[libranof1987]

I don't think there are any issues related to quality of materials or manufacturing processes when it comes to cars in India; we are fairly on par with global standards.

The two most significant factors:
1) Condition of roads: just imagine the abused we put the car through when we drive around our country

2) Quality of maintenance: car upkeep has among the least priority when it comes to household expenses. Add to that, questionable capabilities of authorized service centers. Worse, several vehicle owners' propensity to go for cheaper/non-recommended parts.

We have enough examples of decade old cars running like they're only a few years old - all through proper maintenance. We can't control the road conditions, but sure can ensure the cars are mechanically sound at all times.

[benbsb29]

This topic is something i have thought about too, and my conclusions are as below:

1.) Disciplined traffic in general means lesser nicks and scrapes. As we know vehicles with collect greater damages tend to get further neglected, and get relegated to being battlescars.
2.) Better condition of roads in general mean the vehicle is subject to lesser abuse during the daily commutes.
3.) Greater focus on policing means cars have to meet minimum requirements as far as driveability and maintenance goes.
4.) Not everyone is a learner on the said cars, which means the user has undergone better training prior to handling the vehicle, translating to better usage patterns.

Originally Posted by BeingHuman

Furthermore it is mandatory in many countries to have well maintained vehicles, like in Australia they have yearly checks to make vehicle roadworthy.

Not sure of the other states, but the state in which i currently reside in Australia do not require the vehicle to undergo roadworthy checks annually. A roadworthy certificate is however required when selling the vehicle. However, a roadworthy doesnt really mean much, if you were to focus on the vehicle condition. Roadworthy just refers to lights, brakes, tyres etc, and not the physical condition as such.

[avisidhu]

Since the comparison was made with Thailand which isn't exactly a First world country, I agree with BeingHuman's point: the sales leader there seems to be Toyota. And if a super reliable, tough as nails brand has the pole position, everyone else will play catch up accordingly.

Contrast this with India. So many manufacturers tried to crack the market, but we stuck with the Maruti rattle machines which age poorly. And so the likes of Honda too took the same path, diluting their brand but ensuring sales. Heck, even Toyota couldn't leverage its legendary status below the MUV/SUV segment.

Besides, the average price point (or dominant segment) in Thailand also seems to be around 1.5 to 2 times higher than that of India.

Another reason: even if maintained well, the exteriors of our cars certainly age much faster, due to lack of parking and constant exposure to heat and dust. The dust specially is a phenomena unique to our region (owing to shorter duration annual rain spell).

Combine with everything else already mentioned, this is no country for old cars (pun intended ).

PS: There are small exceptions though, Chandigarh being one. Very good infrastructure and less maddening traffic ensures most cars are in decent nick, and so a Chd number plate commands a noticeable premium in the resale market.

[MSAneesh]

We humble folks in Bangalore probably would put it in this order:

1. Speed Breakers, we call it H U M P S here; and BHPians like to call 'em very interesting names
2. Moon Craters/on road swimming pools. Pretty much all roads have 'em here. It could be by GAIL, BWSSB, Bescom, Monsoons or even BMTC
3. Traffic.. Going beyond 2nd in peak hour traffic is an average Bangaloreans' dream. Burn the clutch, burn the brakepads and burn your heads!!
4. After sales Workmanship. Pretty shoddy servicing, maintenance and repairs. I have seen it with Maruti and Hyundai and pretty sure the rest also would not differ much
5. Hum log....add how many more speed breakers you want, you can't break my speed types, zig-zag, vroom...bang!
6. Bikers(I'll get some brickbats for this). But bikers do contribute to a lot of dents and scratches on cars

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by benbsb29

Not sure of the other states, but the state in which i currently reside in Australia do not require the vehicle to undergo roadworthy checks annually. A roadworthy certificate is however required when selling the vehicle. However, a roadworthy doesnt really mean much, if you were to focus on the vehicle condition. Roadworthy just refers to lights, brakes, tyres etc, and not the physical condition as such.

The RwC or Certificate of Roadworthiness is quite standard across Australia, and the State of Victoria also requires RwC for every sale of the vehicle, or if the cops send you a notice that your vehicle is obviously defective (blown lights, bad tyres, scratched windscreen, etc.). The testing can be done by a Licensed Vehicle Tester operating from a nominated garage.

I'm attaching the document that states all the conditions that a vehicle must meet to get a RwC - for those concerned with the fitness of their cars, it is worthwhile to go through the document and check whether their cars comply with the same. Once repair work is carried out to comply with these conditions, I'm sure such a vehicle, even in India, would not age as fast as other vehicles of similar vintage. So it boils down to inadequate maintenance, and not ageing faster just because of the car being driven in India.

VicRoads RwC.pdf

[wildsdi5530]

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Do they really age faster? Or are they just maintained far more poorly? The latter, I believe. Maintaining any car well is an expensive proposition, and in this cost-conscious kitna deti hai country, we love to save money even as we keep driving on and on.

Actually I'm talking about the well maintained cars. Or to put it better the over maintained ones where parts are replaced frequently as per the SA's advice. Does frequent periodic maintenance age the car faster than just a 15 min oil change. Which costs much lower than a full PMS?

Originally Posted by avisidhu

Besides, the average price point (or dominant segment) in Thailand also seems to be around 1.5 to 2 times higher than that of India.

The cost of the Innova Crysta is 10 MB roughly 22 lakhs. and the fortunes about 20 MB roughly 44 lakhs. The Mini Cooper starts at 22 MB with most features that are optional here. So I'd say costs are on par or even cheaper.

[SS-Traveller]

Originally Posted by wildsdi5530

Actually I'm talking about the well maintained cars. Or to put it better the over maintained ones where parts are replaced frequently as per the SA's advice. Does frequent periodic maintenance age the car faster than just a 15 min oil change. Which costs much lower than a full PMS?

There is no such thing as a well-maintained bad car. Yet, in the interest of money-making, most mechanics (even those in authorized service centres) in India do a shoddy job, or put in low quality parts, or charge without actually carrying out the job at all. That is not the case in many other countries, and therefore, a much older car with high mileage in those countries is a better-running car than in India.

Let me describe a few incidents with my daughter's 2006 Toyota Yaris in Melbourne, now with over 250,000 km on the odo.

1. We bought the car in 2017 from a dealer who sold it to us with the RwC done by them. Within a few days, the light stalk went kaput - the headlamps would turn on but the tail lamps and front side lamps would not. This is a situation which would invite a defective vehicle notice from the cops, and a RwC is valid for a month - so the dealer as well as his friend the Licensed Vehicle Tester would be liable for the defect. On approaching the dealer, he not only replaced the stalk switch, but for the 2 days he kept the car, he gave me a loaner car. That's being honest!

2. The car went in for an airbag replacement (free of cost, recall for Takata airbags) to a nearby Toyota dealer. The driver's foot mat was not the standard size with its retaining holes to engage pins on the floor and prevent the mat sliding under the pedals (I'd tied it down with a zip tie). This mat was taken out and put into the boot - and a used but still very serviceable mat was put in, with a note that this was done for safety reasons. No charge.

3. I took in the car for an oil change and service last November. Told the mechanic (a middle-aged well-educated gentleman who is also an expert in repairing automatic transmissions - though this car has a manual 'box). I wanted a thorough check of the car since it would go on to a lift for the first time since we bought it. Apart from the oil change, he found the spark plugs to be worn out. I wanted a look at the suspension, the brake pads, the drive belts, engine mounts. We agreed to pay for his time (instead of the 15-minute oil change it took us 1 hour 45 minutes to scrutinize everything), but went through every component and system there is (BTW, the labour charge is 90 AUD per hour). He knew by then that I know my cars. But he was more than happy to let me check too, and his verdict was that this is a Yaris that has been better maintained than any other car he had seen for its age and mileage.

Can we expect anything similar in India? The answer is a resounding no. I haven't met a mechanic here who is educated, in the last 20 years. Therefore, properly well-maintained cars age a lot less than those with a lot of money spent on them ineffectively.

[blackasta]

Having bought, driven , maintained and sold two decade old cars in different parts of USA, I believe it has to do with

1. road condition - potholes etc
2. Traffic condition - dense traffic with lower than optimal running conditions
3. Parts tolerance - parts designed at lower costs to keep prices lower fail sooner
4. Average cost of parts
5. Knowledgeable owners - who don't skimp on essentials
6. Knowledgeable mechanics - who know what to fix
7. Weather conditions - dusty, scratch inducing weather giving the paintjob a weary look

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

I haven't met a mechanic here who is educated, in the last 20 years.

A well educated mechanic would price himself out of the market, or have the tendency to open his own place with a few people under him who eventually end up doing the job. There's simply not enough connoisseurs to keep him in business as a hands on specialist commanding higher rate than the normal market.

[wildsdi5530]

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

it would go on to a lift for the first time since we bought it.

Our cars here go on a lift every 6 months. Parts are opened up at every opportunity. Service labour charges are generally about 1% of the car cost. And if you don't get it serviced from the ASS, you lose your warranty, which is too short anyway. (Honda offers a 7 yrs/ 1,00,000 kms)

[for_cars1]

Originally Posted by batish

....

It depends on the caretaker of the vehicle. Even here, cabs still exist which are in tip-top condition.

..
It all depends on how the car is maintained. These things have a long, reliable shelf life if maintained and driven properly.

Originally Posted by Rajeevraj

... I am sure all cars in Bangalore are aging at a super fast rate.

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

...

At the end, I think it is all down to people making the effort to maintain their cars. Of course- maintaining a 10 year old Indica is very tough, but a 10 year old City should be very easy to maintain.

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Do they really age faster? Or are they just maintained far more poorly? The latter, I believe.

You'll find many fine examples of taxis/cabs in India that are well maintained and easily last a million KMs especially Innovas.
From conversations with a cabbies, the one thing they diligently do is the mandatory engine oil change every 5000 or 10000 Kms as prescribed depending on the model.

Japanese cars in general tend to be designed from the grounds up towards long term reliability. If maintained well, they certainly age very slowly. For Eg: the 800 which we owned was as good as new even after 19 years! When we finally sold it, the buyer (someone known) was also super happy with the car and used it for nearly a decade (although we know it was not maintained the same way like we did). The Palio was in a 'new' condition when sold after 12 years to another deserving buyer/enthusiast. It was always serviced at authorized centers only once a year (or every 7500 Kms as prescribed)

Its a myth that cars in Bangalore age faster. In fact they will age much slower if maintained well because Bangalore has low humidity factor unlike some coastal towns and cities where cars literally turn into rust boxes quite easily. Most of the cars we have used have been in Bangalore. Despite the traffic, I've never had to replace a clutch before 90K in one case or 1+L KM in most cases, it all depends on how the clutch is used- without clutch riding, ensuring minimum slippage, engaging the right gear for the right speed, etc.).

There are so many folks I've come across who procrastinate service, get them done at local workshops rather than at A.S.S or worst, some delay service until the car breaks down. Any negligence shown in ensuring proper service will greatly accelerate the ageing of the car.

[greenhorn]

Contrary point of view here
I'm in a town in connecticut, and the roads here are not singnificantly better than india - the freeways are the same quality as that of the NH's in india, the main roads in town are actually worse than the average main road in chennai or TVM, but the smaller roads are better than the local roads in india.

Cars here age very fast - the salt they use in winter eats up the bodies, and its hard to find older cars in good cosmetic condition. Bodywork is mega expensive here, so especially in the poorer neighbourhoods, you see a lot of cars with such majorly jugaad repairs, that no bribe would be big enough for an indian cop to let you drive that on indian roads.

[haisaikat]

The ageing factor is actually an apparent observation. Ideally ageing is cosmetics and internal wear and tear combined. As someone has rightly pointed out that average price of a new car in US is way more than that in India and people in US can afford that because of the better parities between income and expenditure as compared to that in India. Otherwise it is cheaper to maintain a car in India than in US because of cheaper labour rates and comparatively lesser sophistication in cars prevalent in India (not all segments).

And yes, as someone has once again rightly pointed out that average car owners here in India are less inclined to invest in maintenance that are more of long term value and focus more on short term gains.

I am not sure though whether cars in India have any disadvantage of running in higher humidity and heat than any average car in the USA, but with respect to bad roads, I believe Indian driver handle and avoid potholes better than average driver in the US from my own experience.

It is true that cars in India due to traffic and road conditions that include lack of road manners of fellow drivers do have lesser distance traveled per engine revolution as compared to that in US and hence distance wise wear and tear is higher.

[Motard_Blr]

Cars in India age faster. Yes, but with caveats.

In my opinion, factors contributing to faster aging in India:

- traffic conditions in cities. Very dense, very low speed, lots of stop and go. Engines running at low speed, high loads and high temperatures, limited cooling, lots of fatigue loading on the drivetrain. This, in my opinion is the most important factor.

- cars designed and manufactured in small budgets are not going to have the best quality or the most durable parts. Most cars below 10 lakhs are built to tight cost budgets to ensure that margins are reasonable.

- poor environment. Potholes, badly designed road humps, flooding in monsoon, high dust levels, harsh sun.

I don't consider maintenance practices, maintenance costs and driving practices as significant factors because
- most people seem to stick to authorised service centres for service. Maybe because they don't want to risk having their cars damaged by independent mechanics because of doubtful competency or suspect business practices.

- maintenance cost is increasing but still not too bad considering it's just 1 service per year for most people. Refer to the previous point on my reasoning.

- Even well trained drivers in other countries need not necessarily be mechanically sympathetic. I have seen all sorts in many countries and we Indians are no different.

All other things being equal, cars in India age faster mostly because of how they are used. It can't be helped because we can't control traffic, road conditions, etc. So we just have to live with it

[kiku007]

Originally Posted by libranof1987

I don't think there are any issues related to quality of materials or manufacturing processes when it comes to cars in India; we are fairly on par with global standards.

Not really.

We are quite aware of the difference between cars made by Ford, Maruti, Renaut-Nissan for their domestic and export markets from the SAME manufacturing facility.

The pre-facelift Ecosport was considered to have decent interior quality in India. But the car received really bad feedback in the U.K for its poor quality interiors.

And I've heard quite often about the difference in quality of parts produced by the vendors. They are made to last for certain years, operating cycles, miles etc. The cost is directly proportional to the longevity. Considering the cost consciousness in India and the lack of customer protective laws, it's obvious what happens.

If you aren't convinced, then look at the standard factory warranty (Time and mileage) of cars in India and abroad.

[invidious]

I'd reckon it is because of "engine time". The amount of time your engine is doing duty for a 50,000 km run in India, it would probably be doing duty for anywhere between 100,000 to 150,000 km if not more in a developed country or a country with significantly superior infrastructure.