[JoshMachine]

Originally Posted by Evyas

Thank you for such an informative and well-researched and complied article. It still stands tall as a ready reckoner for people like me, even years after it was started by you. That tells you how good the information here is!

This is the reason why Team-BHP stands out for me - this level of enthusiasm and deep-diving into an issue that most car buyers would not even consider - until they are smitten by the hand of god and cry for not having read and understood the 10 Commandments!

I am humbled to read such generous praise, thanks!
Yes, the commandments are something which I have found truly useful, irrespective of the DSG variant.

could I ask you: does it make more sense to go for the DSG (with notorious Mumbai traffic) or the MT? The advantage being one can upgrade to a 1.5 TSI with MT at almost the same price for a 1.0 AT, which I didn't really found particularly exciting to drive.
---
To be honest, am a sedate driver but do a lot of cross-state highway runs, mainly Rajasthan, Goa and the south and am not very fond of the few ATs I have driven, albeit for short periods of time.

I would suggest go for the DSG, if you like it and are willing to pay the differential. Traffic or otherwise, do not bother too much as long as you respect what's inside the tranny.

To relate my own experience of the DSG, I was driving the (Vento) DSG in Pune, and believe me, the areas where I drove (Hinjewadi IT park & thereabouts) took the top spot when it came to bumper-to-bumper traffic! Did this for almost 5 years, but followed some of the good practices for moving in crawling traffic (manual / Tiptronic et al), and the DSG held its own very well.

And on the highways when you want to hustle along, the smooth shifts of the DSG will give you lot of riding comfort.

Just a suggestion - do not forget to take the maximum warranty for this piece of engineering, however beautiful it is

Originally Posted by R_R

Thank you for a terrifically informative thread, @JoshMachine. Hope my questions makes sense, my apologies if these are too basic.

Thanks a lot for your kind words
On this forum, there is nothing called basic. We all start somewhere and after spending some quality time here, we get to learn a lot!

First question: I understand that using the paddles alone, without shifting the gear lever to manual, is only a temporary measure. The DSG takes over if there are no other inputs after sometime (several seconds?). Does the same happen if the gear lever is shifted to manual? Does the DSG take over after a time gap of 10-20 seconds or does it continue to stay in manual until the driver shifts the gear lever back to automatic?

Yes, the gearbox will shift back to "D" after some time if the paddles are not being used i.e. if they are not being shifted up / down.
However, if you are using or shifting the gear lever to the manual / Tiptronic mode (which is usually into a separate dedicated slot), then the gearbox will not automatically move back to "D", come what may. It is so because the gear lever has been physically moved to that manual position.

Following from the above, my second question: if we switch to manual by sliding the gear lever physically to manual and continue using it in manual, either via the gear lever or via the paddles, will the twin clutch still anticipate and keep the next gear ready? In other words, under this condition, does the system then "rest", as the driver has indicated he/she is selecting the appropriate gear? Or does putting it on manual by sliding the gear shift not have any effect as far as the system is concerned? Say, if in manual in 3rd gear, and slightly accelerating, will the DSG keep the 4th gear ready or will it wait until the driver chooses whether to shift up to 4th or down to 2nd?

Now this is an interesting scenario.
Just to go back to basics, the Tiptronic is akin to a manual transmission in that, it allows you to shift gears when you want. The actual execution still happens like a regular dual-clutch setup.

But, from what I understand, unlike the classical DSG, the gearbox won't pre-engage the selector forks of the dual-clutch assembly in this manual mode. It follows the logic that the driver will decide which gear to shift to.

However, I believe there are some limitations or safeguards in place. If you are using the manual/Tiptronic mode and attempt to redline the tacho in a gear that is not "optimal" (lower gear), the gearbox may not allow that.

[jaysheth]

Originally Posted by jaysheth

Our Hyundai Santro Xing GLS will turn 13 year old soon and we have been very happy and satisfied with the car. We (myself and my wife) are looking to buy Hyundai i20 Asta (O) DCT as our next car because of the following reasons

A quick update: Thanks to your advices and knowledge shared (thank you @nikhilthegunner, @androdev, @buzzy_boy, @Valhalla1979 and @souvikjana83 for your replies), I have decided to stay away from Turbo Engine as well as DCT. That is, I would prefer a 4-cylinder NA Petrol hatch (over a turbo), and a non-DCT automatic (AMT is anyways a big NO for me). I even considered Hyundai N Line i20, but then Hyundai is no longer as reassuring or confidence inspiring as they were during the Santro Xing days!! Now they have launched Venue N Line Turbo (DCT variant only), and somehow all these news only make me more and more skeptical around going with "gizmos on wheels" as opposed to "reliable cars".

We really liked the Honda Jazz CVT which ticks all boxes and is a fairly safe and extremely reliable no-nonsense car (looking at tons of reviews on Team BHP). We are only apprehensive about availability of spare parts for the next decade (to 15 years), as Honda is planning to discontinue the Jazz. Do you think we should grab one while it is still being sold?

[jaysheth]

Another quick update (possibly my last post on this thread): Yesterday we booked Honda Jazz VX CVT, after a lot of consideration and research. For details (and the rationale behind choosing the Jazz), please see this post (Honda Jazz ZX CVT | Practical family city hatch!).

[hellraiser_yank]

Originally Posted by GrandTourer

Hi,
In have been driving a GT TSI for over an year now. Lately, I have been experiencing this weird action in the 'box.
Whenever I go over a bad patch of road, the 'box downshifts to 1 and is stuck there until I find a good bit of road and even then doesn't upshift until 2000 RPM.
Usually upshifts happen from 1st to 2nd around 1400 RPM in normal conditions. Also, if the road conditions are good, it stays in 2nd for the same speed. Now I understand that the 'box downshifts to 1st if it needs to crawl out of potholes, but it gets stuck even after the car moves out of the bad patch. Also, there's a slight jerk when that happens.

Is this going to be an issue going forward? Has anyone experienced the same? Lastly, do you think a workshop visit is required?

I would recommend a DSG learning reset and then observe.

steps are as follows -
1. Insert key and turn to ignition position but don't turn on the car.
2. Press accelerator pedal all the way in and hold for 20 seconds.
3. Your DSG learning pattern has been reset. Enjoy.

[vidyanand]

Originally Posted by hellraiser_yank

I would recommend a DSG learning reset and then observe.

How to do this in keyless models/car (Virtus in my case)?

[hellraiser_yank]

Originally Posted by vidyanand

How to do this in keyless models/car (Virtus in my case)?

I haven't tried in any of the keyless models.

Have you tried putting the car in acc. Mode? Push start button without the brake pedal depressed. See if that works. And I think I wrote the timing incorrectly. It's meant to be 30 seconds if I recall correctly.

[vidyanand]

Originally Posted by hellraiser_yank

I haven't tried in any of the keyless models.

Have you tried putting the car in acc. Mode? Push start button without the brake pedal depressed. See if that works. And I think I wrote the timing incorrectly. It's meant to be 30 seconds if I recall correctly.

Ok. I tried this for 20 seconds earlier and it did not change anything. Let me try next with 30 secs. Will update here.

[hellraiser_yank]

Originally Posted by hellraiser_yank

I would recommend a DSG learning reset and then observe.

steps are as follows -
1. Insert key and turn to ignition position but don't turn on the car.
2. Press accelerator pedal all the way in and hold for 20 seconds.
3. Your DSG learning pattern has been reset. Enjoy.

Some detailed observations regarding this re-learn procedure and correction in the time required for the pedal to be depressed (30 seconds NOT 20)

1. the DSG re-learn option resets the DSG shift pattern which is continuously learning based on driver input. For example, driving on hills/ghats the car learns my braking and shift pattern and holds lower gears for longer when descending to aid with engine braking, also same applies for stop and go traffic and for different drivers with different inputs. I reset every time anyone besides me drives the car for more than 10kms.

2. The other functionality that I observed is the clutch actuation and crispness of the shifts. Even though the DSG system automatically is supposed to adjust to clutch wear, doing this reset also does the same manually and my shifts are much more crisp and precise instead of the tacho needle idling slowly down when upshifting after the reset it is super crisp in the lower gears.

I welcome the experts to comment and correct wherever I may be mistaken.

[vidyanand]

Originally Posted by hellraiser_yank

It's meant to be 30 seconds if I recall correctly.

Missed updating this earlier. 30 secs worked for me and was able to see the difference. Unfortunately, the approach road to my layout is not the best so I am pretty sure, it is again learning to go back to slower upshift in those roads and trying to remain in 1st gear. will reset it next once the road is fixed, hopefully soon.

[Gotham]

Originally Posted by vidyanand

Missed updating this earlier. 30 secs worked for me and was able to see the difference. Unfortunately, the approach road to my layout is not the best so I am pretty sure, it is again learning to go back to slower upshift in those roads and trying to remain in 1st gear. will reset it next once the road is fixed, hopefully soon.

Quick question , are you using normal fuel or 95 Ron ?

[vidyanand]

Originally Posted by Gotham

Quick question , are you using normal fuel or 95 Ron ?

Initial 5 fill ups (full tank) were Normal Shell or IndianOil, but the latest fill up is RON 95 (power) from Shell.
Had few jerky shifts that was noticeable for the 1st time today on bad patch roads.

[Gotham]

Originally Posted by vidyanand

Initial 5 fill ups (full tank) were Normal Shell or IndianOil, but the latest fill up is RON 95 (power) from Shell.
Had few jerky shifts that was noticeable for the 1st time today on bad patch roads.

Thanks Vidyanand , Just to let you know Shell power is not RON 95. I had filled my first talk from Shell thinking its RON 95 but got to know later its no different from normal fuel with some additives. My 2nd tank fill was from IOC XP95 , after driving the car for 70-80 kms the engine woke up in Beast mode and car didn't feel sluggish anymore. You may want to try XP95 next time

[vidyanand]

Originally Posted by Gotham

Thanks Vidyanand , Just to let you know Shell power is not RON 95. I had filled my first talk from Shell thinking its RON 95 but got to know later its no different from normal fuel with some additives. My 2nd tank fill was from IOC XP95 , after driving the car for 70-80 kms the engine woke up in Beast mode and car didn't feel sluggish anymore. You may want to try XP95 next time

Well that's a surprise. The attendant was not able to answer but the man at the billing counter inside the shell attached store told me its 95.
Thanks for letting me know.

[Gotham]

Originally Posted by vidyanand

Well that's a surprise. The attendant was not able to answer but the man at the billing counter inside the shell attached store told me its 95.
Thanks for letting me know.

Same happened with me , they confidently lied power being 95

[harikrishnansp]

Originally Posted by JoshMachine

Somehow, I think one needs to be bit careful even if the car is in "P", given that a very significant jolt or push to the vehicle from behind might lead to the tooth of the locking pin getting broken possibly damaging the parking lock gear, with collateral damage to the output shaft of the gearbox.

Hope, I have managed to come to peace now with the above addendums

Usually the critical components are designed to be more robust. In this case, the pin will go before more critical stuff like the output shaft are damaged.

eg. - In the Maruti AMT (K12 engine), it seems to be programmed to use 2nd as its 'go to' gear. Left to its own antics, often I've found it holding second, slipping the clutch. When sanity says one should drop down to first.

The k12, atleast when mated to the swift, require only careful modulation of the clutch for a few seconds without any accelerator input while in second gear. The only scenarios that requires the first gear would be an incline or if the car is in standstill. Shifting to first and back to second would be painful in the AMT. This behaviour is justified when you look in that perspective.