[Ragul]

This is a case of negligence or ASC error. You have full right to demand a free replacement or drag them to court for it.

[GTO]

Flood damage is like cancer for the car, and water will reach areas where no mechanic's hand ever will. Repairing a flood damage car is a big mystery. Let's not forget that it would be in the service center's interest to replace the gearbox originally (higher billing). If I was in your place, I would just go ahead and pay the remaining part of that 1 lakh rupee bill. Write it off as a "bad luck" loss. When you own a 40-lakh car, you have to be open to cutting such cheques unexpectedly.

One thing I have realised is that, after severe flood damage, a car is NEVER ever the same. My poor Sunny was submerged in floods 4 years ago. Despite being mechanically simple, having almost zero gizmos and going to one of the best workshops in Bombay, it has frankly been ruined by that flood damage. Problems and issues related to the floods came up even 1.xx year after the floods! Even the driving experience has been very poor after this incident. The next time any car of mine gets flood-damaged badly, it will be repaired and sold off (sole exception = a beater car or my Jeep which seems to love floods).

This is an annual occurrence at my place because we live right on the beach. Currently getting stacked parking & parking ramps installed:

[A.G.]

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

I sent a mail to Anurag and immediately responded that he will look into it and get back to me.

For sure he will help in resolving the issue.

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

In the meanwhile, this is the quote I got for the upcoming repair work.

Going by the quote you have shared, the workshop is again going to use the wrong oil grade since XT12QULV is Ultra Low Viscosity complying to WSS-M2C949-A specification which is the recommended oil for 10R80 equipped Endeavour which comes paired with 2.0L Engine.

For the 6R80 transmission which comes paired with the 3.2L Engine in the Endeavour, only Motorcraft Mercon LV or equivalent oil complying to WSS-M2C938-A specification can be used. Correct part number for 1 quart packing is XT10QLVC.

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

I have attached the previous bill here

With this invoice of previous repair, why do you even have to pay a single penny when it's clear the damage or further damage after water ingress has been caused by using wrong grade of oil? When even using ULV grade oil is not recommended to be used in transmission complying with LV grade oil, the dealership has not done the right thing by using 80W90 oil in the previous repair.

Originally Posted by GTO

The next time any car of mine gets flood-damaged badly, it will be repaired and sold off (sole exception = a beater car or my Jeep which seems to love floods)

I agree since who knows while repairing flood damage what more damage to gears, clutch pack, fluid pump or any other component of the transmission apart from solenoid where this 80W90 grade oil got circulated has damaged and might fail at a later date unless the entire transmission is replaced.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Sheel

MUL did the same in my case.

Auto transmission oils are inherently different from manual. This is a good short read.

Automatic transmission fluid is hydraulic fluid. When your vehicle’s computer decides it’s time to shift gears, it sends an electric signal to the appropriate transmission solenoid. The solenoid directs fluid through a complex series of passages in the valve body to engage the correct gear. The fluid squeezes a series of plates together inside a clutch pack to connect the engine to the transmission output shaft and route power to the wheels.

https://amsoil.eu/blog/automatic-tra...s-the-differe/

Originally Posted by A.G.

the workshop is again going to use the wrong oil grade since XT12QULV is Ultra Low Viscosity complying to WSS-M2C949-A specification which is the recommended oil for 10R80 equipped Endeavour which comes paired with 2.0L Engine.

Excellent information. Can you check from the estimate given by OP if it's for the complete gearbox or just a few parts that have failed, to me, it appears to be the later.

The full transmission will be expensive and should come pre-filled with oil.

[A.G.]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Excellent information. Can you check from the estimate given by OP if it's for the complete gearbox or just a few parts that have failed, to me, it appears to be the later.

You are right - the estimate seems to be for parts only. My estimate for the complete transmission is around 4 Lakhs.

Noticed one more anomaly in the estimate - the transmission oil filter is missing in the list . Also, while the transmission pan seal is reusable, ideally that too should be replaced for peace of mind.

I think Valve body does not come with Solenoids which needs to be ordered separately - I could be wrong here.

[stanjohn123]

Originally Posted by GTO

Flood damage is like cancer for the car, and water will reach areas where no mechanic's hand ever will. Repairing a flood damage car is a big mystery. Let's not forget that it would be in the service center's interest to replace the gearbox originally (higher billing). If I was in your place, I would just go ahead and pay the remaining part of that 1 lakh rupee bill. Write it off as a "bad luck" loss. When you own a 40-lakh car, you have to be open to cutting such cheques unexpectedly.

I agree to your point GTO but the transmission has not failed due to water Ingress. It has failed due to the negligence of the Ford ASC, they drained the original oil and replaced it with manual transmission oil which was more than enough to kill my transmission.

Even like others have pointed out, the new grade of oil mentioned is not the correct one. This Ford authorized service center seems to be much worse than road side mechanics and it puts to question on how bad they have done the other repair work.

I have anyway told the service center that I will not be paying a single penny and have informed Mr. Anurag about our findings as well. I hope Ford India does the right thing.

I am so glad I posted this incident here or I would have never identified the service centers negligence.

[stanjohn123]

An important update. After I sent the proof of bills to Mr. Anurag and others copied on the mail and told them the mix up they did with the transmission oil. Got a call within few minutes and they said they would replace all the parts free of cost.

I told them I need a guarantee that other transmission parts if failed after this job also needs to be covered by them since the oil mix up has compromised the entire transmission, for which they were affirmative and agreed on the same.

Really thanks a lot guys. Alone I would have never found their negligence and believed their water ingress story. Poor marks to my ASC but great job to Ford India and Team-bhp.

[sunishsamuel]

Originally Posted by A.G.

You are right - the estimate seems to be for parts only. My estimate for the complete transmission is around 4 Lakhs.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Excellent information. Can you check from the estimate given by OP if it's for the complete gearbox or just a few parts that have failed, to me, it appears to be the later.

The full transmission will be expensive and should come pre-filled with oil.

In 2016/2017 the cost of the full Automatic Transmission unit for the 3.2L Endeavour was around INR7,00,000. I saw and checked out the whole unit when i was getting my headlights replaced under warranty (the infamous issue of headlight auto-leveling motor going bust) It was imported from Thailand.

I am assuming its going to cost around same price or upwards of 20% to 30%

Personally I'd not recommend repairing the gearbox unless there is some guarantee that the repair will be done by a skilled technician along with warranty for a minimum of 2 years from the date of repair. It's a pretty complicated unit and any mess up can give life long grief. I am not trying to scare you but I'd like to give a friendly caution.

[Alisiddiqui]

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[rovingeye]

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

After I sent the proof of bills to Mr. Anurag and others copied on the mail and told them the mix up they did with the transmission oil. Got a call within few minutes and they said they would replace all the parts free of cost.

Really thanks a lot guys. Alone I would have never found their negligence and believed their water ingress story. Poor marks to my ASC but great job to Ford India and Team-bhp.

So glad this was resolved to your satisfaction. Only two heros here - AG and the ever helpful Ford India MD, Mr Mehrotra.

Some of the Ford ASCs should just be fired due to their incompetence. No better way to deal with such failures.

[woodstock3001]

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

An important update. After I sent the proof of bills to Mr. Anurag and others copied on the mail and told them the mix up they did with the transmission oil.

Glad that issue with your endy 3.2 got over quickly.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Auto transmission oils are inherently different from manual. This is a good short read.

Along with Mr. Anurag, i think credit goes to Turbanator as well for helping you out & sharing the right contact.

Another amazing feet by Team BHP & it's family for helping a member in identifying whose fault it was & getting it resolved. So happy to be part of this community.

Stay safe everyone.

[Gamerk]

This thread makes me proud to be a part of this forum!

stanjohn123 made a post about his issue, various members pointed out that it was due to the wrong fluid being used in his transmission and now his issue is resolved!!!!

Hats off to everyone who helped him with this

[rpm]

Kudos to Team-bhp for helping out a fellow BHPian. My question is— will the ASC get penalized for lying about the cause of failure? Is there any provision to discourage such behaviour which thrives on fleecing the gullible customer who has no choice but to believe the word of the dealership for the lack of engineering know-how? If not for the folks here, the OP would've had to shell out a lakh for no fault of his.

As I understand, currently the OP is only getting the compensation which should've been present right from the start; will there be any consequences/cost to the dealership for almost making the OP pay for their mistakes?

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

this has probably not failed due to a manufacturing issue but likely due to water ingress unless the service centre messed up while changing oil. Do check the old invoice and see if they have used the correct oil (usually replaced at 2 Lac KM)

Originally Posted by stanjohn123

the transmission has not failed due to water Ingress. It has failed due to the negligence of the Ford ASC, they drained the original oil and replaced it with manual transmission oil which was more than enough to kill my transmission.

Full Marks to FORD India, I can't even imagine what would have been the situation if it was any other manufacturer. The moment I read your issue, the Honda City Transmission goof-up thread came to my mind, and am glad that it worked for you. The beauty of this forum is the collective knowledge that we all gain by reading and sharing incidents of fellow members.

the new grade of oil mentioned is not the correct one.

Correct, but that may not be as dangerous as the one they used, 10 speed will have even thinner oil than what's used on 6 speed.

This Ford authorized service center seems to be much worse than road side mechanics and it puts to question on how bad they have done the other repair work.

Can be a genuine mistake too due to ignorance or carelessness. Not many transmissions are serviced at the dealership. But if you have doubts, no harm in getting the other work rechecked by any other dealership or even request Ford officials.

Originally Posted by rpm

willthe ASC get penalized for lying about the cause of failure?

Most likely not, Ford India should instead take this as a part of their training and perhaps update software if not already to show only the relevant or only equivalent parts based on the VIN. So, ideally, the service centre should not even see this manual oil when they feed the VIN of a car equipped with Auto transmission. I am sure, many companies have such checks. If that's not possible, they need to be educated well.

Ford India must be sitting on a lot of failed transmissions (there's a thread) and who knows they have a setup to repair these already. Overseas, it's very common for the manufacturer to supply refurbished transmission in case there is any failure under warranty.

I won't be surprised if the OP is ultimately offered a completely new transmission if the Ford technical department thinks that the oil can cause long term damage. Let's wait for the final repair.

[auto_enthusiast]

IMHO, the OP should ask for a complete replacement of the transmission since a lot of parts may have been damaged by use of wrong grade oil which will be difficult to guage at this point of time. You'll never be at peace with this repaired transmission.

Also I highly doubt the competency of the work done by this ASC, the ones who filled MT fluid in an AT car

Pitch for it and don't let your guard down. All the best.