[veyron1]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Eh? Are you sure?

Yup. Just take our Indian models, for example.

Originally Posted by rohitbagai

Looks like TATA Indica or sumo

Close, but nope. Here's a hint- this particular engine is touted to be one of the most reliable ones on the market. And yes, it's diesel.

[nitrous]

I think its a Qualis' engine!

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by veyron1

Yup. Just take our Indian models, for example.

Tata indica has a timing belt, not a timing chain.
Which model are you talking about.

[sbasak]

Most petrol engines run chains, whereas diesels run belts.

AFAIK very few cars nowadays use chains! For example, Alto & Accent petrol models use belts only.

[v1p3r]

AFAIK, Balenos, Swifts, Esteems, Zens, OHCs all use belts.

[vishnugs]

The Swift Diesel DDiS 1.3 DOHC Engine is completely chain driven. They claim the advantages of

- No replacement of belts for the entire engine life
- No variation in timings that can come with belts
- Very less chances for catastrophic failures

I think Fiat has done a good job of giving us the best of both the worlds, goodness of the chain drive and also the smoothness as good as belt drive. But to a person who watches things keen, mild sound of the chain drive can be noted when Swift's bonnet is opened, well, its good enough.

[veyron1]

@nitrous: Bingo!

Actually, I had the original M800 and some others in mind when I quoted the chain driven petrols. Was thinking of other cars, which I realised-aren't here. I just calculated that 95% of ALL Indian production cars are running belt drives, including the Mercs.

Apologies.

[iMakk]

Hi - I have been surveying the market to purchase a car and am kind of close to finalising an SX4. One of the things that the salesman mentioned as a part of my technical due diligence of the car is that the M16A engine of the car has a timing chain instead of a timing belt.

This confuses me a bit coz chain technology is an outdated technology. Why would Maruti go back to a 20-year old technology? So the questions are:
1. Whether the engine actually has a chain instead of a belt
2. What is the advantage they are seeking with a chain, if at all there is one

May be some SX4 owner can look through the owner's manual and refer the page on periodic maintainence chart and advise if it says Timing Belt or Timing Chain - this trypically is to be inspected every 50K Kms and will find a mention in the owners manual.

Thanks much!

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[im_srini]

Yes, I too remember reading somewhere that the M-series Suzuki engines use timing chains instead of belts.

[aka_iitd]

Originally Posted by im_srini

Yes, I too remember reading somewhere that the M-series Suzuki engines use timing chains instead of belts.

I own SX4 but i feel it is a belt as i face some problem of chrrrr sound when it starts moving after rest of 8 to 10 hrs . I need to get that corrected.

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by aka_iitd

I own SX4 but i feel it is a belt as i face some problem of chrrrr sound when it starts moving after rest of 8 to 10 hrs . I need to get that corrected.

Hey, aka_iitd, in your case it is not the timing belt making that sound but the alternator/AC drive belt.
Timing belts are allowed ZERO slip!

[arunforu1]

Somebody mentioned, valves crashing with piston after timing-belt snapping.

I guess keeping minimum clearance between, "Max-Valve travel & Piston TDC" must be taken care of while designing the Engine. Then how can a belt snap off cause that?

Considering worst case: Belt snaps off & leaves can-shaft in such a position that one of the valve is stuck at max-open position & due to momentum of crankshaft Piston comes at TDC (before engine halts), then there must be a designed clearance for this.

At the moment I dont have any authentic information on this as I dont design engines, but will ask very competent person of engine design. In my opinion engines cant be designed so silly. And acheiving high compression ratio by sacrificing a basic input is a no-no in design world.

Please comment if some body from engine design is reading this.

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by arunforu1

I guess keeping minimum clearance between, "Max-Valve travel & Piston TDC" must be taken care of while designing the Engine. Then how can a belt snap off cause that?

Hey, Arun, while I'm not an engine designer, I do have experience in the field.
For high performance the clearance volumes are so small that it is not possible to leave the kind of margins that you consider so basic.
Which is why an engine with a timing chain is inherently superior from this POV. Gears are even better.

In all fairness, a timing belt is not supposed to break randomly! That you might have friends who've had to suffer this fate only highlights poor maintenance and/or very poor manufacturing quality controls.
The least you'd expect a timing belt to last would be 60,000 kms. And it ought not to sever before at least 80,000 or so!

[1self]

Originally Posted by anupmathur

The least you'd expect a timing belt to last would be 60,000 kms. And it ought not to sever before at least 80,000 or so!

It is not just the kilometers covered....it is also the number of years the belt has been in place....most people tend to forget that....the heating/ cooling cycles does take a toll on the material of the belt....it is after all made of rubber!!

I remember a A.S.S. service advisor telling me that timing belts in Hyundai vehicles need to be changed after 60000 kms or 4 years, whichever comes first.

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by 1self

It is not just the kilometers covered....it is also the number of years the belt has been in place....

Of course you're right 1self!
For cars that do very low mileage, the TIME factor becomes dominant.

And this is so true of most maintenence jobs - it's kms OR time based, whichever comes first!