Honda City Anhc Abs Problem

drkunaldas · 20th August 2009, 18:53

hi,
i brought a ANHC on 19th July. It went for 1st service at 1100 kms on 7th August. Today, i find that the ABS sign is not going away and remains on while driving. since the last 2 days, i am finding that even in slow brake from 20-30-km/hr situation i can feel the vibrating brakes (probably the ABS is working). this is when there is no hard / panic breaking. infact a week ago i had gone on a trip to rishikesh. that time there was no problem in breaking. i called my dealer, he said to bring the vehicle to workshop tomorrow. i shall be going to the workshop tomorrow for evaluation.
anybody experienced such a problem in ANHC before? any suggestions what could the problem be? i am worried. any help is welcome

GTO · 21st August 2009, 11:04

I wouldn't recommend you to drive the car until this problem is taken care of.

The ABS light staying permanently on indicates a problem with your ABS system. However, even if the ABS is malfunctional, the ANHC's braking system (non-ABS style) will function normally.

The most common cause of this light showing up is a sensor that's either faulty or damaged by dirt / road particles.

ImmortalZ · 21st August 2009, 14:56

The ABS light will come on when

a) Brake fluid level is low.
b) Low pressure in a brake circuit or a full on leak/failure.
c) One or more of the wheel speed sensors have failed or are malfunctioning.
d) The ABS computer is experiencing problems.

The ANHC has dual circuit brakes, so even if you have a failure in one hydraulic circuit, you'll still have braking. Diagonally opposite wheels are tied together in a circuit.

I would highly recommend you not drive the car until you get the problem checked out and sorted.

drkunaldas · 22nd August 2009, 18:54

thanks for ur comments. the car is with ace honda. the abs light has gone, but the vibration while braking at normal speeds is present. initially i was told that the ABS modulator could be faulty. but then they attached the modulator of the demo honda city car to my car the vibrating brakes are still there. when they attached the modulator of my cay to the demo car, it is working fine. now the service advisor says that he has sent the techinical report to honda and awaiting response. he says the sensors needs to checked. anyone faced such a problem with ANHC.

ImmortalZ · 22nd August 2009, 23:00

Vibration while braking at low speeds can be due to warped brake discs. But this should not occur in a relatively new car like yours. Did you per chance run your car with the handbrake engaged? Any occasions of spirited driving that could've cooked your brakes? Discs can warp if you brake hard and then stay on the brakes hard when the car is stationary. This traps the heat in a small area of the disc. Combined with the hydraulic pressure from the calipers, the brake disc can deform.

A bad wheel sensor can also cause the problem, as ABS works on the basis of speed differentials between individual wheels.

Good luck with getting the problem resolved.

drkunaldas · 25th August 2009, 00:41

unfortunately, my car is with them for the last 3 days (it is getting frustating). they seem to unable to diagnose the problem. according to them everything is ok. the disc / abs modulators are ok. there have been engineers from honda to check the abs / brakes. but even they are clueless. the vibrations are still there on braking. they are asking me to take delivery and say everything will be ok in 7 days time. i am a bit nervous and hence resisting. afterall its is about braking. if it fails due to any reason, it may be life-threating.
should i ask for a replacement of my car (it is only one month old)? is it necessary / justified? or should i take delivery with the vibrating brake problem.? please advise

ghpk · 25th August 2009, 04:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkunaldas

they are asking me to take delivery and say everything will be ok in 7 days time.

what do they think, Santa clause come to your garage and fix it in night, they are just trying to be smart, you drive away, and in 7 days the case is closed, or may be some replacement time is passed.

Call Honda India HQ, Talk to some customer care supervisor, there must be some one to attend to such complaints.

also check with any other recent owner who took delivery around your car delivery date, check if they too have such problems.

on a side note, The DEMO car may be on OLD ABS system, and the circuit on ANHC and OHC may be different.

drkunaldas · 25th August 2009, 09:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghpk

Call Honda India HQ, Talk to some customer care supervisor, there must be some one to attend to such complaints.

i will do that

The DEMO car may be on OLD ABS system, and the circuit on ANHC and OHC may be different.
i think they must have switched abs modulator of the demo ANHC

Now i have a fresh issue. my car had 1/2 tank full of petrol, now they have finished it by testing. want me to pay for 10 litres of petrol.

ajmat · 25th August 2009, 10:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by drkunaldas

Now i have a fresh issue. my car had 1/2 tank full of petrol, now they have finished it by testing. want me to pay for 10 litres of petrol.

Since this is a warranty issue where the car should not needed to be there. No way. Refuse to take car due to safety issues. Notify Honda about case

ghpk · 25th August 2009, 11:39

Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT post one-liners that add little or no informational value to the thread. We need your co-operation to maintain the overall quality of this forum.

Please read our rules before proceeding any further.

DerAlte · 25th August 2009, 12:09

Like @immortalz said, this could be a case of disc warping.

ABS is not supposed to - by design - come on unless there is a wheel lock sensed. Either one wheel with respect to another, or one wheel with respect to itself over the last couple of seconds (sharp angular deceleration profile). This is independent of the speed of the car. Unless there is a definite event forcing the logic to work, the outputs *are not* enabled. This is to prevent human injury due to electronic or mechanical malfunction - liability cost is humongous, if you can understand. All possible failure mode cases have already been mapped out over the last 20+ years that these systems have been around, so there is no unknown failure that can occur. The service guys are completely ignorant and are not systematically looking at it at all.

@drkunaldas, perhaps you are not differentiating the vibration you are getting from the real shuddering (one has to feel it once to know it) when the ABS actually engages. To try it out, go to a sandy stretch (road, field, ...) and try jamming the brakes by kicking down hard. Works even if you are at 10-20kmph when you brake hard - as long as you are able to achieve wheel lock condition. The resultant shuddering through your foot is likely to scare you out of your wits.

luky_13 · 25th August 2009, 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTO

I wouldn't recommend you to drive the car until this problem is taken care of.

The ABS light staying permanently on indicates a problem with your ABS system. However, even if the ABS is malfunctional, the ANHC's braking system (non-ABS style) will function normally.

The most common cause of this light showing up is a sensor that's either faulty or damaged by dirt / road particles.

Bang on! I have had an issue with ABS on Linea, due to a loose contact, connector. ABS light use to flash indefinitely with an ABS unavailable message on the console. Took 5 minutes to sort out at the dealership.

drkunaldas · 26th August 2009, 23:34

ok guys, thanks to all. the issue has been resolved. they told me they have changed the wheel hub (drive side) . the wheel hub carries the various sensors. the problem was with abs sensors. now the braking is working fine.
i did write a mail to honda. but since issue got resolved i have not further persued the matter.

Barrichello · 31st August 2010, 11:53

Similar issue noticed . My buddy at work has a 2 month old ANHC (done 2000 kms). Yesterday, he filled up the fuel tank to the max. In a span of 2-3 seconds the air pressure lamp & the ABS lamp switched themselves on !

Surprisingly, the light has stayed on for 2 days now. We have obviously checked the air pressure in all tires, tried panic braking to kick-in the ABS & routine inspection of the wheels etc.

Before following the standard process of getting the diagnostics run on the car by Honda, what do you suggest could be the cause of this weird issue ?

20th August 2009, 18:53	#1
drkunaldas BHPian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Noida Posts: 141 Thanked: 5 Times	Honda City Anhc Abs Problem hi, i brought a ANHC on 19th July. It went for 1st service at 1100 kms on 7th August. Today, i find that the ABS sign is not going away and remains on while driving. since the last 2 days, i am finding that even in slow brake from 20-30-km/hr situation i can feel the vibrating brakes (probably the ABS is working). this is when there is no hard / panic breaking. infact a week ago i had gone on a trip to rishikesh. that time there was no problem in breaking. i called my dealer, he said to bring the vehicle to workshop tomorrow. i shall be going to the workshop tomorrow for evaluation. anybody experienced such a problem in ANHC before? any suggestions what could the problem be? i am worried. any help is welcome
	() Thanks

21st August 2009, 11:04	#2
GTO Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 70,534 Thanked: 300,737 Times View My Garage	I wouldn't recommend you to drive the car until this problem is taken care of. The ABS light staying permanently on indicates a problem with your ABS system. However, even if the ABS is malfunctional, the ANHC's braking system (non-ABS style) will function normally. The most common cause of this light showing up is a sensor that's either faulty or damaged by dirt / road particles.
	() Thanks

21st August 2009, 14:56	#3
ImmortalZ Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,179 Thanked: 488 Times View My Garage	The ABS light will come on when a) Brake fluid level is low. b) Low pressure in a brake circuit or a full on leak/failure. c) One or more of the wheel speed sensors have failed or are malfunctioning. d) The ABS computer is experiencing problems. The ANHC has dual circuit brakes, so even if you have a failure in one hydraulic circuit, you'll still have braking. Diagonally opposite wheels are tied together in a circuit. I would highly recommend you not drive the car until you get the problem checked out and sorted.
	() Thanks

22nd August 2009, 18:54	#4
drkunaldas BHPian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Noida Posts: 141 Thanked: 5 Times	thanks for ur comments. the car is with ace honda. the abs light has gone, but the vibration while braking at normal speeds is present. initially i was told that the ABS modulator could be faulty. but then they attached the modulator of the demo honda city car to my car the vibrating brakes are still there. when they attached the modulator of my cay to the demo car, it is working fine. now the service advisor says that he has sent the techinical report to honda and awaiting response. he says the sensors needs to checked. anyone faced such a problem with ANHC.
	() Thanks

22nd August 2009, 23:00	#5
ImmortalZ Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 2,179 Thanked: 488 Times View My Garage	Vibration while braking at low speeds can be due to warped brake discs. But this should not occur in a relatively new car like yours. Did you per chance run your car with the handbrake engaged? Any occasions of spirited driving that could've cooked your brakes? Discs can warp if you brake hard and then stay on the brakes hard when the car is stationary. This traps the heat in a small area of the disc. Combined with the hydraulic pressure from the calipers, the brake disc can deform. A bad wheel sensor can also cause the problem, as ABS works on the basis of speed differentials between individual wheels. Good luck with getting the problem resolved. Last edited by ImmortalZ : 22nd August 2009 at 23:02.
	() Thanks

25th August 2009, 00:41	#6
drkunaldas BHPian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Noida Posts: 141 Thanked: 5 Times	unfortunately, my car is with them for the last 3 days (it is getting frustating). they seem to unable to diagnose the problem. according to them everything is ok. the disc / abs modulators are ok. there have been engineers from honda to check the abs / brakes. but even they are clueless. the vibrations are still there on braking. they are asking me to take delivery and say everything will be ok in 7 days time. i am a bit nervous and hence resisting. afterall its is about braking. if it fails due to any reason, it may be life-threating. should i ask for a replacement of my car (it is only one month old)? is it necessary / justified? or should i take delivery with the vibrating brake problem.? please advise
	() Thanks

25th August 2009, 11:39	#10
ghpk BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Ghaziabad Posts: 870 Thanked: 211 Times	Post deleted by the Team-BHP Support : Please do NOT post one-liners that add little or no informational value to the thread. We need your co-operation to maintain the overall quality of this forum. Please read our rules before proceeding any further. Last edited by GTO : 1st September 2010 at 10:03.
	() Thanks $Received Infraction$

25th August 2009, 12:09	#11
DerAlte Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 8,069 Thanked: 2,919 Times	Like @immortalz said, this could be a case of disc warping. ABS is not supposed to - by design - come on unless there is a wheel lock sensed. Either one wheel with respect to another, or one wheel with respect to itself over the last couple of seconds (sharp angular deceleration profile). This is independent of the speed of the car. Unless there is a definite event forcing the logic to work, the outputs *are not* enabled. This is to prevent human injury due to electronic or mechanical malfunction - liability cost is humongous, if you can understand. All possible failure mode cases have already been mapped out over the last 20+ years that these systems have been around, so there is no unknown failure that can occur. The service guys are completely ignorant and are not systematically looking at it at all. @drkunaldas, perhaps you are not differentiating the vibration you are getting from the real shuddering (one has to feel it once to know it) when the ABS actually engages. To try it out, go to a sandy stretch (road, field, ...) and try jamming the brakes by kicking down hard. Works even if you are at 10-20kmph when you brake hard - as long as you are able to achieve wheel lock condition. The resultant shuddering through your foot is likely to scare you out of your wits.
	() Thanks

26th August 2009, 23:34	#13
drkunaldas BHPian Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Noida Posts: 141 Thanked: 5 Times	ok guys, thanks to all. the issue has been resolved. they told me they have changed the wheel hub (drive side) . the wheel hub carries the various sensors. the problem was with abs sensors. now the braking is working fine. i did write a mail to honda. but since issue got resolved i have not further persued the matter.
	() Thanks

31st August 2010, 11:53	#14
Barrichello Newbie Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: New Delhi Posts: 11 Thanked: 0 Times	Similar issue noticed . My buddy at work has a 2 month old ANHC (done 2000 kms). Yesterday, he filled up the fuel tank to the max. In a span of 2-3 seconds the air pressure lamp & the ABS lamp switched themselves on ! Surprisingly, the light has stayed on for 2 days now. We have obviously checked the air pressure in all tires, tried panic braking to kick-in the ABS & routine inspection of the wheels etc. Before following the standard process of getting the diagnostics run on the car by Honda, what do you suggest could be the cause of this weird issue ?
	() Thanks