[emkay.india]

I faced the exact same issue with my Swift 2008. Seems the problem was with the communication between the Key and antenna where the key is inserted. The car had to be towed to MASS and antenna replaced for about 4k. Everything works fine after this.

[thanixravindran]

Originally Posted by maddyg

Getting the spare key by tomorrow. Instructed ASS before doing any serious dismantling, wait for the spare fob.

Is your issue resolved? Which one is the culprit - Key fob or immobilizer module?

[maddyg]

Originally Posted by thanixravindran

Is your issue resolved? Which one is the culprit - Key fob or immobilizer module?

Got the key fob and handed over to ASS Thursday. I could only go there after office hours and haven't got a clear update yesterday too - claims issue is resolved. Heading there now, will find out the root cause.

[trumpet]

Hello all,

I had a similar problem on the Nexon, and that's why I am bumping the thread. The situation was the same. The starter cranks - but the engine does not latch on. On the Nexon I got a check engine fault light. That's all.

Initially, I got this as I was returning from a shop buying some stuff very near to Tata Ambattur. I called The folks at the service station as I didn't want to start a car that had the engine light ON. They said fuel line issue and started the process of manually pumping in diesel through the device in the engine bay. Somehow, the engine started and they advised me to take it to the service station - which I did.

The car was at the service centre for a week, they said they cleaned the lines, and did all tests - but could not replicate the issue above. I got the car and for 2 weeks it was well; but the same issue manifested - this time when coming back from a pub near Gemini.

Then I decided to go to CBE (Coimbatore) where I have a trusted friend at Tata to check this. I know driving 400 km with an invisible problem like this is not advisable, but I did it and throughout the trip, it started as usual. The engine light didn't come on.

At TATA CBE, my friend said it's a crank position sensor issue, and said the folks at Ambattur should have rectified this when they hooked up the car to diagnostics. Anyway, he replaced that component and now the car is just as fine as ever.

Thanks,
Vijay

[maddyg]

I have an update. Got the car back on Saturday, but the issue is back again today. Here is a sequence of events

0. The car was left unused for 5 days and left in open parking.

1. On the 8th day, immobiliser not disabling symptoms appear on 04th June. Both CEL and MFL come on. Two days in between, there were no issues

2. On the 6th, by keeping the fob near the push button, the car started normally

3. On the 7th morning, the car starts normally with the fob in my pocket. By noon at the roadside, the same symptom - the immobiliser light blinked even with the fob near the push button. Basically back to point number 1

4. ASS sends techs to scan - this time scan reveals immobiliser unit communication failure. Flat bed arrives, car is ASS by night.

5. On the 8th morning the car starts normally, not errors in scan. ASS seeks advice from Tata technical team

6. 9th I got the spare key fob. By now it makes no difference, because even with old fob things are back to normal. Based on the Tata's tech tram's advice, ASS starts checking the wiring harness. They removed the bottom part of the dashboard, especially glove boxes and steering column.

7. Troubleshooting continues, no fault is found anywhere - no loose coupler,no lack of continuity etc. ASS was also asked to drive it in rough pattern - drive hard to see if the jerks creating a loose contact. All were negative.

8. ASS kept the car till 11th, couldn't find anything unusual and decided to return it. Here is written the description from ASS - "As per DTC wiring has been checked (ECU to BCM and back). No issues found. Vehicle kept for two days for observation. Issue not replicated. Vehicle delivered under observation".

9.11th and 12th ran without a problem, took it out yesterday for a spin - no issues observer. Was using the spare fob from the 11th.

10.Today I parked in the office as usual. It's a hot day in Goa,being in an open parking car gets hot quite a bit. Tried to start about an hour back - same symptoms*as point number 1.
The ASS team reached and did a scan. DTC shoes confirmed code for circuit/relay open. They are discussing Tata and awaiting a response.*Could excessive climate conditions*(parking in open from May 15th - cabin becomes like a furnace by evening) cause this ?.

ASS is SP cars Verna - a very proactive and supportive team. Hopefully they come up with a quick and final resolution.

Originally Posted by trumpet

Hello all,

I had a similar problem on the Nexon, and that's why I am bumping the thread. The situation was the same. The starter cranks - but the engine does not latch on. On the Nexon I got a check engine fault light. That's all.

Vijay

Hi Vijay, the issue i'm facing is with the immobiliser - the presence of key fob should disable it, here it is not. Dont even have to crank to tell it wont start - the immo light keeps blinking with ignition fully on.

[thanixravindran]

Originally Posted by maddyg

I have an update.

The ASS team reached and did a scan. DTC shoes confirmed code for circuit/relay open. They are discussing Tata and awaiting a response.*Could excessive climate conditions*(parking in open from May 15th - cabin becomes like a furnace by evening) cause this ?.

What relay is it? Is it a relay that needs to be closed to disable immobilizer circuit after successful receipt of key fob detection or message through a wireless transceiver?

Have they debugged whether the immobilizer transceiver detects the key fob? Some designs use chip antenna rather than printed antenna and they do become cracked in high temperatures leading to intermittent issues. Please check whether they can debug about detecting the presence of key fob consistently.

[akshay380]

Strange issue. SP cars service guys are very good chaps. I bought my cars elsewhere but stick to them for all work.

[maddyg]

Originally Posted by thanixravindran

What relay is it? Is it a relay that needs to be closed to disable immobilizer circuit after successful receipt of key fob detection or message through a wireless transceiver?

Have they debugged whether the immobilizer transceiver detects the key fob? Some designs use chip antenna rather than printed antenna and they do become cracked in high temperatures leading to intermittent issues. Please check whether they can debug about detecting the presence of key fob consistently.

Relay message was on DTC - it came up as description to the error code. I will check with them
I know there is one antenna near push button which detects the FOB immo chip even passively (even if the fob battery is dead) - not sure this is the only antenna for immobiliser or the the antenna under the hand break has also a part in immo (this is antenna placement mentioned in manual - says if battery is low/key out of range message, place fob inside storage near handbreak). The latter works because of ignition turns on with fob in pocket.

II still feel baking in sun has to do something with this. Last one year, always in covered parking. Few weeks out in open, issue appears all of a sudden. I was even suspecting first fob getting wet, but now even second fob same symptoms.

Update (14-06-22 09:15am):- Immobiliser getting disabled as usual if the car is left alone over night. This happened just now!.i also have both key fobs in cabin, after taking to ASS, will check each independently. I dont dare to turn off ignition now.

Originally Posted by maddyg

I know there is one antenna near push button which detects the FOB immo chip even passively (even if the fob battery is dead) - not sure this is the only antenna for immobiliser or the the antenna under the hand break has also a part in immo (this is antenna placement mentioned in manual - says if battery is low/key out of range message, place fob inside storage near handbreak). The latter works because of ignition turns on with fob in pocket..

Technician advices there is no antenna near push button area and that configuration is for the models with physical ignition key. Then my theory is wrong, the only antenna is under the storage unit near handbreak.

Originally Posted by maddyg

Update (14-06-22 09:15am):- i also have both key fobs in cabin, after taking to ASS, will check each independently.

Immobiliser getting disabled with each of the key fobs. I believe this puts fob out of question now.

[maddyg]

Originally Posted by maddyg

Update (14-06-22 09:15am):- Immobiliser getting disabled as usual if the car is left alone over night.



Immobiliser getting disabled with each of the key fobs. I believe this puts fob out of question now.

Apologies for the delayed update. Problem identified as a loose pin in the engine compartment fuse array. On 14-06-22, after leaving the car out in the open under the sun, the problem reappeared. During that time , the SP technician, in a continuity check, found one wire from the PEPS unit (fixed inside the rear quarter panel -next to fuel cap) having a resistance of around 70 Ohm.

Tata advised to replace the wiring harness. An express order was placed by SP cars on 15th and part was received on 17th. They started the stripping work and as of today morning fixing the new harness is started. Every single part in the cabin is removed, what's left now is the steering rod/metal frame of dashboard and seatbelt fixtures. It was a sad scene to witness in a year old car.

Great support from SP cars right from their Senior Technician, PR and the Service Manager. I have also written to them for an official response on root cause from Tata's team.

[maddyg]

Got the car back from the SP ASS yesterday noon. The Immobiliser issues have not been observed so far and both keyfobs are working fine.I'm yet to get a report on work carried out by SP cars, expecting this over email. Currently I have only the invoice copy. Yesterday evening, Tata CCM for Goa/Mumbai - Anthony Ryan visited me and I have formally requested for the root cause and an extension to the warranty. Will keep this thread updated, hopefully the loose pin is the only fault here.

Just prior to this incident, I have been to a few middle of nowhere places and can't imagine if the issue has cropped up during then. In one such place - Destiny farms, Coonoor - the nearest road where a tow truck/flatbed can come was 2kms away.

Glad to see a very professional and cordial approach from SP cars, Verna. Their Service Manager - Sidhish Binagekar, PR - Vishwanath Pattan and the Senior Technician - Preetam Parab require a special mention for right from keeping me in company during(well after working hours) the long wait for flatbed to periodic updates and a resolution as fast as they can.

Thanks to the members and forum for the valuable inputs as well as acting as a positive influence in the whole episode. Happy to be a part of it!

[handsofsteel]

Originally Posted by maddyg

Got the car back from the SP ASS yesterday noon.

Sad to see these photos. Glad to note the proactive SVC and the fact that issue is finally resolved. However, I am not buying a Tata after this thread. Final nail in the coffin for me. Sad, but my peace of mind is more important to me than an eye Candy.

[SilverSmoke]

Many of my known have Harrier or Safari.
Never heard from them - atleast till now.

Sad to know it's happening.

Can occur with any vehicle - but happening with Tatas / Mahindras send us jitters as we all know how trained their staff will be.

[shabeermohamed]

More and more getting convinced not to buy a Tata car at least for the next five years.

[Sidjohri]

The interiors have literally been stripped to the bone! Shocking to see a new vehicle in such state! Though I'm glad that the issue is resolved (or seems to be) I have a severely lumpy throat and weak knees from the visuals. Earlier it was a firm good bye from me for Jeep; now it's a solid 'Ta Ta' to Tata.

[SaiSW]

Not sure about letting them completely strip the interior for finding the problem. Although if they have fixed it, then good on their part, but I fear this might be the start of rattling issues for the car. Atleast that was the case in my Tiago, they had to open a part of the dashboard to fix a rattle and they returned the car with 100 more rattles

Tata can build automobiles just fine but it seems in most cities, the SC is still stuck in the pre-Tiago era as far as their attitude is concerned.