[JoshMachine]

Originally Posted by theMandarin

@JoshMachine I am a bit late to thank you for consolidating all this information in one place but as they say, better late than never.

Thanks a lot, Mandarin!

Originally Posted by theMandarin

A family that owns a DSG equipped car may have multiple people using/driving the car. Taking an example, a very likely scenario would be having three drivers using the car 60%/20%/20% over a week. In such a scenario, wouldn't the DSG struggle to "learn" a driving pattern ?

Quite possibly. However, just so that we are on the same page here in terms of the "learning" bit, let me extract few statements mentioned in some of the earlier posts, such as this and this.

• There is a process called "adaptation" which essentially alters or resets the basic gear shift settings on a mechatronics unit. Here, the engineers try out a series of pre-programmed settings for creep, rpm calibration etc with a road test in various conditions, that beds in the gearbox to real-world conditions. Most of the cases, this adaption is carried out on new or replaced units.

• The technical synonym "adaptation" needs to be contextualized.
  What this probably means is that it does not actually "store" your driving patterns or behavior as such somewhere in its memory to be invoked when you press the throttle again. (we will not be surprised though if that kind of tech/AI were to actually flow down into a production, mass-scale gearbox).
  As an example, the electronic control unit in the mechanics generally will issue instructions to upshift early and move into higher gears if it senses an economical or linear throttle driver input over a period of time or running. But how soon or within how many km, that I wouldn't know for certain.
  The reverse is also true, i.e., if the driver input over an extended period of time/km running is a lot different than the pre-programmed settings for creep, kick-down tolerance, coasting etc. then the DSG may not respond as expected to the driver input.

I am sure in more upmarket cars where there is an option to have driver profiles, this can be addressed by tagging the adaptation to the specific driver profile. But to my knowledge, even this is not enabled by default in many cars which have driver profiles. Judging purely by the information gathered through YouTube, the Octavia has this option to have driver profiles but the customization is restricted to the head unit layout, colors, mirror positions etc.
Curious to hear if you and other members have some information on this.

Well, I haven't heard or come across any info where the DSG's adaptation has been customized to a specific driver profile. Atleast in a mass-produced car.

However, I feel it maybe done in some test /pre-production cars, where VW may want to carry out certain type of simulated experiments to check out the robustness of the gearbox.

[theMandarin]

Originally Posted by JoshMachine

Well, I haven't heard or come across any info where the DSG's adaptation has been customized to a specific driver profile. Atleast in a mass-produced car.

However, I feel it maybe done in some test /pre-production cars, where VW may want to carry out certain type of simulated experiments to check out the robustness of the gearbox.

I will research more on this as i feel it should be the logical next step. But for the most part, the driving modes do address this so it will be redundant to have such a personalisation. If a driver is aggressive with the throttle, he might as well always keep the sports mode selected and this customization is something that is indeed associated with the driver profile.
The following link lists the attributes covered in the driver profile: Personalisation – individual settings on demand.

Moving to a different topic, my brother jokingly said that the DSG gearboxes follow a maintenance schedule of "Replace within 30K KM or 4 Years whichever is earlier" . This is something substantiated by the anecdotal evidence we have on our forum.

It is reasonable to assume that VW must be making some silent improvements to the design since it continues to use this even in recent launches such as the Scala (assuming it is the same gearbox based on the torque specifications). In your research, what was the most recent manufacturing year for which you found reports of failures ? E.g. did you happen to find failure reports for cars sold in 2016 or newer?

[swissknife]

I have found that driving in "S" mode while in thick city traffic is better than in "D" mode. Since gear shifts happen at 3k, there are fewer gear shifts, thereby lesser work for the mechatronics. Though being in lower gears may seem to be less fuel efficient, I have seen it to be on the contrary since one may not be at high revs. Further, it also helps in lesser use of the brakes.

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by swissknife

I have found that driving in "S" mode while in thick city traffic is better than in "D" mode. Since gear shifts happen at 3k, there are fewer gear shifts, thereby lesser work for the mechatronics. Though being in lower gears may seem to be less fuel efficient, I have seen it to be on the contrary since one may not be at high revs. Further, it also helps in lesser use of the brakes.

Not a bad idea in heavy but moving traffic where you rarely get upto D4, and typically the DSG rotates between D2 & D3. S mode should definitely cut the upshifting to S3 a lot.

For near-stationary traffic I usually slip into manual (1) mode to avoid the incessant clutch-slipping in D2. Will S1 help here too?

Will try tomorrow!

[swissknife]

Originally Posted by itwasntme

Not a bad idea in heavy but moving traffic where you rarely get upto D4, and typically the DSG rotates between D2 & D3. S mode should definitely cut the upshifting to S3 a lot.

For near-stationary traffic I usually slip into manual (1) mode to avoid the incessant clutch-slipping in D2. Will S1 help here too?

Will try tomorrow!

You may stay a lot in S2, but then, even in manual, one may stay in 2nd. So, I would think it's ok.

[Rshrey22]

Here's a video from BOBA motoring channel on youtube, showcasing their VW Golf with DQ250 transmission (the cousin of the dreaded DQ200) making more than a 1000 horses and running 58psi of boost.

https://youtu.be/ekroSLF5ZJk

Imagine what would be the torque figures and the stress that the engine must be putting on the breakdown prone DQ250 transmission (although known to be more reliable than DQ200) when the car's being launched at 6000 rpms straight.

How's this possible? How might have had they modified the already complicated transmission to bear the load of that engine?

[nidhinsarath]

How can we put the DSG in learning mode? Googled my query, but there are multiple options. So I’m a bit confused. I’ve a Rapid 1.5 TDI DSG

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by nidhinsarath

How can we put the DSG in learning mode? Googled my query, but there are multiple options. So I'm a bit confused. I've a Rapid 1.5 TDI DSG

There has been a lot of debate whether the DSG truly learns, but let's say it does adapt to some extend to your driving style. As long as you keep it in Drive it does "learn" as far as I know. There is a simple procedure to reset it to its default settings.

But if you typically use your car in D it is essentially already optimized for your driving style. Do not expect huge changes, although some folks report great improvement after resetting.



Jeroen

[nidhinsarath]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

There has been a lot of debate whether the DSG truly learns, but let's say it does adapt to some extend to your driving style. As long as you keep it in Drive it does "learn" as far as I know. There is a simple procedure to reset it to its default settings.

But if you typically use your car in D it is essentially already optimized for your driving style. Do not expect huge changes, although some folks report great improvement after resetting.



Jeroen

Thanks Jeroen, but can you please explain that procedure to reset to its default setting?

[kugo_93]

A friends march 2016 polo gt tsi has crossed 80,000 kms without a issue. The car is driven pretty hard and also driven in lot of bumper to bumper traffic of thane and mumbai. Its basically used as a beater car in the family. However, the mileage covered with the dsg does pump a sigh of relief in the minds of us Dsg equipped car owners. Additionally have seen lot of rapids (2014 models and newer) done over 1 lac kms on sale on online sites.Fellow members, what is your opinion regarding the reliability concern of this wonderful gb.

[WasavaTyres]

I had acquired a pre-owned Passat DSG with 1.3 lakhs on the odo last september. Car presently has 1.5+ on the odo without any mechanical issues whatsoever ( electrical niggles are a diff story though)

DSG oil was once changed at 80,000 kms and again by me when I got it at 1.3 lakh kms.

[sgiitk]

Any idea as to why VW asked for users to switch to non-synthetic oil. Some issues, I thought you will prefer to go the synthetic from Mineral.

I will like information as to has the VW box stabilized and the imho odd switch to Mineral from Synthetic oils.

[kugo_93]

Hello sir, regarding your doubt as to why the switch to mineral oil as found on the web:- after assessing multiple mechatronic failures it was found that a certain additive in the synthetic oil would produce and deposit sulphur deposits on the electronic sensors of the mechatronic unit of the DSG box leading to short circuits due to excessive heat and ambient temperatures. As a fail safe measure the box would then disengage any drive ( forward / reverse ) thus leading to the vehicle getting stranded. This is specifically found on the dry clutch DQ200 unit in hot and humid climates where stop and go traffic would aggravate the issue further more. ( India/China/Australia etc).
Hope this clears the concern .Thank You.

[GrandTourer]

Hi,
In have been driving a GT TSI for over an year now. Lately, I have been experiencing this weird action in the 'box.
Whenever I go over a bad patch of road, the 'box downshifts to 1 and is stuck there until I find a good bit of road and even then doesn't upshift until 2000 RPM.
Usually upshifts happen from 1st to 2nd around 1400 RPM in normal conditions. Also, if the road conditions are good, it stays in 2nd for the same speed. Now I understand that the 'box downshifts to 1st if it needs to crawl out of potholes, but it gets stuck even after the car moves out of the bad patch. Also, there's a slight jerk when that happens.

Is this going to be an issue going forward? Has anyone experienced the same? Lastly, do you think a workshop visit is required?

[JoshMachine]

Originally Posted by theMandarin

In your research, what was the most recent manufacturing year for which you found reports of failures ? E.g. did you happen to find failure reports for cars sold in 2016 or newer?

Not 100% sure for newer models, sold in 2016 or later. Maybe, need to find out more.

Originally Posted by nidhinsarath

How can we put the DSG in learning mode? Googled my query, but there are multiple options. So I’m a bit confused. I’ve a Rapid 1.5 TDI DSG

I would think, based on my findings & research, it's not that easy to just "put" the DSG in learning mode . There is a specific programming that needs to be done, essentially a series of steps that kind of, reset the DSG settings.
You may want to refer to the above post #91 where I have tried to answer the concept in a relatively generic perspective.

Originally Posted by Jeroen

But if you typically use your car in D it is essentially already optimized for your driving style. Do not expect huge changes, although some folks report great improvement after resetting

Absolutely right, Jeroen!

Originally Posted by kugo_93

A friends march 2016 polo gt tsi has crossed 80,000 kms without a issue. The car is driven pretty hard and also driven in lot of bumper to bumper traffic of thane and mumbai. Its basically used as a beater car in the family. However, the mileage covered with the dsg does pump a sigh of relief in the minds of us Dsg equipped car owners. Additionally have seen lot of rapids (2014 models and newer) done over 1 lac kms on sale on online sites.Fellow members, what is your opinion regarding the reliability concern of this wonderful gb.

In terms of reliability, since the time VW made the gearbox oil change to mineral, the failure rates seem to have gone down drastically for the DQ200 plonked in Polos and Rapids.

Originally Posted by GrandTourer

Hi,
In have been driving a GT TSI for over an year now. Lately, I have been experiencing this weird action in the 'box. Whenever I go over a bad patch of road, the 'box downshifts to 1 and is stuck there until I find a good bit of road and even then doesn't upshift until 2000 RPM.
Usually upshifts happen from 1st to 2nd around 1400 RPM in normal conditions. Also, if the road conditions are good, it stays in 2nd for the same speed. Now I understand that the 'box downshifts to 1st if it needs to crawl out of potholes, but it gets stuck even after the car moves out of the bad patch. Also, there's a slight jerk when that happens.
Is this going to be an issue going forward? Has anyone experienced the same? Lastly, do you think a workshop visit is required?

I, personally, haven't experienced these scenarios actually, however the situation of the gearbox presumably remaining stuck in D1 / not upshifting relatively quickly, maybe attributed to the out-of-turn slow down (due to the pothole or the rough road patch) followed by immediate demand to upshift.

Having said this, the gearbox should be, generally speaking, able to acknowledge and reciprocate upshift or downshift demands without any noticeable drag or jerks or delays.
Too soon to trigger a workshop visit but if you witness a trend of sorts, then no harm in going to the workshop.
Hope you have bought the extended warranty.