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-   -   Which is more effective Turbocharger or Supercharger ? (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/technical-stuff/2184-more-effective-turbocharger-supercharger-4.html)

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 05:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather (Post 445478)
Are you sure fitting all this takes less than 2 hours..or were you talking about the supercharger alone?? i am confused here.

Godfather

Hehe, dont be confused, just read the post again...

Quote:

Originally Posted by v1p3r
Bro, you're telling me he is running boost and hasn't upgraded fuel pump and injectors, I would call him a little shortsighted but ok. If you're telling me he is running enough boost to get a 15 second time, and not running an intercooler, I wouldn't say that's very smart. Especially in Chennai. Have you seen it? I don't think we are referring to the same car, in any case.

I have put down what I was told. Anyways, you might want to speak to the tuner or the owner directly, I can give you their contact numbers, PM me if youd like.

Quote:

Originally Posted by v1p3r
As you learn more about definitions in general, you will realise that any aftermarket parts are considered modifications. Like that guy who ran a 10.xx in his Z06, with a stock engine bay and only upgraded tyres. And 11.xx in factory spec. If he says airfilter is modification, I believe him..

Sorry, Ive never read the definition of external modifications, pardon my ignorance. I would like to hear from you...if you may!

Godfather 23rd May 2007 05:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 445439)
Hehe, dude you gotta do your home work again! There are various sizes of SC's available in the market and they can be made to fit in any car, I repeat any car!!! Just to suffice, there is a SC'd vtec in chennai running JR supercharger which is capable of running quarter miles in under 15secs :) on absolutely stock internals and zero external mods!

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 445475)
By external modification I meant intake manifold mod, injector upgrade, ignition coil upgrade, fuel/oil/water pump upgrade, intercooler, ecu upgrade etc And yeah, As you learn more about tuning, you will realize that bigger airfilters are no more considered "MODIFICATIONs"

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 445483)
Hehe, dont be confused, just read the post again...

How do u expect me to be sane after reading this???
First you tell me that some car is running a SC and does a 1/4 mile in 15 odd seconds on absolutely stock internals and zero external mods..

then you go and give what all external mods are required.. How is he running an SC(whatever brand that is) as a daily drive without any mods..
I completely agree with v1p3r..how is he running the car without any mods and without ruining the conrods, or rings under repeated high-stress applications????:confused: .

Someone has definately played a prank on you.there is no way this car is going to have a stock engine..

Godfather

mclaren1885 23rd May 2007 08:34

Either that car is producing 20 bhp more than stock seeing the way there is no upgraded fuel pump, injectors, conrods or the likes or the owner is lying through his teeth :D . These days you cant believe anyone. Too many people claiming my car is stock while running sweet mods.

pawan 23rd May 2007 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 445446)
And you my friend, the reason why most big/long blocks use superchargers are coz they produce enormous amounts of torque hence the parasitic losses while running a SC is negligible!!!And dont forget the ease of install/maintenance. Its only when the engine isnt producing enough torque that people dont have an option than to go in for TC's taking all the pain it takes to make and maintain the installation, temperature issues et al.

thanks for explaining godfather had stated that the power required and also mostly used on muscle cars and few pony cars.

but this is not the case when they are looking for high hp cars like the new gen z06, srt 10,stang gt all these cars put above 900 bhp and are preferred to twin turbos and not sc even though in na form these cars have bucket loads of torque sitting with them.

these cars which i m talking about are lingenfelter,heffener,Hennessey,Pure Power Motorsports etc..

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather (Post 445486)
How do u expect me to be sane after reading this???
First you tell me that some car is running a SC and does a 1/4 mile in 15 odd seconds on absolutely stock internals and zero external mods..

then you go and give what all external mods are required..

Bro, thats why I askd you to read my post again... Pls refrain from asking questions before you read the posts well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather (Post 445486)
How is he running an SC(whatever brand that is) as a daily drive without any mods..

Ask him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather (Post 445486)
I completely agree with v1p3r..how is he running the car without any mods and without ruining the conrods, or rings under repeated high-stress applications????:confused: .

Just another Honda...I guess:p


Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather (Post 445486)
there is no way this car is going to have a stock engine..

Like the way you said an Indian vtec cannot drive a supercharger is it??LOLzzz

Im afraid I couldnot strip the car to see what its running inside so I took the tuners words for it. I am not interested in performing a credibility check anyways...coz some people simply are trustworthy, that might be news for you.LOL!!!

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawan (Post 445520)
thanks for explaining godfather had stated that the power required and also mostly used on muscle cars and few pony cars.

but this is not the case when they are looking for high hp cars like the new gen z06, srt 10,stang gt all these cars put above 900 bhp and are preferred to twin turbos and not sc even though in na form these cars have bucket loads of torque sitting with them.

these cars which i m talking about are lingenfelter,heffener,Hennessey,Pure Power Motorsports etc..


Read my 31st post 5th line, you should get your answer!

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 20:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclaren1885 (Post 445509)
Either that car is producing 20 bhp more than stock seeing the way there is no upgraded fuel pump, injectors, conrods or the likes or the owner is lying through his teeth :D .

I dont have anthing upgraded that you have mentioned, but I promise you my car is easily 20bhp more than stock. Get a dyno, Il prove it to you:)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mclaren1885 (Post 445509)
These days you cant believe anyone. Too many people claiming my car is stock while running sweet mods.

Guess you forgot some cars come quick straight from the factory!

pawan 23rd May 2007 21:02

but this doesnt seem to be the case of top fuel dagsters. ill tell you why.

1.the turbo can reach its limit very soon.(the sc used take 1500 hp to move)

2.belt driven turbine can always push harder.

3.the sc is a 14-71 type roots sc.

4.46 pounds of boost is used at full throttle imagine the lag of the turbo.

5.You could make a turbo topfuel, but it would be very hard, expensive, unreliable, and extremely dangerous. Not to mention much slower.

pawan 23rd May 2007 21:13

regarding the vtec what type of supercharger is it using is it roots,twin screw or centrifugal.

mclaren1885 23rd May 2007 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 446329)
I dont have anthing upgraded that you have mentioned, but I promise you my car is easily 20bhp more than stock. Get a dyno, Il prove it to you:)



Guess you forgot some cars come quick straight from the factory!

I was talking about the SCed Vtec ritesh not yours. As you said if he is running just a street setup without upgraded internals there is a doubt that it will clock low 15's. Yes, I wish I could get a dyno though. Is the car brown in colour? With red stanley seats?

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawan (Post 446366)
regarding the vtec what type of supercharger is it using is it roots,twin screw or centrifugal.

Roots type mate.


Funny cars and top fuels are a total different game mate. There again the SC's come into play due to some very similar reasons you and I have mentioned below...


Quote:

Originally Posted by mclaren1885
I was talking about the SCed Vtec ritesh not yours. As you said if he is running just a street setup without upgraded internals there is a doubt that it will clock low 15's. Yes, I wish I could get a dyno though. Is the car brown in colour? With red stanley seats?.

No I guess you mentioned the car wouldnt be more than 20bhps without those external mods mentioned hence I quoted my car as an example, which doesnt have anything and without the SC its easily producing 20 additional horses easily... and also coz above that the connecting rods would bend etc as per you!

No, thats not the car you are mentioning.

Originally Posted by Godfather
I completely agree with v1p3r..how is he running the car without any mods and without ruining the conrods, or rings under repeated high-stress applications????:confused: .


FYI, the fastest car in india in 1.6L FI class runs stock pistons and connecting rods!!!


pawan 23rd May 2007 21:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 446376)
Roots type mate.


Funny cars and top fuels are a total different game mate. There again the SC's come into play due to some very similar reasons you and I have mentioned below...

so its roots type they produce low range and also is he still running the stock intake manifold since these sc dont compress the air inside the sc like turbos but compress the air at the intake manifold.
wonder why he used and not twin screw because they become really hot.

The Wolf 23rd May 2007 21:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawan (Post 446383)
so its roots type they produce low range

Very true. But I was told that its some hybrid types, not sure what!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawan (Post 446383)
and also is he still running the stock intake manifold since these sc dont compress the air inside the sc like turbos but compress the air at the intake manifold.
wonder why he used and not twin screw because they become really hot.

Agreed. May be price and availability for D15 concerns!!!

pawan 23rd May 2007 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 446394)
Very true. But I was told that its some hybrid types, not sure what!!!

just googled it an this is what i found hope this helps:

Traditional roots blower design is old engineering, and admittedly is not very efficient, but engines designs from that era were not very efficient either. As engines have improved over the years so has roots supercharger design. The Magna Charger, Inc.Eaton supercharger is a hybrid-roots blower pump, with substantial design improvements. The rotors have a unique involute lobe shape and are engineered to a specific l ratio. Each rotor has been twisted 60 degrees to form a helix. The two counter rotating rotors have three lobes, which intermesh during operation. These twisted rotors, along with specially designed inlet and outlet port geometry, seal timing, and axial air flow help to reduce pressure variations resulting in a smooth discharge of air and a low level of noise during operation. This arrangement significantly improves efficiency over traditional roots superchargers and reaches a volumetric efficiency near 98%. Magna Charger, Inc. applications have an adiabatic efficiency that stays above the 50% mark over the full operating range of the engine, from 2000 to 6000 rpm.

Magna Charger, Inc. - Frequently Asked Questions

from 2000 - 6000 is really good.some thing like a twin screw low and mid range.

v1p3r 23rd May 2007 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf (Post 446376)
FYI, the fastest car in india in 1.6L FI class runs stock pistons and connecting rods!!!

But he is not hitting his 75 shot of nitrous every day, is he?


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