Do premium fuels harm engines?

gemithomas · 23rd July 2007, 15:06

not sure about that coz logically If speed is 93 RON ...it is the highest RON rating fuel available nationwide (speed 97 being there only in very few outlets). With IOC shoutng out about 91octane i dont think BP would keep mum with 93 Octane.

Hope i got it right with RON and Octane being simmilar!!!

Jaggu · 23rd July 2007, 15:11

Normal speed is not 93 Ron and additives are not octane boosters, they are plain injector cleaner, carbon cleaner and stuff.

Unless specified speed 93 or 97, the octane rating will be 89 as far as i know. Speed 93 and 97 are available only in bigger cities and rest just carry Speed petrol which is 89 Ron with additives.

IOC was the first to offer 91 RON with IOC premium, but not the only one now.

91 is the safe bet for most of the regular cars sold in India since manufacturers detune to this rating or less, 93 will work in cars with higher state of tune, and 97 in absolute performance tune cars and latest imported bikes.

Otherwise using these fuels is waste of money.

To add to the above, have seen in some cars with weird knocking problem, moving to higher octane sometime helps.

ravibhat · 23rd July 2007, 15:16

Thats right Jaggu I agree your point. 91 octane is best bet for most of the Indian cars.

I have not tried 91 octane ExtraPremium yet. next time I plan for sure.

Around Vijaynagar I couldn't find good IOC Bunks. My uncle suggested me to try IOC bunk next to Tollgate vijaynagar where underpass construction work going on. He said that bunk is very good.

Regards,

Ravi.

lohithrao · 23rd July 2007, 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by swathyd

Our 1.6 manual also recommends using 91 octane. But it is not the octane doing the damage but fuel addictives used to achieve that rating. There is smoothness and silence felt when using IOC x tra premium, but i think IOC normal is also smoother. But speed is not that smooth, niether is power. So dont get fooled by initial smothness, if possible try reliance or shell. And post your feedback after filling reliance. It has done wonders( almost) in my car.

I agree here, i did get good milage.

gemithomas · 23rd July 2007, 16:07

what is the RON of Reliance petrol

Jaggu · 23rd July 2007, 16:09

Guys RON rating and additives are two different things. As far as i know none of the indian petroleum companies use additives (octane boosters rather) to increase the RON rating.

These so called additives are mixed along with the specified RON fuel.

I would prefer a higher RON petrol without any additives and use after market additives / cleaners like (System G, STP etc) for my cars. Sadly almost all premium petrols have additives in indida :(

Regarding better mileage from Reliance and Shell, i think it can have loads to do with better fuel metering system (less cheating) in their pumps than anything else.

rks · 23rd July 2007, 16:34

@Jaggu, you may be right. The BPCL website may not be up-to-date and one cannot rely on that either.

Here is another recent web disussion, dated March 2007:

Petrol in India is now 91 octane - xBhp

One poster (mshashi) makes the following claim:

Quote:

All petrol available in India has to meet BS III norms so it is 91 OCTANE..., by now it is pan-india ! that was communicated to me by IOC/BP guys. I met many petrol bunk owners/company guys etc. During the launch of SPEED 97 in Hyderabad, the entire marketing/sales team of BPCL was present and this was confirmed by them !

This guy has apparently taken the pains to contact the company officials of IOC/BP and gotten the information first-hand. So it might be true.

Jaggu · 23rd July 2007, 16:45

Yup he might be, but do check IOC site, India still sells BS II and BS III fuels in cities based on the city classification.

vnabhi · 23rd July 2007, 17:08

What fuel did you try out--Reliance or Shell?
Question is for lothirao.

gemithomas · 23rd July 2007, 17:17

there are 11 BSIII cities in india. Over here the normal unleaded petrol if 91 Octane BINGO!!!!!!! SO i guess all you lucky ones need not pay for the "Premium" tag.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/a...ow/1026422.cms

"BS-II takes over the whole of India except 11 select cities that are under BS-III reign. Along with the four major metros — National Capital Region (NCR), Chennai, Mumbai, and Kolkata — cities like Ahmedabad, Bangalore, Hyderabad & Secunderabad, Kanpur, Pune, Agra & Surat too will go the BS-III way. The rest of India, meanwhile, will drive into the BS-II territory on All Fools Day"

Here is another confirmation from SIAM

Indian Vehicle Emission Norms | Safety Standards | Emission Regulations by Auto Industry in India.

lohithrao · 23rd July 2007, 17:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by vnabhi

What fuel did you try out--Reliance or Shell?
Question is for lothirao.

Used "reliance".

Surprisingly never got great milage when i used shell (both Car aswel bikes)

vishnuvijay · 23rd July 2007, 17:58

i didn't find any difference in performance when i switched to speed and extra premium for my old 1.3 OHC Exi. i didn't check the fuel efficiency then. i think this 'increase in power', 'increase in fuel economy' are all a placebo effect.

bottle · 24th July 2007, 20:03

i mailed shell and found out that both regular and premium are 91 octane, remember someone else saying the same also earlier

has anyone tried out speed 97 ? its an insane 11 bucks more expensive than regular speed in chennai

sreenivass · 24th July 2007, 20:28

I did mail shell an inquiry in the past. They came back to me saying both are 91 Octane, Quoted as follows

For a car where the vehicle manufacturer has recommended 87 RON you can use either Shell Super or Shell unleaded. Both of these fuels are 91 Octane and are dosed with Shell proprietary additives.

Shell super unleaded helps clean out deposits which can lead to better responsiveness and improved fuel economy.
Shell unleaded contains special formulation Shell additives which help protect your engine.

We recommend using Shell Super as the additives used aid engine performance over time.

bottle · 25th July 2007, 00:00

thanks for that sreenivass, so which fuel are you currently using for your petra ? i have experiemented with reliance shell and hp and hardly find any differnce.. find shell regular gives slightly less mileage but have only used one tank so too early to judge

23rd July 2007, 15:06	#91
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	not sure about that coz logically If speed is 93 RON ...it is the highest RON rating fuel available nationwide (speed 97 being there only in very few outlets). With IOC shoutng out about 91octane i dont think BP would keep mum with 93 Octane. Hope i got it right with RON and Octane being simmilar!!!
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 15:11	#92
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	Normal speed is not 93 Ron and additives are not octane boosters, they are plain injector cleaner, carbon cleaner and stuff. Unless specified speed 93 or 97, the octane rating will be 89 as far as i know. Speed 93 and 97 are available only in bigger cities and rest just carry Speed petrol which is 89 Ron with additives. IOC was the first to offer 91 RON with IOC premium, but not the only one now. 91 is the safe bet for most of the regular cars sold in India since manufacturers detune to this rating or less, 93 will work in cars with higher state of tune, and 97 in absolute performance tune cars and latest imported bikes. Otherwise using these fuels is waste of money. To add to the above, have seen in some cars with weird knocking problem, moving to higher octane sometime helps. Last edited by Jaggu : 23rd July 2007 at 15:23.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 15:16	#93
ravibhat Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,256 Thanked: 37 Times View My Garage	Thats right Jaggu I agree your point. 91 octane is best bet for most of the Indian cars. I have not tried 91 octane ExtraPremium yet. next time I plan for sure. Around Vijaynagar I couldn't find good IOC Bunks. My uncle suggested me to try IOC bunk next to Tollgate vijaynagar where underpass construction work going on. He said that bunk is very good. Regards, Ravi. Last edited by ravibhat : 23rd July 2007 at 15:18.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 16:07	#95
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	what is the RON of Reliance petrol
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 16:09	#96
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	Guys RON rating and additives are two different things. As far as i know none of the indian petroleum companies use additives (octane boosters rather) to increase the RON rating. These so called additives are mixed along with the specified RON fuel. I would prefer a higher RON petrol without any additives and use after market additives / cleaners like (System G, STP etc) for my cars. Sadly almost all premium petrols have additives in indida :( Regarding better mileage from Reliance and Shell, i think it can have loads to do with better fuel metering system (less cheating) in their pumps than anything else.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 16:45	#98
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	Yup he might be, but do check IOC site, India still sells BS II and BS III fuels in cities based on the city classification.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 17:08	#99
vnabhi Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2007 Location: DC -> DC Posts: 5,958 Thanked: 2,393 Times View My Garage	What fuel did you try out--Reliance or Shell? Question is for lothirao. Last edited by vnabhi : 23rd July 2007 at 17:08. Reason: Quote message in reply did not work
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23rd July 2007, 17:17	#100
gemithomas Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,366 Thanked: 143 Times View My Garage	there are 11 BSIII cities in india. Over here the normal unleaded petrol if 91 Octane BINGO!!!!!!! SO i guess all you lucky ones need not pay for the "Premium" tag. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/a...ow/1026422.cms "BS-II takes over the whole of India except 11 select cities that are under BS-III reign. Along with the four major metros — National Capital Region (NCR), Chennai, Mumbai, and Kolkata — cities like Ahmedabad, Bangalore, Hyderabad & Secunderabad, Kanpur, Pune, Agra & Surat too will go the BS-III way. The rest of India, meanwhile, will drive into the BS-II territory on All Fools Day" Here is another confirmation from SIAM Indian Vehicle Emission Norms \| Safety Standards \| Emission Regulations by Auto Industry in India. Last edited by gemithomas : 23rd July 2007 at 17:19.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2007, 17:58	#102
vishnuvijay BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Cochin Posts: 173 Thanked: Once	i didn't find any difference in performance when i switched to speed and extra premium for my old 1.3 OHC Exi. i didn't check the fuel efficiency then. i think this 'increase in power', 'increase in fuel economy' are all a placebo effect.
	() Thanks

24th July 2007, 20:03	#103
bottle Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,634 Thanked: 274 Times View My Garage	i mailed shell and found out that both regular and premium are 91 octane, remember someone else saying the same also earlier has anyone tried out speed 97 ? its an insane 11 bucks more expensive than regular speed in chennai
	() Thanks

24th July 2007, 20:28	#104
sreenivass BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Bangalore India Posts: 932 Thanked: 44 Times View My Garage	Yes bottle I did mail shell an inquiry in the past. They came back to me saying both are 91 Octane, Quoted as follows For a car where the vehicle manufacturer has recommended 87 RON you can use either Shell Super or Shell unleaded. Both of these fuels are 91 Octane and are dosed with Shell proprietary additives. Shell super unleaded helps clean out deposits which can lead to better responsiveness and improved fuel economy. Shell unleaded contains special formulation Shell additives which help protect your engine. We recommend using Shell Super as the additives used aid engine performance over time. Last edited by sreenivass : 24th July 2007 at 20:30.
	() Thanks

25th July 2007, 00:00	#105
bottle Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chennai Posts: 1,634 Thanked: 274 Times View My Garage	thanks for that sreenivass, so which fuel are you currently using for your petra ? i have experiemented with reliance shell and hp and hardly find any differnce.. find shell regular gives slightly less mileage but have only used one tank so too early to judge
	() Thanks