[dark.knight]

Originally Posted by reubensm

The car is old but we love it and plan to keep it as a second car, that's why we are bent on fixing it up.

Any car that reaches double digits in age will throw up some tricky issues now and then, irrespective of distance driven. This problem could've been sorted long ago but for the careless workshop guys who do not want to keep it for a day to sort through its issues. From what has been described, it seems like a battery/power supply related issue so I'll get to the basics. Using a multimeter check the voltage of the battery when engine is idling, then increase the rev count to 2000 rpm for about a minute, check the voltage again.. ideally it should be 13v or nearabouts. Also check if the alternator is making any whining noise, if it does then its bearings are worn and it'll soon be asunder.

A fading alternator may give out issues unpredictably and has to be checked over a day, so find a place with patience this time. Also recommend NOT to lubricate any part of the steering/drive assembly. These parts take in grease and not oil which can easily flow into sensitive electricals and spoil them.

[reubensm]

[quote=dark.knight;3407212]if the alternator is making any whining noise, if it does then its bearings are worn and it'll soon be asunder.

A fading alternator may give out issues unpredictably and has to be checked over a day[quote]

Thanks, will check the voltages. Also can you tell me how to check for the whining noise from the alternator. Can you give me a comparison with some usual sounds as a guideline?

[deepfusion]

Hi.

I recently bought a linea emotion diesel, used, mid showing 48,000.

The car's alternator's pulley broke off last wednesday. I had to get the alternator replaced.

Now, on Monday, I drove the car for about 15 kms. Thereafter, parked the car outside a school, in the sun.

When I cam back, about an hour later, the car started normally, but immediately fluttered and died. At the same time, the mid started showing check engine light.

The car had to be towed to Torque fiat, gurgaon.

The people there diagnosed it as failed alternator, and replaced it. But the problem persisted. Then they attached the diagnostic tool, and told me that the fault codes identified were: EGR failed, ECU fault, mass filter error.

My query is, what could the reason be for the stalling of the car after it starts absolutely fine.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by deepfusion

Then they attached the diagnostic tool, and told me that the fault codes identified were: EGR failed, ECU fault, mass filter error.

My query is, what could the reason be for the stalling of the car after it starts absolutely fine.

Can we get the codes that were registered by the ECU?

Stalling can be due low fuel supply also or a EGR valve open more than required in idle setting, air flow issue.

Anurag.

[deepfusion]

I will call them and try getting the codes.

[deepfusion]

the fault code generated by the diagnostic tool is P02146-condenser voltage present

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by deepfusion

When I cam back, about an hour later, the car started normally, but immediately fluttered and died. At the same time, the mid started showing check engine light. My query is, what could the reason be for the stalling of the car after it starts absolutely fine.

Originally Posted by deepfusion

the fault code generated by the diagnostic tool is P02146-condenser voltage present

For that code given by you, it relates to Fuel Injector circuit problem.

Attaching two screen shots of the same:

1) Searched the code for an answer in the Torque PRO App:


2) DTC Search website gave this answer:


What does Fiat have to say for this issue?

Anurag.

[deepfusion]

Hi Anurag. Thanks for deciphering the code for me.

THat was indeed helpful. Withe the information that you provided, I countered Fiat A.S.S's Gen. Mgr, to which he replied that they had tried everything, but nothing was working.

He further informed that the codes related to the ECU failure and not fuel injector circuit.

He went on to say that they had tried another linea's ecu in mine and everything was working perfectly.

So, I could not argue more.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by deepfusion

He further informed that the codes related to the ECU failure and not fuel injector circuit.

He went on to say that they had tried another linea's ecu in mine and everything was working perfectly.

If the manager is saying that the code is not of fuel injector, then what is it according to their ECU Scanner? Do you have a picture of the error that is appearing up on their screen?

And as you just said, your car worked fine with another Linea's ECU so is he trying to say that your cars ECU could need replacement? Or can their engineers solve the issue without an ECU change?

Anurag.

[deepfusion]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

If the manager is saying that the code is not of fuel injector, then what is it according to their ECU Scanner? Do you have a picture of the error that is appearing up on their screen?

And as you just said, your car worked fine with another Linea's ECU so is he trying to say that your cars ECU could need replacement? Or can their engineers solve the issue without an ECU change?

Anurag.

During the intervening period, I had a word with teh gm of the A.S.S. who told me that an ecu replacement along with some component in the key mechanism, inside the steering would need to be replaced. Cost involved-25000

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by deepfusion

Hi Anurag. Thanks for deciphering the code for me.

THat was indeed helpful. Withe the information that you provided, I countered Fiat A.S.S's Gen. Mgr, to which he replied that they had tried everything, but nothing was working.

He further informed that the codes related to the ECU failure and not fuel injector circuit.

He went on to say that they had tried another linea's ecu in mine and everything was working perfectly.

So, I could not argue more.

Remarkable story. A P2146 is a pretty common codes on diesels. What is essentially means is that one of the injectors is not working correctly. There are several possibilities, the injector itself, the wiring harness or the connectors.

It's very easy to check, you need to take the connectors of the injectors and the measure the resistance of each injector. I'm not sure for Fiat but typically resistance tends to be very low, less than 1 ohm. If you find one with a higher resistance, replace it.

Sometimes the higher resistance only manifest itself when the injectors are hot, so testing after you have just shut down the engine is advisable, but be careful, there are a lot of hot parts around!

Alternatively, it could be a fault in the harness or electrical connectors. Check for visual damage, clean all connectors, both side and reset everything and see what happens.

I am always very suspicious of mechanics that claim the ECU needs replacing. Admittedly, it does happen but it is very rare indeed for the ECU to develop problems. Its nearly always a sensor or a simple electrical fault.

So all in all, difficult to assess. I would try and have them redo the readout of the tests and demand to be present so you can see yourself what codes get thrown.

Good luck

Jeroen

[deepfusion]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

Remarkable story. A P2146 is a pretty common codes on diesels. What is essentially means is that one of the injectors is not working correctly. There are several possibilities, the injector itself, the wiring harness or the connectors.

It's very easy to check, you need to take the connectors of the injectors and the measure the resistance of each injector. I'm not sure for Fiat but typically resistance tends to be very low, less than 1 ohm. If you find one with a higher resistance, replace it.

Sometimes the higher resistance only manifest itself when the injectors are hot, so testing after you have just shut down the engine is advisable, but be careful, there are a lot of hot parts around!

Alternatively, it could be a fault in the harness or electrical connectors. Check for visual damage, clean all connectors, both side and reset everything and see what happens.

I am always very suspicious of mechanics that claim the ECU needs replacing. Admittedly, it does happen but it is very rare indeed for the ECU to develop problems. Its nearly always a sensor or a simple electrical fault.

So all in all, difficult to assess. I would try and have them redo the readout of the tests and demand to be present so you can see yourself what codes get thrown.

Good luck

Jeroen

With the inputs provided by you, I countered the gm of A.S.S. he listened to the logic, and then told me that they had replced the ecu with the ecu of another linea and the car worked fine. If what we are saying is true, the second ecu should not have worked.

Can that be the case?

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by deepfusion

With the inputs provided by you, I countered the gm of A.S.S. he listened to the logic, and then told me that they had replced the ecu with the ecu of another linea and the car worked fine. If what we are saying is true, the second ecu should not have worked.

Can that be the case?

Yes, but then again, we'll never know if there was something else going on.
Like I said, trouble shooting the original code is simple, maybe 20 minute job if that. Maybe it was just a wonky dirty connector they fixed it and decided they wanted to charge you some more.

If they did see that P2146 code, and nothing else, it would be extremely unlikely to be the ECU. Problems with the ECU throw different codes.

So, if they agree it was a P2146 agree to pay 20 minutes of work, nothing else or they need to come up with a better explanation.

Did they give you the old ECU back?

It really all depends on how trustworthy you find these guys. Are they genuine, or they taking you for a ride? hard to tell I'm afraid

Jeroen

[deepfusion]

The car is still with them. They say they have ordered for an ecu.

[black_rider]

My 2002 Santro ZipPlus, with Amaron Flo battery (30 months old, it has a 48 month warranty), has been giving me starting troubles recently. Its not really bad, but it sure is a problem that needs to be addressed soon. The car sometimes doesn't start in the first turn of ignition key. I hear a click sound (I suspect this is starter solenoid working), all lights turn off (headlights, cabin lights), but starter motor does not crank. Sometimes it takes 3-4 attempts, sometimes just one. It seems random to me. Has been like this for one or two months.

Service center guys wanted to take apart starter motor, without even checking the battery. I walked out of there. Can experts suggest me a course of action, what I should do to get to the real problem and not get fleeced in the process?