Palio 1.6 Sport Temperature doubt

moralfibre · 25th November 2006, 10:01

The temperature gauge of my Palio 1.6 reaches the halfway mark in city driving. The optimum running temperature for the engine is around 98 degree C. While on a recent trip to Alibaug we stopped for lunch after driving for about 100kms continuously and the AC blowing at full blast. The needle pointed about 1mm above the half way mark on the gauge when we stopped. After about 45 mins of break I turned on the ignition switch and was shocked to see the needle going up to 80% of the gauge. After turning the engine ON, it settled to 50%. Am I having a problem with the cooling system OR the gauge is faulty?

I have confirmed that the radiator fan is operating at both speeds and also remains ON for 1 min after the engine is shutdown as usual. The engine bay shows no signs of overheating or leakage. There is no smoke seen anywhere and there is no flaw in the performance of the engine whatsoever. The AC operates efficiently and cools the cabin without any issues. Can Palio 1.6 users tell me the exact position of the needle on the gauge when their engines come upto the optimum operating temperature please?

What should I be looking for? Please help.

Edit: My previous cars always showed the needle at 1/4th mark at optimum temp. this is my first car to point the needle halfway.

airfoil · 25th November 2006, 10:18

There may be a problem with the sensor.

I'd say the optimum operating temperature while the car is in motion is at about 1/4 of the range. Slightly higher temperatures in stop/start traffic.

Stopping the car and switching off the engine after having driven for some distance (say over 15km) sometimes pushes the needle up to 1/2 but never beyond in my experience.

I'd suggest you get it looked at.

merve_extreme · 25th November 2006, 11:19

for the palio 1.6 the optimum range is

1)with AC on it never goes above the 40% mark while standstill in traffic and is at 25% when driving.

2)with AC off and standing still in traffic the temp goes upto 55% then the fan speed 2 kicks in and lowers the temp to about 35%.while driving it is between 30-40%.

the palios cooling system is very dynamic in functioning and changes the fan behaviour acc to outside temp,ac operation and speed of driving,but it never ever goes above 60% in any circumstance.

according to me your fan speed relay has packed up,i suspect your fan speed 2 does not come in at 55%.if it does then your sensor may be damaged.

moralfibre · 25th November 2006, 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

for the palio 1.6 the optimum range is

1)with AC on it never goes above the 40% mark while standstill in traffic and is at 25% when driving.

2)with AC off and standing still in traffic the temp goes upto 55% then the fan speed 2 kicks in and lowers the temp to about 35%.while driving it is between 30-40%.

Thanks I definately have a problem. With continuous driving, the needle stills stays at half.

Quote:

the palios cooling system is very dynamic in functioning and changes the fan behaviour acc to outside temp,ac operation and speed of driving,but it never ever goes above 60% in any circumstance.

according to me your fan speed relay has packed up,i suspect your fan speed 2 does not come in at 55%.if it does then your sensor may be damaged.

The speed 2 does kick in and I have confirmed it. It sure is the sensor. Car is in warranty and I'll get it replaced.

Thanks Airfoil and Merve!

Bulleteer · 26th November 2006, 11:17

Hi,
I have exactly similar problem with GTX. But i noticed that Sometimes the fan doesnt start off after it crossed the 50% mark. And when you start the car yes it goes up to 80%, so as per below comments i think i have a problem here. Well let me get this checked in my next service.

bulleteer

moralfibre · 26th November 2006, 12:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bulleteer

Hi,
I have exactly similar problem with GTX. But i noticed that Sometimes the fan doesnt start off after it crossed the 50% mark. And when you start the car yes it goes up to 80%, so as per below comments i think i have a problem here. Well let me get this checked in my next service.

bulleteer

I spoke to an expert and he said that it could be a problem with the temperature sensor.

DRC · 26th November 2006, 13:39

I dont think it is a problem.

It happens in my car too. Normal running its about the half mark. with AC, it is less than half mark. But when you stop after a long run, it rises a bit because the water pump stops with the engine and the fan keeps running for a few seconds. This effectively brings down the temp of the coolant but the engine block with its latent heat continues to heat the coolant which is now not moving like it was before. So the coolant starts heating up further and gradually takes place vacated by the cool coolant due to the fan. Next time you switch on the key (not start the engine you will see a high reading.

However what looked unusual to me is after 45 mins it should be cool. say 5 - 10 mins my theory hold good.

moralfibre · 26th November 2006, 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC

. Next time you switch on the key (not start the engine you will see a high reading.

However what looked unusual to me is after 45 mins it should be cool. say 5 - 10 mins my theory hold good.

Next time I turn the key to ignition without cranking the engine, the temperature needle goes up to 80% BUT, the needle settles down to 50% immediately after I crank the engine.

DRC · 27th November 2006, 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Next time I turn the key to ignition without cranking the engine, the temperature needle goes up to 80% BUT, the needle settles down to 50% immediately after I crank the engine.

Exactly, dont fix anything. Perfectly normal. Enjoy your ride.

merve_extreme · 27th November 2006, 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by moralfibre

Next time I turn the key to ignition without cranking the engine, the temperature needle goes up to 80% BUT, the needle settles down to 50% immediately after I crank the engine.

as soon as u crank the engine the fan will start,does it,if so then everything is ok.actually if the engine is too hot sometimes the fan starts even if the engine is not cranked but the ignition key is moved to on position.

DRC · 28th November 2006, 02:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

as soon as u crank the engine the fan will start,does it,if so then everything is ok.actually if the engine is too hot sometimes the fan starts even if the engine is not cranked but the ignition key is moved to on position.

In a Fiat the fan will start even if the key is removed and the engine is too hot.

The point is the coolant pump is coupled to the engine which start circulating the coolant when you crank it. Other wise it becomes stagnant and rises its temp to high. Cooling happens only through cconvection f the coolant. Hence the higher temp.

moralfibre · 28th November 2006, 08:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by merve_extreme

as soon as u crank the engine the fan will start,does it,

Yes it does.

Quote:

if so then everything is ok.actually if the engine is too hot sometimes the fan starts even if the engine is not cranked but the ignition key is moved to on position.

This happens too. I sense a problem with the temperature sensor. Will get it rectified this weekend and update you guys.

Quote:

In a Fiat the fan will start even if the key is removed and the engine is too hot.

It remains ON for 1 minute after the engine is shutdown.

hydrashok · 28th November 2006, 08:18

I assume you checked to see whether there is enough coolant, right? This happened to me (Palio 1.2) a while back. The tem went up to 80% while driving and the A/C shut off by itself. When I checked, I found that the coolant level was real low. I topped it up, and the temp went back to normal, and the A/C went back to normal.

moralfibre · 28th November 2006, 08:22

Yes Hydra,
Coolant level was the first thing I checked.

merve_extreme · 28th November 2006, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRC

In a Fiat the fan will start even if the key is removed and the engine is too hot.

The point is the coolant pump is coupled to the engine which start circulating the coolant when you crank it. Other wise it becomes stagnant and rises its temp to high. Cooling happens only through cconvection f the coolant. Hence the higher temp.

no that is not what i am talking about.i know the fan remains on even if you remove the key after switching off the car.

but say you switch off the car and the fan keeps running for 1min and then stops,if after sometime say 5-10 mins you move the key to on position again and the engine is still very hot,the fan will start again without cranking the engine.

25th November 2006, 10:01	#1
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,451 Thanked: 13,971 Times	Palio 1.6 Sport Temperature doubt The temperature gauge of my Palio 1.6 reaches the halfway mark in city driving. The optimum running temperature for the engine is around 98 degree C. While on a recent trip to Alibaug we stopped for lunch after driving for about 100kms continuously and the AC blowing at full blast. The needle pointed about 1mm above the half way mark on the gauge when we stopped. After about 45 mins of break I turned on the ignition switch and was shocked to see the needle going up to 80% of the gauge. After turning the engine ON, it settled to 50%. Am I having a problem with the cooling system OR the gauge is faulty? I have confirmed that the radiator fan is operating at both speeds and also remains ON for 1 min after the engine is shutdown as usual. The engine bay shows no signs of overheating or leakage. There is no smoke seen anywhere and there is no flaw in the performance of the engine whatsoever. The AC operates efficiently and cools the cabin without any issues. Can Palio 1.6 users tell me the exact position of the needle on the gauge when their engines come upto the optimum operating temperature please? What should I be looking for? Please help. Edit: My previous cars always showed the needle at 1/4th mark at optimum temp. this is my first car to point the needle halfway. Last edited by moralfibre : 25th November 2006 at 10:03.
	() Thanks

25th November 2006, 10:18	#2
airfoil BHPian Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 318 Thanked: 81 Times	There may be a problem with the sensor. I'd say the optimum operating temperature while the car is in motion is at about 1/4 of the range. Slightly higher temperatures in stop/start traffic. Stopping the car and switching off the engine after having driven for some distance (say over 15km) sometimes pushes the needle up to 1/2 but never beyond in my experience. I'd suggest you get it looked at.
	() Thanks

25th November 2006, 11:19	#3
merve_extreme Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,359 Thanked: 18 Times View My Garage	for the palio 1.6 the optimum range is 1)with AC on it never goes above the 40% mark while standstill in traffic and is at 25% when driving. 2)with AC off and standing still in traffic the temp goes upto 55% then the fan speed 2 kicks in and lowers the temp to about 35%.while driving it is between 30-40%. the palios cooling system is very dynamic in functioning and changes the fan behaviour acc to outside temp,ac operation and speed of driving,but it never ever goes above 60% in any circumstance. according to me your fan speed relay has packed up,i suspect your fan speed 2 does not come in at 55%.if it does then your sensor may be damaged. Last edited by merve_extreme : 25th November 2006 at 11:20.
	() Thanks

26th November 2006, 11:17	#5
Bulleteer BHPian Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 27 Thanked: 0 Times	same with 1.6 GTX Hi, I have exactly similar problem with GTX. But i noticed that Sometimes the fan doesnt start off after it crossed the 50% mark. And when you start the car yes it goes up to 80%, so as per below comments i think i have a problem here. Well let me get this checked in my next service. bulleteer
	() Thanks

26th November 2006, 13:39	#7
DRC BHPian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cockpit Posts: 911 Thanked: 64 Times View My Garage	I dont think it is a problem. It happens in my car too. Normal running its about the half mark. with AC, it is less than half mark. But when you stop after a long run, it rises a bit because the water pump stops with the engine and the fan keeps running for a few seconds. This effectively brings down the temp of the coolant but the engine block with its latent heat continues to heat the coolant which is now not moving like it was before. So the coolant starts heating up further and gradually takes place vacated by the cool coolant due to the fan. Next time you switch on the key (not start the engine you will see a high reading. However what looked unusual to me is after 45 mins it should be cool. say 5 - 10 mins my theory hold good.
	() Thanks

28th November 2006, 08:18	#13
hydrashok Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: In my Office Posts: 2,528 Thanked: 17 Times View My Garage	I assume you checked to see whether there is enough coolant, right? This happened to me (Palio 1.2) a while back. The tem went up to 80% while driving and the A/C shut off by itself. When I checked, I found that the coolant level was real low. I topped it up, and the temp went back to normal, and the A/C went back to normal. Last edited by hydrashok : 28th November 2006 at 08:27.
	() Thanks

28th November 2006, 08:22	#14
moralfibre Team-BHP Support Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: MH-12 Posts: 8,451 Thanked: 13,971 Times	Yes Hydra, Coolant level was the first thing I checked.
	() Thanks