Parking puzzle

venkatrx · 31st May 2006, 13:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by angelfire

Hey buddy...why dont you extend the inclination from the road til the end of your car park...guess someone has already suggested this idea....wel the inclination wil also be reduced.....

ya, this is what i had designed :( it will eatup all of my portico....am hoping there might be something better.

speedsatya · 31st May 2006, 14:59

what about other cars ?????how do the others park their cars ??

venkatrx · 31st May 2006, 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by speedsatya

what about other cars ?????how do the others park their cars ??

this is my own house :(

looks like the inclination is too steep, for any workaournds......i am already negotiating for a paid parking space near by.

Any guys thanks for ur suggestions.

naveen, u did some great simulations......hope they might be useful in cases where the inclination is just a little bad and not hopeless like in this case.

BTW, just wondering will santro/wagon-r be able to climb this slope?

supremeBaleno · 31st May 2006, 16:10

How about posting a picture of the problem area which gives an idea of the portico, slope and road ? A picture is worth a thousand words as they say.

santosh.s · 31st May 2006, 20:38

Hi venkat,

I was tempted to solve this not-so-easy geometry puzzle... here are a couple of solutions that I think should work, assuming following:

-ground clearance = 17cm, to have some margine took just 15cm.
-wheel base = 248cm

You need to have an angle of parking surface to the ramp of 166.2 deg. or more (measured from lower side) in order to ensure that car's bottom doesn't touch the ground. Worst case is when the top of ramp is in the middle of two wheels. To be more precise, If the surface is irregular, then it is the angle between lines drawn from a point on road which comes closest to the car's body to contact patches of front and rear wheels

- as per your measurements, you have to raise the ramp by 76.2cm as you travel 254cm i.e. 30%, which creates an angle lesser than required. If you create a ramp with 166.2 deg. angle from parking place towards the road, then you will be left with an abrupt 5-6 inch tall step as you reach the road. This may work fine, but better solution is to create two slopes. An example that meets the criteria is as follows-

1. create 1st slope of 40% gradient for 1st 100cm, i.e. raise it by 40cm as you move 100cm horizongally.

2. create another slope from that point to your parking area. This will have 36.2/154= 23.5% gradient

If my judgement is correct, even with 40% slope front bumper should manage to be safe... If that is not true then above scheme won't work! I think you can figure that out quite easily by taking measurements.

Hope this helps

santosh.s · 31st May 2006, 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by venkatrx

this is my own house :(

looks like the inclination is too steep, for any workaournds......i am already negotiating for a paid parking space near by.

Any guys thanks for ur suggestions.

if my solution works, then I deserve some royalty

Quote:

naveen, u did some great simulations......hope they might be useful in cases where the inclination is just a little bad and not hopeless like in this case.

I believe he is doing 3D simulations, but thats not required, 2D should be enough

Quote:

BTW, just wondering will santro/wagon-r be able to climb this slope?

lesser the wheelbase and higher the GC, easier it becomes. these car may be able to climb this... everything has pros & cons

santosh.s · 31st May 2006, 21:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by aravindr

You need to make a temporary wooden ramp that will have a longer base say upto 200 inches from the edge of your portico. You need to keep the height to match the portico base. This will extend longer to the road. As you cannot keep this permanently, you will have to use this only when you park or take your car out.

30"x200"is 2.5 feet x 16 feet.... do you expect him to use it on temporary basis, as and when required ???

where will he keep it ?? even if there is enough space, he has to hire a crane as well, whenever he wants to park the car or take it out...

vivekiny2k · 31st May 2006, 21:13

how much is the overhang on the back in baleno, did u try reversing and parking it?

just a thought.

supremeBaleno · 1st June 2006, 10:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

how much is the overhang on the back in baleno, did u try reversing and parking it? just a thought.

@vivek, now that's a good example of out-of-the-box thinking.

But then, I guess, the Baleno's bent-downwards exhaust pipe might scrape the ramp.

santosh.s · 1st June 2006, 12:19

I too think so, because of exhaust (and its bend) the back side is equally prone to scraping as the front

I was wondering, does GC spec of a car account for such things like this bend or mud-flaps? what about load, is it at full load? whoever knows, please throw some light...

deepug · 1st June 2006, 17:08

I think GC is calculated from the lowest point of the car without load. Not sure , remember reading it some where but not able to recollect.

Deepu

santosh.s · 2nd June 2006, 00:10

just had a look at drawings in the baleno leaflet (which illustrate various dimensions) ... both front and rear bumpers protrude too much beyond wheels, its little more than 1/3rd of the wheelbase! This will make it difficult to climb from plane ground to a ramp or descending from it. Bumpers will touch the ramp as the car starts climbing or ends descending. Looks like front bumper can manage only up to 20-22% max. slope, the rear one may be slightly better. Existing 30% itself is bad enough to cause this problem (did not notice before that naveen had already seen this in his simulations). Therefore, while two slope scheme that I suggested would have solved bottom scraping problem, it makes it worser for bumpers... so it stands ruled out

santosh.s · 30th June 2006, 16:00

Venkat, by now you might have realized this, but just in case you haven't, here is my conclusion....

there are 3 problems,

- when you are about to climb the ramp, front bumpers will touch it
- when rear wheels comes near the start of the ramp, the front one will be roughly near the other end of the ramp. Rear bumpers can now touch the road.
- As you proceed, the top of the ramp will scrape the bottom in between front and rear wheels.

With different designs for the ramp, you can solve either 1st and 3rd problem. When you solve the 1st, 3rd one become worsers and similarly the other way round. But for 2nd problem, the only solution is is to either lower the top of the ramp or raise the bottom. any fancy curve is not going to help. I don't think it is practical to raise a public road, so you are left only with the other option (remove your constraint in the first place!) Unless of course you are using rest of the options like using wooden blocks or a rented parking in your neighbourhood (personally, I would hate these alternatives)

31st May 2006, 14:59	#17
speedsatya Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: bangalore/manga Posts: 3,169 Thanked: 738 Times View My Garage	what about other cars ?????how do the others park their cars ??
	() Thanks

31st May 2006, 16:10	#19
supremeBaleno Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chennai / Kochi Posts: 5,546 Thanked: 2,698 Times View My Garage	How about posting a picture of the problem area which gives an idea of the portico, slope and road ? A picture is worth a thousand words as they say.
	() Thanks

31st May 2006, 20:38	#20
santosh.s Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,077 Thanked: 70 Times View My Garage	Hi venkat, I was tempted to solve this not-so-easy geometry puzzle... here are a couple of solutions that I think should work, assuming following: -ground clearance = 17cm, to have some margine took just 15cm. -wheel base = 248cm You need to have an angle of parking surface to the ramp of 166.2 deg. or more (measured from lower side) in order to ensure that car's bottom doesn't touch the ground. Worst case is when the top of ramp is in the middle of two wheels. To be more precise, If the surface is irregular, then it is the angle between lines drawn from a point on road which comes closest to the car's body to contact patches of front and rear wheels - as per your measurements, you have to raise the ramp by 76.2cm as you travel 254cm i.e. 30%, which creates an angle lesser than required. If you create a ramp with 166.2 deg. angle from parking place towards the road, then you will be left with an abrupt 5-6 inch tall step as you reach the road. This may work fine, but better solution is to create two slopes. An example that meets the criteria is as follows- 1. create 1st slope of 40% gradient for 1st 100cm, i.e. raise it by 40cm as you move 100cm horizongally. 2. create another slope from that point to your parking area. This will have 36.2/154= 23.5% gradient If my judgement is correct, even with 40% slope front bumper should manage to be safe... If that is not true then above scheme won't work! I think you can figure that out quite easily by taking measurements. Hope this helps
	() Thanks

31st May 2006, 21:13	#23
vivekiny2k Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: cincinnati, jabalpur,chennai Posts: 1,264 Thanked: 209 Times View My Garage	how much is the overhang on the back in baleno, did u try reversing and parking it? just a thought.
	() Thanks

1st June 2006, 12:19	#25
santosh.s Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,077 Thanked: 70 Times View My Garage	I too think so, because of exhaust (and its bend) the back side is equally prone to scraping as the front I was wondering, does GC spec of a car account for such things like this bend or mud-flaps? what about load, is it at full load? whoever knows, please throw some light...
	() Thanks

1st June 2006, 17:08	#26
deepug BHPian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 92 Thanked: 26 Times	I think GC is calculated from the lowest point of the car without load. Not sure , remember reading it some where but not able to recollect. Deepu
	() Thanks

2nd June 2006, 00:10	#27
santosh.s Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,077 Thanked: 70 Times View My Garage	just had a look at drawings in the baleno leaflet (which illustrate various dimensions) ... both front and rear bumpers protrude too much beyond wheels, its little more than 1/3rd of the wheelbase! This will make it difficult to climb from plane ground to a ramp or descending from it. Bumpers will touch the ramp as the car starts climbing or ends descending. Looks like front bumper can manage only up to 20-22% max. slope, the rear one may be slightly better. Existing 30% itself is bad enough to cause this problem (did not notice before that naveen had already seen this in his simulations). Therefore, while two slope scheme that I suggested would have solved bottom scraping problem, it makes it worser for bumpers... so it stands ruled out
	() Thanks

30th June 2006, 16:00	#28
santosh.s Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,077 Thanked: 70 Times View My Garage	Venkat, by now you might have realized this, but just in case you haven't, here is my conclusion.... there are 3 problems, - when you are about to climb the ramp, front bumpers will touch it - when rear wheels comes near the start of the ramp, the front one will be roughly near the other end of the ramp. Rear bumpers can now touch the road. - As you proceed, the top of the ramp will scrape the bottom in between front and rear wheels. With different designs for the ramp, you can solve either 1st and 3rd problem. When you solve the 1st, 3rd one become worsers and similarly the other way round. But for 2nd problem, the only solution is is to either lower the top of the ramp or raise the bottom. any fancy curve is not going to help. I don't think it is practical to raise a public road, so you are left only with the other option (remove your constraint in the first place!) Unless of course you are using rest of the options like using wooden blocks or a rented parking in your neighbourhood (personally, I would hate these alternatives)
	() Thanks