Problem With The Engine Rpm In Palio 1.6 After Lpg Conversion

HAFI · 8th April 2007, 21:36

hey,

i had recently installed an LPG kit for my FIAT Palio 1.6.It was realy a difficult job to get the right mixture(a part of the LPG kit which controls the gas flow into the air intake pipe)kit since the engine being so powerfull.

After the install there seems to be a problem with the rpm of the engine...when the RPM goes high(say above 3000) it comes down slowly...and if we are at higher speeds,the rpm doesnt go down as it usualy does...it goes down very slowly.But it behaves normaly when converted to petrol...i now have to keep on pressing the clutch until the RPM goes down...the engine continously keeps on roaring as rpm stays high for a long time...

I went and had a talk with the people who fitted in the LPG kit.The guy told me that the sensor(one which controls the air intake and rpm ) is damaged and have to be replaced.But when i went to the FIAT authorized service staion,the people over there told that there is no problem with the sensor(they did not even check it) and if it shows problem with LPG ,it will definilty show problem with petrol..

But the guy who fitted the LPG argues that it wound show any problem with petrol because when we give the acclereation the injector injects fuel and when not given it wount inject fuel and hence the RPM goes down eventually and in petrol we cannot notice this change even if the sensor is damaged(I also feel that he is right).

I happen to see one more trouble now...the the RPM doesnt go up when the A/C is on(both in petrol and LPG)..Normally the RPM should go up so that it can balance the load of the A/C..It doesnt do so..and the engine knocks when the A/C is on.....and now there is a starting trouble too(both in petrol and LPG)...i have to press the accelerator initialy while starting the engine as the initial RPM while starting the engine is too low and the engine goes off if accelerator not given..

Some say that LPG kit cannot be fitted to 1.6..and no one suggests LPG for a 1.6...

All the techies out here please help me as iam in a confusion what had gone wrong with my car...should i remove the LPG kit or is it the sensor which causes the problem.. i still feel that the sensor must have damaged during the LPG fitment as the air intake pipe had to be removed and the mixture had to be fitted and refitted again(had to change the mixture many times as it dint make up with the 100bhp engine and atlast had fitted the mixture for a lancer petrol engine) as there is no specific mixture for a 1.6...

Guys please do help me on this....And is it true that an LPG kit cannot be fitted into a 1.6(disaster for me if it is a yes)...has anyone over here fitted in an LPG for their 1.6..if yes please do share in your views in here as it would be a great help for me..

HAFI

mail4ajo · 9th April 2007, 10:58

There is nothing like LPG cannot be fitted on 1.6L engine. People have even done on cars like Optra and NHC. I sense that the installer has fixed the wrong kit on your car possibly the one used on 1.2L.

Can you check the rating of the Vaporiser? I am not exactly sure of the rating, but it has be higher than the one used for less powered cars.

swathyd · 9th April 2007, 11:43

Which brand you are using for 1.6 ?

passionpurple · 13th August 2010, 19:02

hi guys,
car- palio 1.2L petrol 6 yrs old. 80000kms done, also lpg kit added

problem-- i sent my car for routine service at the local tata service center. when I received the car, she behaved very strangely- very sluggish acceleration, top speed limited to 100kmph, rpm in neutral limitel to 4500-5000 rpm when floored(all tis on petrol mode), when put on lpg the car stalls instantly.

i dont know the technical stuff very well, but I know my car well- she used to reach 6500rpm red line easily on both petrol and lpg and reached 140kmph with ease. please help with this issue.
PS- the company mechs don`t understand the problem and they`ve given up.

Psycho · 13th August 2010, 19:31

Please go back and get a compression check done and also check the state of the plugs.

aargee · 13th August 2010, 22:57

Also check if there're any misfiring, like, you don't feel that you get the power evenly. If that's the case, check the distributor as well as ignition coils.

drpullockaran · 13th August 2010, 23:19

Check your fuel filter and then the pressure available at the fuel pump outlet.
The guys at tata have probably given your fuel pump or ECU to their friends car.

Going to

TATA with a FIAT is like committing HARA KIRI.

pranavt · 14th August 2010, 02:15

Check the throttle body and IACV. Could be a sticking throttle plate and a clogged IACV.

RedMM340 · 14th August 2010, 21:14

Hafi,
Why are you messing up a perfectly nice engine like the Palio 1.6 with an LPG kit? This car's only plus point is that 1.6 DOHC 16V engine, so why do you want to turn it into a 1.2 by converting to LPG?

Just get rid of the LPG kit.

If you cant live with the fuel consumption, sell it and get a 1.2 petrol, or diesel version. Better yet get an Alto 800 @ 20 km/l.

passionpurple · 15th August 2010, 02:45

thanks lots guys.. will do as per your advice. will get all those things checked.

and I don`t think that the lpg kit has anything to do with my trouble. it`s just a co incident that my car has one.. guess it`ll come back to life as soon as the engine rpm problem is fixed.

please tell if you guys think of more things that need to be done.. will educate my mech about those..

pranavt · 15th August 2010, 06:53

Get the throttle cable lubricated while you're at it.

passionpurple · 28th October 2010, 11:15

hi guys I had mentioned about my engine rpm problem on both petrol and lpg(not revving more than 5000rpm). went to a local repair shop who seems to be famous here(town called Davangere karnataka). this guy PUT SOME RUBBER STUFFING IN TO THE AIR INTAKE and this prevented air from entering the engine. funny treatment but it totally worked. the car is as good as new and revs uptill red line happily.
so now I know that my low revving problem was caused by the fuelling problem in both petrol and lpg( not totally sure though, gurus help out)

car was fine till now running on lpg. since yesterday, the old revving problem resurfaced.. the rubber stuffing is still in place exactly as before.
Q1) how was this problem fixed?
Q2) now what should I tell my mech to do? (he has installed 100's of lpg kits but has no knowledge how things work) there are no more mechs in this town and i'm very busy till 2011.

help

bhp_maniac · 28th October 2010, 11:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by passionpurple

hi guys I had mentioned about my engine rpm problem on both petrol and lpg(not revving more than 5000rpm). went to a local repair shop who seems to be famous here(town called Davangere karnataka). this guy PUT SOME RUBBER STUFFING IN TO THE AIR INTAKE and this prevented air from entering the engine. funny treatment but it totally worked. the car is as good as new and revs uptill red line happily.
so now I know that my low revving problem was caused by the fuelling problem in both petrol and lpg( not totally sure though, gurus help out)

car was fine till now running on lpg. since yesterday, the old revving problem resurfaced.. the rubber stuffing is still in place exactly as before.
Q1) how was this problem fixed?
Q2) now what should I tell my mech to do? (he has installed 100's of lpg kits but has no knowledge how things work) there are no more mechs in this town and i'm very busy till 2011.

help

Putting rubber inside intake is normally done by LPG guys to limit the air entering the engine and not preventing air from entering. This treatment is normally done to avoid misfiring on LPG. I've seen quiet a good number of installers doing it. But I am not sure how it solved your revving issue. May be some sensor is going crazy. One question is, whether rev limiter coming into action at around 5000 rpm or is it just not revving beyond 5000?

passionpurple · 29th October 2010, 14:36

my car revs like normal till it reaches 5ooo rpm and later stops revving beyoud it.. as if the fuel is not enough or some thing. this has also decreased the acceleration and top speed.

passionpurple · 30th October 2010, 08:59

Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT post one-liners that add little or no informational value to the thread. We need your co-operation to maintain the overall quality of this forum.

Please read our rules before proceeding any further.

8th April 2007, 21:36	#1
HAFI BANNED Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: cochin Posts: 296 Thanked: 0 Times	Problem With The Engine Rpm In Palio 1.6 After Lpg Conversion hey, i had recently installed an LPG kit for my FIAT Palio 1.6.It was realy a difficult job to get the right mixture(a part of the LPG kit which controls the gas flow into the air intake pipe)kit since the engine being so powerfull. After the install there seems to be a problem with the rpm of the engine...when the RPM goes high(say above 3000) it comes down slowly...and if we are at higher speeds,the rpm doesnt go down as it usualy does...it goes down very slowly.But it behaves normaly when converted to petrol...i now have to keep on pressing the clutch until the RPM goes down...the engine continously keeps on roaring as rpm stays high for a long time... I went and had a talk with the people who fitted in the LPG kit.The guy told me that the sensor(one which controls the air intake and rpm ) is damaged and have to be replaced.But when i went to the FIAT authorized service staion,the people over there told that there is no problem with the sensor(they did not even check it) and if it shows problem with LPG ,it will definilty show problem with petrol.. But the guy who fitted the LPG argues that it wound show any problem with petrol because when we give the acclereation the injector injects fuel and when not given it wount inject fuel and hence the RPM goes down eventually and in petrol we cannot notice this change even if the sensor is damaged(I also feel that he is right). I happen to see one more trouble now...the the RPM doesnt go up when the A/C is on(both in petrol and LPG)..Normally the RPM should go up so that it can balance the load of the A/C..It doesnt do so..and the engine knocks when the A/C is on.....and now there is a starting trouble too(both in petrol and LPG)...i have to press the accelerator initialy while starting the engine as the initial RPM while starting the engine is too low and the engine goes off if accelerator not given.. Some say that LPG kit cannot be fitted to 1.6..and no one suggests LPG for a 1.6... All the techies out here please help me as iam in a confusion what had gone wrong with my car...should i remove the LPG kit or is it the sensor which causes the problem.. i still feel that the sensor must have damaged during the LPG fitment as the air intake pipe had to be removed and the mixture had to be fitted and refitted again(had to change the mixture many times as it dint make up with the 100bhp engine and atlast had fitted the mixture for a lancer petrol engine) as there is no specific mixture for a 1.6... Guys please do help me on this....And is it true that an LPG kit cannot be fitted into a 1.6(disaster for me if it is a yes)...has anyone over here fitted in an LPG for their 1.6..if yes please do share in your views in here as it would be a great help for me.. HAFI
	() Thanks

9th April 2007, 10:58	#2
mail4ajo Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 1,957 Thanked: 331 Times View My Garage	There is nothing like LPG cannot be fitted on 1.6L engine. People have even done on cars like Optra and NHC. I sense that the installer has fixed the wrong kit on your car possibly the one used on 1.2L. Can you check the rating of the Vaporiser? I am not exactly sure of the rating, but it has be higher than the one used for less powered cars.
	() Thanks

9th April 2007, 11:43	#3
swathyd BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: thiruvananthapuram Posts: 774 Thanked: 25 Times	Which brand you are using for 1.6 ?
	() Thanks

13th August 2010, 19:02	#4
passionpurple BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: vasco, goa Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	Palio 1.2 - Engine rpm limited, help needed hi guys, car- palio 1.2L petrol 6 yrs old. 80000kms done, also lpg kit added problem-- i sent my car for routine service at the local tata service center. when I received the car, she behaved very strangely- very sluggish acceleration, top speed limited to 100kmph, rpm in neutral limitel to 4500-5000 rpm when floored(all tis on petrol mode), when put on lpg the car stalls instantly. i dont know the technical stuff very well, but I know my car well- she used to reach 6500rpm red line easily on both petrol and lpg and reached 140kmph with ease. please help with this issue. PS- the company mechs don`t understand the problem and they`ve given up.
	() Thanks

13th August 2010, 19:31	#5
Psycho Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,043 Thanked: 110 Times View My Garage	Please go back and get a compression check done and also check the state of the plugs.
	() Thanks

13th August 2010, 22:57	#6
aargee Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: TSTN Posts: 6,236 Thanked: 9,640 Times	Also check if there're any misfiring, like, you don't feel that you get the power evenly. If that's the case, check the distributor as well as ignition coils.
	() Thanks

13th August 2010, 23:19	#7
drpullockaran BHPian Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ERNAKULAM Posts: 962 Thanked: 385 Times	The thugs at TATA have done it again. Check your fuel filter and then the pressure available at the fuel pump outlet. The guys at tata have probably given your fuel pump or ECU to their friends car. Going to TATA with a FIAT is like committing HARA KIRI.
	() Thanks

14th August 2010, 02:15	#8
pranavt Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2008 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,682 Thanked: 641 Times View My Garage	Check the throttle body and IACV. Could be a sticking throttle plate and a clogged IACV.
	() Thanks

14th August 2010, 21:14	#9
RedMM340 BHPian Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: on the move Posts: 457 Thanked: 34 Times	Hafi, Why are you messing up a perfectly nice engine like the Palio 1.6 with an LPG kit? This car's only plus point is that 1.6 DOHC 16V engine, so why do you want to turn it into a 1.2 by converting to LPG? Just get rid of the LPG kit. If you cant live with the fuel consumption, sell it and get a 1.2 petrol, or diesel version. Better yet get an Alto 800 @ 20 km/l.
	() Thanks

15th August 2010, 02:45	#10
passionpurple BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: vasco, goa Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	thanks lots guys.. will do as per your advice. will get all those things checked. and I don`t think that the lpg kit has anything to do with my trouble. it`s just a co incident that my car has one.. guess it`ll come back to life as soon as the engine rpm problem is fixed. please tell if you guys think of more things that need to be done.. will educate my mech about those.. Last edited by passionpurple : 15th August 2010 at 02:48.
	() Thanks

15th August 2010, 06:53	#11
pranavt Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2008 Location: Mumbai Posts: 1,682 Thanked: 641 Times View My Garage	Get the throttle cable lubricated while you're at it.
	() Thanks

28th October 2010, 11:15	#12
passionpurple BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: vasco, goa Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	one problem sorted out.. hi guys I had mentioned about my engine rpm problem on both petrol and lpg(not revving more than 5000rpm). went to a local repair shop who seems to be famous here(town called Davangere karnataka). this guy PUT SOME RUBBER STUFFING IN TO THE AIR INTAKE and this prevented air from entering the engine. funny treatment but it totally worked. the car is as good as new and revs uptill red line happily. so now I know that my low revving problem was caused by the fuelling problem in both petrol and lpg( not totally sure though, gurus help out) car was fine till now running on lpg. since yesterday, the old revving problem resurfaced.. the rubber stuffing is still in place exactly as before. Q1) how was this problem fixed? Q2) now what should I tell my mech to do? (he has installed 100's of lpg kits but has no knowledge how things work) there are no more mechs in this town and i'm very busy till 2011. help
	() Thanks

29th October 2010, 14:36	#14
passionpurple BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: vasco, goa Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	my car revs like normal till it reaches 5ooo rpm and later stops revving beyoud it.. as if the fuel is not enough or some thing. this has also decreased the acceleration and top speed.
	() Thanks

30th October 2010, 08:59	#15
passionpurple BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: vasco, goa Posts: 44 Thanked: 0 Times	Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT post one-liners that add little or no informational value to the thread. We need your co-operation to maintain the overall quality of this forum. Please read our rules before proceeding any further. Last edited by GTO : 1st November 2010 at 12:39.
	() Thanks $Received Infraction$