Team-BHP > Technical Stuff


Reply
  Search this Thread
65,781 views
Old 12th February 2021, 10:40   #61
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: mumbai
Posts: 2,135
Thanked: 2,997 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Thanks to Saurabh Akhilesh Shukla for sending this information in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other
A couple of observations:

Why does the underbody look so clean in the images? As if it's taken right off the production line or a visit to the Workshop with a full wash?

If the bolt had indeed fallen off and the driver continued his drive, the tank should have scrapped road undulations and over speed breakers and potholes. However the tank is sparkling clean with no road debri or dents.

The image showing the screw hole shows a clean area with no damage/cuts or abrasions. Almost like if the screw/bolt is removed and the tank is hanging for the image.

Sorry, but these images look like they have been staged to make a point.
apachelongbow is offline   (5) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 13:54   #62
Senior - BHPian
 
giri1.8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Chennai
Posts: 1,760
Thanked: 4,712 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post

Sorry, but these images look like they have been staged to make a point.
What point was the owner trying to make? Does that mean owner took his 20L rupee car to some workshop and carefully removed the bolts from the underbody and wash it to make sure it looks good in pics, take it out with the fuel tank hanging and click pics?

Sounds like lot of effort to me to convey whatever point he was trying to make.
giri1.8 is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 13:55   #63
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Trivandrum
Posts: 1,749
Thanked: 3,204 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

We should not be criticising Tata for this. After all they were focusing on producing GNCAP 5 star rated cars. In the process some "bolt" engineering was compromised.

Perhaps GNCAP should include a test for this as well.

Terrible! I loved the Harrier but news like this just leave a very bad taste and you just do not want to take a chance. If they are serious they should launch a serious fact finding mission on what causes this to happen. We read about Hyundai alternator bolts shearing. But fuel tanks are a fire hazard and as such the seriousness cannot be stated enough. A couple of years we had a long distance bus catch fire after being hit by a truck on the highway and few people lost their lives.

Drive on,
Shibu
shibujp is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 14:16   #64
BHPian
 
prakash_ajp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 783
Thanked: 1,790 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

How often have we seen this happen? Very rarely do we see an important part of the engine not fastened properly. My guess is, as apachelongbow and someone else pointed out earlier, may be the car went for an under-body coating or something and an untrained technician left a bolt loose. Unlike something like this happening in a factory, this happening in a workshop is lot more plausible and believable to me.
prakash_ajp is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 15:13   #65
BHPian
 
Night Raven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Kottayam
Posts: 191
Thanked: 847 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

May be a little off topic but I have had a somewhat similar experience in our Tata nano in 2012 or so. The car was under a year old, and was the only car in our household that time. We were driving to visit our grandparents who live about 45kms away. My father was driving. About 4-5 kms after starting we both noticed some weird metal clicking noise coming out from the front left wheel well. We stopped thinking something might be stuck to the tyre or may be we got a flat tyre but didn’t see anything on inspection. Started driving again and the sound was getting too much to ignore, so we slowed down and moved to the edge of the road trying to park in a safe place. Out of some instinct I peaked out of the window to have a look at the wheel and it was unmistakably wobbling. We quickly parked & this time I noticed that two of the wheel nuts were almost out
To this day we haven’t figured out how that happened.

Last edited by Night Raven : 12th February 2021 at 15:18. Reason: Spellcheck
Night Raven is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 15:38   #66
Senior - BHPian
 
shancz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Ranchi
Posts: 1,938
Thanked: 5,311 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
1. Why does the underbody look so clean in the images? As if it's taken right off the production line or a visit to the Workshop with a full wash?

2. If the bolt had indeed fallen off and the driver continued his drive, the tank should have scrapped road undulations and over speed breakers and potholes. However the tank is sparkling clean with no road debri or dents.

3. Sorry, but these images look like they have been staged to make a point.
1. The vehicle was serviced 20 days prior to the incident. If not driven much or if an undercoat was done its possible. We're waiting for more information I guess.

2. It didn't make contact most likely as it's still a few cms off ground and if the road was even, less likelihood of a strike.
A zoomed pic, can see debris, possible scratches, hope it helps :
2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car-screenshot_20210212152744.png

3. Disasgee to start with.
I think its due to loose bolts most likely related to the undercoat process.
But let's wait for further updates.

Last edited by shancz : 12th February 2021 at 15:44. Reason: grammar
shancz is offline   (4) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 16:20   #67
BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 66
Thanked: 68 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Wow! That is some genius fuel tank design and layout - how it is bolted on. Underside of the car is most prone to damage and on top, if you keep critical elements such as the fuel tank mount exposed, then that is the definition of a poor design.

I've read about old Lanicas had such poor design issues. If I am not wrong, the Lancia Gamma had a problem of fuel spilling onto the engine when the steering was at full lock, which would cause the engine to blow up! Understandably back then, designing a car with limited resources was tough. But in today's day and age, with all the computer assisted support available for design and build, it's a shame if still such poor designs exist.

Last edited by Aditya : 15th February 2021 at 05:01. Reason: Punctuation, typos, language
raghu.bramha is offline   Received Infraction
Old 12th February 2021, 17:02   #68
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: mumbai
Posts: 2,135
Thanked: 2,997 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by shancz View Post
1. The vehicle was serviced 20 days prior to the incident. If not driven much or if an undercoat was done its possible. We're waiting for more information I guess.

2. It didn't make contact most likely as it's still a few cms off ground and if the road was even, less likelihood of a strike.
A zoomed pic, can see debris, possible scratches, hope it helps :
Attachment 2120965

3. Disasgee to start with.
I think its due to loose bolts most likely related to the undercoat process.
But let's wait for further updates.
If the underbody coat was done, I'm not sure if they would touch any bolts/fasteners, since it should only be a spray on process.
If you zoom on the whole image, you can see similar marks on the chassis, wheel arch components, most likely being dried mud that had splashed on. However there is no clear scratch/drag marks on the tank surface. May be the driver was alert enough to have stopped the moment the bolt sheared off, and hence there was no damage as such. However with one bolt off, there is no way the tank will remain suspended a few cms in the air, because a 40/50 liter tank weighs atleast 20/30 kgs even when partially full. Swinging on one bolt, the other side free, it should simply fall off to the ground especially from a moving vehicle. Also a shear will damage the bolt eye (hole) in the chassis/subframe.
Moreover how can one know that his fuel tank has seperated from the car when driving until he hears a grinding noise, some passer by points out, or the car throws a low fuel warning or check engine light?
But as you said, let's wait until we have more facts. It hopefully applies to the jumping the gun types as well, who are rushing to blame Tata motors.

Last edited by apachelongbow : 12th February 2021 at 17:08.
apachelongbow is offline   (6) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 17:35   #69
Senior - BHPian
 
shancz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Ranchi
Posts: 1,938
Thanked: 5,311 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
1. If the underbody coat was done, I'm not sure if they would touch any bolts/fasteners, since it should only be a spray on process.

2. Moreover how can one know that his fuel tank has seperated from the car when driving until he hears a grinding noise,

3. But as you said, let's wait until we have more facts. It hopefully applies to the jumping the gun types as well, who are rushing to blame Tata motors.
1. That's what it appears to me, check my first post (2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car), so waiting for updates.

2. He mentioned that he felt something weird, not really a sound, I can understand that as I have felt something weird, only to stop and find my luggage hanging down almost touching the ground because the bungee slipped from the hook. But just talking about the the weird feeling here.

3. Exactly, equally wrong to blame anyone here without further updates. Since the issue is quite serious and TML vehicle/service is involved they can get to the bottom of this and then we shall have an update.

Hopefully soon

Last edited by shancz : 12th February 2021 at 17:38. Reason: updated info
shancz is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 12th February 2021, 19:34   #70
BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 138
Thanked: 664 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

This is scary and indeed very dangerous. However this looks like some unprofessional mechanic who has loosen the tank bolt for some reason (mostly for anti rust coating) and forgot to tighten it back. This could've happened to any manufacturer but TATA became a victim here.
This needs further analysis and investigation. Until then I think we shouldn't prejudge tata and put entire blame on them.
Kashi053 is offline  
Old 12th February 2021, 20:08   #71
Senior - BHPian
 
Sebring's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Dubai/Bengaluru
Posts: 3,550
Thanked: 11,033 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

I can see some abrasions in that screw hole. Look closely
Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
The image showing the screw hole shows a clean area with no damage/cuts or abrasions. Almost like if the screw/bolt is removed and the tank is hanging for the image. Sorry, but these images look like they have been staged to make a point.
Attached Images
 
Sebring is online now   (2) Thanks
Old 13th February 2021, 01:01   #72
BHPian
 
Neversaygbye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Calcutta
Posts: 359
Thanked: 1,372 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Even if we give Tata the benefit of doubt till the time we get to know the cause of this issue, the fact remains that the way the fuel tank has been secured is poor design. And this too in a car based on Land Rover's famous D8 architecture.

I'm really disappointed with Tata here. One of my friends is considering getting the Harrier and I am wondering whether I should discourage him from getting it. The problem is that I absolutely LOVE the Harrier's futuristic design but design flaws such as this one are potentially life threatening.

Anyway, will be following this thread to see how Tata handles this - typically I have seen from my own experience that their customer care is quite responsive. What are they saying in this case? Radio silence like a Hyundai or Kia is hardly going to help the brand shed its (somewhat unjustified) perception of poor reliability.
Neversaygbye is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 13th February 2021, 11:39   #73
BHPian
 
huntrz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 87
Thanked: 150 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

This reminds me of one of my friend whose brand new XUV 500 was making some khat khat noise intermittently. After a long diagnosis and follow up from mahindra and with Mahindra sending its own engineers down to workshop it turned out to be a missing bolt holding body and chasis. Begs me to wonder is it something specific to the work culture in indian manufacturers? I have often seen labourers and carpenters cutting corners while working with nut bolts and screws. This happening with cars implies no quality control over what workers are doing.
huntrz is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 13th February 2021, 11:49   #74
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Kosfactor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: COK\BLR\MYS
Posts: 3,589
Thanked: 10,110 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by huntrz View Post
This reminds me of one of my friend whose brand new XUV 500 was making some khat khat noise intermittently. After a long diagnosis and follow up from mahindra and with Mahindra sending its own engineers down to workshop it turned out to be a missing bolt holding body and chasis.
XUV is unibody there is no separate chassis. The big bolts underneath usually hold the engine cradle assembly.
Kosfactor is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 13th February 2021, 12:09   #75
BHPian
 
huntrz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 87
Thanked: 150 Times
Re: 2000-km run Tata Harrier | Fuel tank bolts missing, dangerously hanging below the car

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kosfactor View Post
XUV is unibody there is no separate chassis. The big bolts underneath usually hold the engine cradle assembly.
I knew it coming. I am not good with technical terms chasis, suspension all sound same to me. The missing bolt was in the rear and was holding another moving part. I hope you get the idea.
huntrz is offline  
Reply

Most Viewed
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks