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Old 18th May 2021, 09:17   #16
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Are these authentic? I have owned sunroof equipped cars in the UK (and now in India) for the last 6+ years, and have never faced such a catastrophic scenario.

If the Harrier video is indeed genuine, how can it survive a 30 minute high pressure wash as updated by GTO? "Vehicle was inspected on 6th at the dealership and was washed with high pressure water jet for half an hour to confirm water ingress. Also the drain pipe, sunroof glass & water beading were inspected. No abnormality / water ingress was observed. This was done in presence of the driver & customer's relative. Further investigation planned after lockdown is lifted and dealership opens."

Something fishy here.
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Old 18th May 2021, 09:39   #17
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by VKumar View Post
  • So, we can assume that the sunroofs are not absolutely leak proof, and hence have dedicated channels for water out flow?
  • In case they are dedicated channels, why they shall not be concealed? On a bad road, it will directly result in water spilling or even the drop getting misdirected towards the roof fabric, or even the passengers - isn't it?
Is it actually normal, or it's just another cost cutting by Kia?
No, this is not normal, and there is not supposed to be any water leakage even on bad roads or even under heavy downpour. Sunroofs ARE absolutely leakproof by design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post
Are these authentic? I have owned sunroof equipped cars in the UK (and now in India) for the last 6+ years, and have never faced such a catastrophic scenario.
+1 to this. I owned a sunroof equipped car in the US, and driven plenty of other cars there which had sunroofs. And now I have a sunroof equipped car in India for last 3 years and have again driven through some really heavy rain. But never had even one drop of water leaking from the sunroof.

So this is definitely not normal. "Same in every car" is just not true.

Either the owners are not closing the sunroofs properly, or there is some genuine assembly flaw in the sunroofs of these brands new cars to cause such a leak. Either way it is not normal.
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Old 18th May 2021, 10:33   #18
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
Sunroofs ARE absolutely leakproof by design.
Well said, Dr. AD!

Like all assemblies, they do need maintenance and refurbishment as the vehicle ages depending upon:
1. Sunroof quality & setup itself, i.e. whether it slides externally above the roof (like most VAG cars) or internally (BMW etc.)
2. Where (climate, dust levels) and how the vehicle is used and parked (covered parking),
3. Frequency of usage of the sunroof (More the better)
4. Periodic routine maintenance like cleaning away leaves from the mechanism (very important for external sliding ones), spraying with silicone (Wuerth, Liqui Moly, 3M etc)

Most workshops are loathe to deal with older sunroofs as it requires knowledge of removal, refurbishment and refitting without leakage issues.

Ajmat: https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techn...ot-repair.html (I solved a big problem for Rs 110 which Vinayak Skoda could not repair)

Jeroen: https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post4683968 (Sunroofs & their usage - Still a gimmick?)

Last edited by itwasntme : 18th May 2021 at 10:37.
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Old 18th May 2021, 10:57   #19
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by VKumar View Post
A Question for Sunroof Experts - The Curious Case of Kia Sonet Sunroof Leakage

Here is another video from the same channel:
https://www.Youtube.com/watch?v=TWImsrMj99I

Exactly at 00:40, the guy mentioned that the owner has approached Kia regarding the complaint of this leakage, and the Kia service team has told him that "it is same in every car".

A few questions for the experts from my end:
  • So, we can assume that the sunroofs are not absolutely leak proof, and hence have dedicated channels for water out flow?
  • In case they are dedicated channels, why they shall not be concealed? On a bad road, it will directly result in water spilling or even the drop getting misdirected towards the roof fabric, or even the passengers - isn't it?

What my knowledge says is, that the rubber sealing shall never let the water seep through, when the sunroof is closed. Even if it leaks, then there is no doubt that channels are there to direct the water out, but not having a concealed set is what got me surprised. Kia people telling customer that "it is normal" is what has made me raise the question. Is it actually normal, or it's just another cost cutting by Kia?

I don't trust Hyundai and Kia actually, and even if they have cut 'yet another cost' at a place where hardly anyone notices - I won't be surprised too! After all, when you buy it loaded and cheap, you have to compromise somewhere inside!
Agree with your point. Now, how different are the Koreans in this matter? When an Indian company made car faces these issues, there is a lot of backlash. On the contrary, the Koreans and Japanese car issues are not met with the same intensity. How good is the Korean's QC here? How did that one guy in the assembly line not perform his duty and how did it pass the shower test? Is the Sonet in anyway low priced? In fact it is one of the most expensive in it's segment.
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Old 18th May 2021, 11:20   #20
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post
Like all assemblies, they do need maintenance and refurbishment as the vehicle ages depending upon:
1. Sunroof quality & setup itself, i.e. whether it slides externally above the roof (like most VAG cars) or internally (BMW etc.)
2. Where (climate, dust levels) and how the vehicle is used and parked (covered parking),
3. Frequency of usage of the sunroof (More the better)
4. Periodic routine maintenance like cleaning away leaves from the mechanism (very important for external sliding ones), spraying with silicone (Wuerth, Liqui Moly, 3M etc)
Very good list of the issues. I agree completely. However, all these issues are over time and usage (typically after at least 3 years of usage). I know of several cars which had some sunroof related issues after 4 or 5 years of usage.

However, I do not recall ever hearing such major water leaks form brand new sunroofs in any car in the past. These examples mentioned in this thread still remain as the rarest of rare cases where brand new sunroofs had such major issue.

Therefore, I agree with your earlier assessment that something is fishy here. This, on a brand new sunroof, is not supposed to happen under any circumstances.

I see many posts here expressing concerns about sunroofs in general. I think those concerns are not valid. This is certainly not a widespread phenomenon to be a real concern. These remain a few freak incidents, and while these must be investigated and root causes figured out (and I do hope the owners of these affected cars get this fixed and this does not happen to them again), I would still not draw generalized conclusions about sunroofs from these examples.
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Old 18th May 2021, 14:10   #21
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raghu M View Post
On the contrary, the Koreans and Japanese car issues are not met with the same intensity.
I disagree. Every car gets bashed here from Maruti to Mercedes. There is a separate thread on Hyundai quality lapse under 'Indian Car Scene' plus many other threads in 'Technical Stuff'. And for Maruti and Toyota, even the owners get bashed in the name of safety, herd mentality, blind fan following and what not. The difference is that when korean and Japanese problems are discussed, hardly anyone brings in Indian companies into discussion to play down the problems but when there is a discussion on TATA and Mahindra, koreans, Japanese and Chinese cars are dragged into it to show they are equally bad. Not all the time ofcourse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.AD View Post
However, I do not recall ever hearing such major water leaks form brand new sunroofs in any car in the past. These examples mentioned in this thread still remain as the rarest of rare cases where brand new sunroofs had such major issue.
I haven't heard issues in new cars, but know few cases in old cars. Indian environment especially dusty places are not very friendly for sunroofs. Also depends on the service centres, some actively inspect sunroofs at every service while many ignore it unless the owner has any complaints.

Last edited by Sheel : 18th May 2021 at 14:56. Reason: Quoted post deleted. Thanks.
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Old 19th May 2021, 00:55   #22
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re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Seems more like a hit job by the channel. Sleeping fools wouldn't QC pass such a defective vehicle. Besides the sunfoof manufacturer supplier has a business relationship to keep
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Old 20th May 2021, 10:16   #23
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Re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

One of my friend who has a Harrier (purchased during the initial months of launch) was lately offered Sun roof as a retrofitment by the dealer. My friend was keen on this cool feature and was seeking our opinion on the retrofitment of Sun roof in his Harrier.
My response was plain "NO, for the retrofitment of Sun roof which will require the cutting of roof and will affect the structural integrity of the car".

And when it is a TATA car better stay away from such features even from the factory side. TATA & Mahindras cannot be trusted for such extravagant features/bells & whistles etc.
When you buy a TATA Nexon or Harrier stick to XM variant (which has minimal/sufficient) features that will bring more peace of mind than the top models.
"More extravagant features in a TATA car means more likely issues & repeated visits to Service centre".
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Old 20th May 2021, 11:07   #24
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Re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Clearly going by the videos on the channel, I am convinced that it is a sabotage. I have seen minor leaks on all cars including BMWs. You can see the trickle when you put your finger near the seals after the automatic car wash. There is a channel that drains these minor leaks out.

The amount of water leakage would only happen if a knife is used to damage the seals. The $$ gained through views must be > the repair cost.
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Old 21st May 2021, 09:48   #25
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Re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apex1815 View Post

And when it is a TATA car better stay away from such features even from the factory side. TATA & Mahindras cannot be trusted for such extravagant features/bells & whistles etc.
When you buy a TATA Nexon or Harrier stick to XM variant (which has minimal/sufficient) features that will bring more peace of mind than the top models.
"More extravagant features in a TATA car means more likely issues & repeated visits to Service centre".

I would like to disagree. We've had a Tata Tiago XZA for almost 4 years now. It's the Top end AMT.
And AMTs aren't known for their reliability either, but apart from one Oil pressure sensor going bad, the car hasn't had any issues. It's been through less than ideal situations too, and it's still held up.

And I know plenty of people with top end Nexons and XUV500s who haven't had issues either.
Maybe do better research next time before you jump to such conclusions?
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Old 21st May 2021, 20:46   #26
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Re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Were the sunroofs completely closed in both videos? It somehow feels staged to me. Both cars (different models, different manufacturers) leaking same way/intensity.

There is specifically water leak test for every car out of assembly, and this amount of leak would not go unnoticed, even if the QC guys are taking a afternoon nap!!! And QC guys napping at two manufacturers, and both cars landing at same youtuber!! Too much coincidence in my opinion.
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Old 25th May 2021, 17:42   #27
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Re: Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?

Thanks to Gautam for sending this update in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!

Quote:
Got more information from the owner via an FB Group. Sharing screenshots of the same. Credit to be given to Rahul Aneja.
Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?-image0.jpeg

Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?-image1.jpeg

Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?-image2.jpeg

Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?-image3.jpeg

Tata Harrier sunroof leakage - Careless owner or manufacturing defect?-image4.jpeg

Last edited by Aditya : 25th May 2021 at 20:58.
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