4X4 versions. Thanks for any inputs.

[MileCruncher]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

@Mods: Kindly rectify the query/post location if it is not appropriate.

The intended vehicle is a Safari. Versions I am looking at Vx/Gx depending on availability/budget.

My query stems from my lack of knowledge about need/desirability for 4 X 4.

Given that my intended usage is [1] primarily in the nature of a highway cruiser, [2] to a lesser extent on inclined/hilly roads and finally [3] very seldom if ever off the beaten track on country roads, is 4X4 a must have/desirable/superfluous feature.

Will appreciate inputs from those who have real world experience with 4X4 and non 4X4 versions. Thanks for any inputs.

Based on your usage pattern, I would say that 4X4 would be a desirable feature, not superfluous at all. If you do get a used 4X4 in decent nick, please do grab it as they are far and few in between.

Cheers

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

Will appreciate inputs from those who have real world experience with 4X4 and non 4X4 versions. Thanks for any inputs.

Going by your intended usage, a 4x4 is not a must-have for you. Morever, it is very difficult to come by a well-maintained used 4x4 Safari. My advice - if you do come across one and if your budget permits, pick it up. However, if you come across a good/well-maintained 2WD example, do not let it go for the want of a 4x4.

[HappyWheels]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

...
Given that my intended usage is [1] primarily in the nature of a highway cruiser, [2] to a lesser extent on inclined/hilly roads and finally [3] very seldom if ever off the beaten track on country roads, is 4X4 a must have/desirable/superfluous feature...

You can do with the 4x2.

But, go for the 4x4 if you can and if it is well within your vehicle budget. If not, you never know when you will find yourself wishing you had gone for a 4x4.

[RS_DEL]

Today I and my son went to see a 2007 Vx 4X4.Very very perfunctory/casual look at the vehicle. More in the nature of testng the waters, than taking the plunge.

Vehicle used by a kid i.e. a young man ( should tell you how dated I am!). General description - () Tyres with a decent amount of tread on them, () Spare wheel cover cracked, () Leather seats in pretty deplorable condition ( cracks/cuts(?) )on them. Service record is available. 45K odd on the Odo. Have asked the dealer to enquire if the owner is willing to provide insurance claim history. Stock ICE setup. No pre-sale jazzing up visible, to me atleast. Paint shows visible signs of big city use i.e. several minor/almost miniscule scratch marks. Asking price 6.75 lacs.

Question that I want to find an answer to is - Which service center is best used to have the vehicle inspected. Else where on the forum I have read about incompetence of service center staff esp WRT 4X4 issues. I obviously do not want an inspection by such inept jokers. 4X4 vehicles to my mind ( I am open to correction here) would need a higher level of competence than a non 4X4.

Look forward to inputs from NCR based Bhpians using Safari 4X4.

[David Murx]

Hello members
I and parents are now looking for a bigger vehicle. Currently we own a Alto K10 Vxi (please note i am the proud owner of first K10 on T-bhp!!). My family is now expanding, new baby is going to come and along with that i am also about to get engaged. At present we are family of 5 adult and 1 kid of 4 year. In soon time it will be family of 6 adults and 2 kids. Yesterday i checked out one used safari 2.2 VTT. The exterior was fair, though needed some proper fittings of bumper and all. The interior was not clean, although the dealer promised me to get all the things proper if the deal is finalised. Some points i want to discuss in here and also seek gurus advice. Some things that i noted were as follows :

The middle door on the left side needs some muscle power to close it, can this problem be easily solved ?
I guess there is sort of AC vent under the seat in the last cabin. On the right seat it seemed like broken. Can it be repaired ?
The hub cap in the front wheel was cracked. Does it need replacement ?
This safari dicor is a 2006 EX variant and has clocked 70000 kms.

Taking into considerations is it worth a buy ? I am a bit tempted at the cosmetic appearance since it has been well maintained. Need your advice guys.
Also would like to add that the dealer has promised full servicing before delivering me the vehicle.

[ACM]

Originally Posted by David Murx

In soon time it will be family of 6 adults and 2 kids. Yesterday i checked out one used safari 2.2 VTT. The exterior was fair, though needed some proper fittings of bumper and all. The interior was not clean, although the dealer promised me to get all the things proper if the deal is finalised. Some points i want to discuss in here and also seek gurus advice. Some things that i noted were as follows :

The middle door on the left side needs some muscle power to close it, can this problem be easily solved ?

YES standard problem will be easy to correct but it can reappear again later. Just check that there has not been an accident on that door.

I guess there is sort of AC vent under the seat in the last cabin. On the right seat it seemed like broken. Can it be repaired ?
That is just a plastic cover - not an AC vent, yes the plastic replacement will be available it may cost about 2-3K depending upon the side.

The hub cap in the front wheel was cracked. Does it need replacement ?
This safari dicor is a 2006 EX variant and has clocked 70000 kms.

yes replace, infact if you can afford it right now go in for alloys all around 5 wheels for roughtly about 30k from Neo.

Taking into considerations is it worth a buy ? I am a bit tempted at the cosmetic appearance since it has been well maintained. Need your advice guys.
You have not mentioned the price at which you are getting this. How do you know it has been well maintained if it is so messy inside right now?

Also would like to add that the dealer has promised full servicing before delivering me the vehicle.

Biggest problem in the deal is that you mention that it is a 2006 EX 2.2 dicore. 2.2 Dicore came around oct 2007 so the above statement is incorrect, this must be a 3.0 dicore. between the two the 2.2 dicore is much better and newer Safari. Also a 2006 Safari would be out of warranty. Do not go for this unless you are getting if for something like 4.xx L. Also it should be due a full suspention overhaul and a change in clutch, and timing belt change about now at 70k kms, has this been done?

I would recomend that you go in for end 2008- start 2009 2.2 Dicore with 1-2 years of extended warranty still remaning for about 6-7L in EX, GX or VX trim.

Also for a Family of 6+ 2 kids Safari will NOT be comfortable as it can at max take 5 adults + 2 kids and for you config a Grande Mark II or a Xylo or a Scorpio with front facing seats would be better.

[David Murx]

Originally Posted by ACM

Biggest problem in the deal is that you mention that it is a 2006 EX 2.2 dicore. 2.2 Dicore came around oct 2007 so the above statement is incorrect, this must be a 3.0 dicore. between the two the 2.2 dicore is much better and newer Safari. Also a 2006 Safari would be out of warranty. Do not go for this unless you are getting if for something like 4.xx L. Also it should be due a full suspention overhaul and a change in clutch, and timing belt change about now at 70k kms, has this been done?

I would recomend that you go in for end 2008- start 2009 2.2 Dicore with 1-2 years of extended warranty still remaning for about 6-7L in EX, GX or VX trim.

Also for a Family of 6+ 2 kids Safari will NOT be comfortable as it can at max take 5 adults + 2 kids and for you config a Grande Mark II or a Xylo or a Scorpio with front facing seats would be better.

Well, the dealer has offered me 3.75 L for this safari. So i guess if i am going for it i will have to spend another 50k. Interior needed some cleaning only and its exterior was quite good so we can say that it is well maintained. But since the reviews are not that good i think i should drop the idea of going for it. I had been looking for a scorpio only but since last around one year have not been able to found any. Anyways will have to begin my search again.