[naveendhyani]

yesterday i encountered a strange problem. when i parked my car in the night & turned the knob to switch off the headlights, it did not turn off the light. i tried this a couple of times, putting it on high beam, low beam then turning off for sometime but to no avail . after fiddling with the high beam, low beam & turning on-off for about 2-3 minutes they went off. then this issue did not appear again. ny ideas what cud this be?

[iraghava]

The stalks might have developed a fault. This has also happened in my friend's car where the stalk by which you turn the headlight on/off, high-low beam etc. develops a fault and then works intermittently.

Don't know if this can be repaired as my friend had to replace the whole stalk unit to get it fixed.

[naveendhyani]

what is stalk & how much does it cost?

[DRC]

Stalk is the one you fiddled around with. . Most of the times they do not repair it as there are very small plastic parts in that and is usually a OEM part.


BTW, In my Petra, When I turn off the Ignition all the electricals, except cabin light, Hazard light and Horn, are turned off. Which means The head lights go off, Break lights and blinkers do not work with key out. I think this is a very good feature. I need not worry about finding a dead battery in the morning because I left the head lights on ( I had this situation for leaving the cabin light on though ).

I do not see this feature in many cars. Maruti cars' fuel gauge never turns off! The Merc I used to use in germany had a head light on warning beep when the key was removed, but never bothered to turn off .

Any idea why is this?

I did not want to start another thread and get warned by mods... So lets discuss both the problem together.!!!

[turbo_c]

Originally Posted by naveendhyani

yesterday i encountered a strange problem. when i parked my car in the night & turned the knob to switch off the headlights, it did not turn off the light. i tried this a couple of times, putting it on high beam, low beam then turning off for sometime but to no avail . after fiddling with the high beam, low beam & turning on-off for about 2-3 minutes they went off. then this issue did not appear again. ny ideas what cud this be?

Either the "stalk" is rotating with the switch knob or the switch knob is slipping where it is attached to it's axle. If you have the patience, you may be able to fix both problems with strategically placed drops of Fevi Quick. All the stalks buttons, levers etc. connect to a single complex "combination switch" mounted on the steering column (in my Esteem at least) ... If any of the functions fail, you have to replace the whole switch... and the darn thing costs around 2k!

Originally Posted by DRC

Break lights and blinkers do not work with key out

That can't be right! What if your car is disabled and you need to leave it on the side of the road in a dark area? The blinkers should work even with the key out!

Brake light... not sure if there is a good reason for it, but they do glow in most cars if u step on the brake with the keys out.

Originally Posted by DRC

Maruti cars' fuel gauge never turns off!

Actually, power to the gauge is shut off, but the gauge does not have a spring to pull it back to "zero" / "empty". I once had to drain my petrol tank to fix a leak (eventually ended up replacing the tank, but that's another story for another thread) and I noticed that when the tank was refitted, even without a drop of fuel in the tank, the gauge was at the 1/4 mark (where it was when I shut off the ignition). Once I turned on the ignition, it moved (slowly) to the "E" mark.

I also notice that when I refuel, the gauge only starts rising once I have turned on the ignition.

- T u r b o C -

[DRC]

Turbo C, by blinkers I meant turn indicators, and the hazard light blinkers do work with keys out.

Technically, in Maruti cars, you can leave the lights in parking position using the switch in the stalk, pull out the keys and lock the car. Lights will remain ON. But in Fiats you can't do that.
To switch on the parking lights with keys OFF, I need to press a switch on the Key hole/steering lock and then lock the steering. This ensures you can never leave the lights on when you leave the car locked unintentionally.

And yes, break lights do not work with keys off, for sure.

Not even the Music system will remain on. But can retain the real time clock. This is achived by intelligently wiring the Power and on lines on the HU.

[kpzen]

Once happened in my friends Wagon R....Fiddled with the stalk for sometime but nothing happened then just unlocked n locked the Autocop once n the lights were off....

KP

[headers]

Generally European cars have this feature of routing the electricals though the ignition coil. Japanese always have the easier way out..

[Ram]

Originally Posted by naveendhyani

yesterday i encountered a strange problem. when i parked my car in the night & turned the knob to switch off the headlights, it did not turn off the light. i tried this a couple of times, putting it on high beam, low beam then turning off for sometime but to no avail . after fiddling with the high beam, low beam & turning on-off for about 2-3 minutes they went off. then this issue did not appear again. ny ideas what cud this be?

Naveen:

You haven't mentioned as to which make, model and year of car you're talking about.

Prima facie, it does sound like the light switch has worn out to the point when it should be replaced.

I wonder how long these light switches last. And what can go wrong.

There can be electrochemical corrosion of springs and switch contacts due to high humidity and poor quality of materials used. This is commonly seen in Mahindra, old-Telco and Tempo-Force motors vehicles.

There can be electrical erosion of the switch contacts due to repeated misuse with high currents. Currents can be unbearably high if one is switching a sum total of high wattage spots/driving lights/fogs plus parking lights plus high wattage halogens without proper relays/cutouts.

Most OEM switches are made of ABS plastic with gold plated phosphor-bronze contacts which wear very well. Some Taiwanese aftermarket item are made of poorer plastic with aluminium/nickeled steel contacts. Naturally the aftermarket items will show physical, electrical and electrochemical wear earlier than the OEM ones.

The rotary on-stalk light switch in my eleven-year old Padmini S1 still works fine. And I've heard of original light switches in fifty-year old American cars still working like new. So it's clearly not age.

[naveendhyani]

hi ram, mine is a 2002 baleno. this problem happens only once in a while. i wud say once every 10 times that i use the headlight & then i fiddle with the headlight for a minute or so to switch it off.

[gigy]

naveen ,
if you are using higher wattage leadlamps without relays you will wear out the stalk much faster. in any case now it is better to replace the stalk. it will short out one fine day due the springs not having sufficient tension and heating up the contacts, and melting of the soldered joints.
get it openned and checked with a good electrician, if it can be repaired, replace springs and resolder, remove melted solder. it is advised to install a bosch relay kit in the circuit even if you have stock lamps after cleaning up the stalk to prolong the life of it.

[2fast4u]

dont worry buddy if u have little patience and little mechanical tech this is a simple thing to get fixed (do it yourself) i've done it myself on my Nissan altima.
similar problem like urs.

remove the cluster around steering column to get to the stalks.
the stalks in my case had 2 screws, get them off, the stalk is connected to a plug type power, press the small plastic lock and pull off.
now

u need to first hold the switch and know the eact movements, including the turn lights up/ down, and the rotating switch for high low beam and flash. just observe very little can be actually known to whats happening inside the cluster. but this is how i did it just to get the idea of whats happening.

check if any screws are holding on to it, unscrew.

now with a nice strong steel slider or thin knife pull up the plastic cover be very careful not to damage the the bakelite cluster, about 6 locks, so be gentle and patient.
inside this will be a nylon plastic square see the setting of this plastic square with the rotating switch as it has a notch which assist movement of the switch and should correspond to the movement within the given area of travel.

u will now see the copper connectors which actually make contact with the connections. just observe this movement of the switch and contacts and use the turn switch too to know whats happening. OBSERVE MOST IMPORTANT.

here is ur problem u will see that one of the copper connector is making contact eevn when switch is offf.

Unscrew two screws here.
use the knife again to get to the next plastic locks and pull open gently.

now u have the connectors and the contacts separate.

with ur reasoning by now u must know how much is needed and at what point to bend the connector so as to make a contact and release. do this with lots of patience and checks.

PLEASE CLEAN THIS ENTIRE AREA WITH WD40 and get the oxidised green stuff and the grime from contacts clear.

once done refix and check the contacts and release mechanism when switch is used. check all and if needed for adjustment do it again. refix and get switch together.

MAKE SURE THE TURN INDICATOR AUTO RELEASE PLASTIC CLIPS ARE LOOSE AND DO THEIR FUNCTION OF AUTO RELEASE WHEN SWITCH IS "ON".
IN ALL ABOVE PLEASE BE GENTLE IN OPENING THE BAKELITE LIDS AND THEN PRESS FIXING THEM AS THEY TEND TO SNAP OTHERWISE.
Now fix to the column connect the power and check.

saves u cool 3k for a Nissan Switch. Should be similar setup for Baleno too.
i ve done this repair on a 15 yr old siwtch and the contacts are still in excellent condition, very less sign of wear.
30 minute job in silence.
There are no springs to which u will actually come into contact in the above repair. the springs are located below the connector compartment. so dont worry.

[naveendhyani]

a big thanx to 2fast4u. i wud surely try to do this at the earliest convenience. thanx brother.

[low_bass_makker]

every thing said and done , But from my side naveen ji change the whole switch becasue these thing are made up of plastic and after some usage they become loose and thus inrepairable. so u must go for a new switch......

[2fast4u]

Naveen@ forgot to mention just below the square plastic u will see small plastic inserts which actually assist the connector to make and release contact. remove, clean and refix.

low bass maker @ since this switch has to be in use almost a 150+times a day they are really built rugged and other than the exterior compartment being made of palstic all other movements and the connector holders are made of Nylon. i very much doubt a 3 yr switch could wear off so soon.
and in my case a 15 yr old switch has signs of wear but not to the extent of deep grooves as one would expect after yrs of use.
u may be right and i am not challenging ur opinion as i ve never seen a baleno switch.