NHC ZX 2006 43K, Starting very 'heavy'

guptavis · 21st October 2010, 00:37

Hello all,

I started my NHC this morning to get fuel top up for our drive to Delhi tomorrow morning. To my horror upon releasing the clutch the car could barely move! Its difficult to explain, but it felt like there was something stopping the car. It was needing more accelerator to move. I checked if handbrake was applied and then if any tyre was puncture but all was ok. I again started and shifted to 2nd gear, again it seemed like car had no real power or clutch mechanism was not working properly. But on higher gears the problem is lesser than 1st gear. Decided against taking it anywhere.

This car is used by my Dad for local chandigarh travel (not much traffic and speeds around 50-60 Kmph), and I drive it only occasionally for highway trips. There was no major problem at all. It was running in top condition till about a month ago, when I noticed a strange behavior. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2105444

But everything was normal within city driving since then. My dad said there was a little lag for past two days (hardly driven 10Km) but not like this. Last service was major 40K service at dealer in Jun 2010. We are now taking my Alto tomorrow as reliability is in question.

Am feeling anxious, this is the first time there has been a problem other than puncture in the car in over 4 years of ownership.
Will take it to Honda Dealer when we return from delhi in 2 days.
What could be the cause of the problem and possible solution?
Feel free to ask for any other info that will be relevant. Will appreciate any insights into this.

Thanks and Regards,
Vishal

benbsb29 · 21st October 2010, 11:21

Vishal, looks like either the clutch acting up, or else the brakes not disengaging. Please get these checked.

condor · 21st October 2010, 13:20

Vishal, how is the play in the clutch pedal, brake & hand-brake ? Are these clutch behaving normally ?

Drive a little and then check the brakes - are the brakes warm / hot ? This can indicate that the brakes are not disengaging. See if you can avoid using the brakes during this small drive.

guptavis · 22nd October 2010, 01:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by condor

Vishal, how is the play in the clutch pedal, brake & hand-brake ? Are these clutch behaving normally ?

Drive a little and then check the brakes - are the brakes warm / hot ? This can indicate that the brakes are not disengaging. See if you can avoid using the brakes during this small drive.

Hello benbsb29 & condor,

The parking brake and foot brake work fine for stopping the car and have normal play (zero for hand-brake).
I tried to push the car a little while switched off and it required normal effort so i guess its not a brake dragging issue.
Please bear with me, the problem is a little difficult to explain. Its like the engine is revving but not transmitting enough power.

I now remember that the symptoms i am facing are similar to ones in my M800 4-5 years ago. The problem that time was a faulty 'Water Body'. Replaced by a small MASS for ~Rs. 800 and the car became fine after that.
Does City ZX have a 'water body'? Could this be it?

narayanang76 · 22nd October 2010, 20:33

2 possibilities for the problem you are facing. I have seen similar behaviour in my relative's santro

Clutch failure - typically cluch would feel 'too light'
Transmission failure - meaning the engine power not getting transmitted to the front wheels

guptavis · 22nd October 2010, 21:46

Hello all,

The car was undrivable this morning! Took it to a garage owned by a friend of my father. The mechanic got in and drove for less than 5 metres. Came out and said 'clutch khatam ho gaya hai' !

The Service Advisor of the garage made a few calls and said that price of new Genuine Honda clutch assembly is ~Rs 7500. Only available as set including Clutch Plate, Pressure Plate and Clutch Release Bearing.
A Honda Dealer quoted the price as ~Rs 8500.
What should be the correct Price? I would not mind paying Rs1000 more but i dont have much confidence in the dealer either.
Even more importantly, can the private garage get original Honda Clutch? Is there some way i can check if the clutch obtained by the private Garage is Genuine Honda part?

was advised against driving the car at all to prevent further damage. Will have to decide by tomorrow on what to do.
WOuld be great if i can find the actual price of Honda City ZX Clutch Set. Any inputs appreciated.

OT: Isnt 43k KM too soon for the cluth to give way all of a sudden. Car is mostly used by my dad who is 73 and drives VERY patiently. Gradual pickups and speeds under 70Kmph. Mileage used to be around 14Kmpl.

The SA said Honda Clutches usually last atleast 60-80k KM but sometimes they do go early.

bharti22shresth · 22nd October 2010, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by guptavis

Hello all,

The car was undrivable this morning! Took it to a garage owned by a friend of my father. The mechanic got in and drove for less than 5 metres. Came out and said 'clutch khatam ho gaya hai' !

The Service Advisor of the garage made a few calls and said that price of new Genuine Honda clutch assembly is ~Rs 7500. Only available as set including Clutch Plate, Pressure Plate and Clutch Release Bearing.
A Honda Dealer quoted the price as ~Rs 8500.
What should be the correct Price? I would not mind paying Rs1000 more but i dont have much confidence in the dealer either.
Even more importantly, can the private garage get original Honda Clutch? Is there some way i can check if the clutch obtained by the private Garage is Genuine Honda part?

was advised against driving the car at all to prevent further damage. Will have to decide by tomorrow on what to do.
WOuld be great if i can find the actual price of Honda City ZX Clutch Set. Any inputs appreciated.

OT: Isnt 43k KM too soon for the cluth to give way all of a sudden. Car is mostly used by my dad who is 73 and drives VERY patiently. Gradual pickups and speeds under 70Kmph. Mileage used to be around 14Kmpl.

The SA said Honda Clutches usually last atleast 60-80k KM but sometimes they do go early.

Having faced some recent issues with my Hyundai, I can vouch for one thing and that is, that ALWAYS get major components done up from the dealership. You may be paying the extra money which I respect is your hard earned money but it really pays back later on since they give a warranty also for any problem of that relation.

guptavis · 22nd October 2010, 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by bharti22shresth

Having faced some recent issues with my Hyundai, I can vouch for one thing and that is, that ALWAYS get major components done up from the dealership. You may be paying the extra money which I respect is your hard earned money but it really pays back later on since they give a warranty also for any problem of that relation.

Hello shresth,

I also believe on getting major work done by dealers. Infact till date even small things including all of my regular services have been done by dealers both for my dad's NHC and for my Alto. Its just that both the Honda Dealerships in chandigarh have given me poor service and the experiences with the staff have been bad. Thats why im not too confident about their work.
If (touchwood) i had a problem with maruti i would not even have thought of going to anyone but a dealer. If I trusted either Prestige Honda or Harmony Honda i would go to them even if they charged Rs10000 for the same job.
Have not heard anything good about carnation chandigarh either. I feel totally helpless when it comes to my Honda City. That is why this confusion.

What problems did you run into and with what garage?

Anyone with a way of identifying the genuine clutch or price ?

guptavis · 26th October 2010, 11:20

Hello all,

In the absence of any other good options (asked Honda dealer and they said flywheel has to be replaced in 90% cases and the total cost would be around 19-20K, was pushing for flywheel change even before seeing the car!) , finally dad decided to give the go ahead to this private garage on Sunday. The job was done by evening and car was delivered by morning on Monday. Dad did a test drive and it was ok. He settled bill for Rs. 8800 (~6800 + VAT for clutch assembly and ~1000 labour).

When i came home i was thrilled to see the car back! But when i asked dad how it was during he day he said there is a problem. He said some light comes on in the panel. When i checked i was horrified to see it was the Engine Malfunction Light. He does not remember if it was there when the car was delivered but it probably was. Looked up the owner manual. It says it comes on if the ECU detects a problem with the emmissions control system. Here is the sequence of the light.

All lights turn on for a few seconds when the switch is turned to 'ON' position. Then they go off. Crank the engine and it starts fine. After about 5 seconds the yellow coloured Engine malfunction Light comes on and stays on.
Goes off only when engine is switched off.

Called the garage, they said would send a mechanic to check it out in the morning. I read up here to find its usually an O2 sensor problem on the city. There was some mention that it comes on because of O2 sensor only when engine is hot. So tried cranking this morning after the car was standing overnight. The light again came up within 5 seconds even though the engine was cold and in high RPM.

The service center guy came. he checked the light and immediately opened the bonnet. Removed the negative terminal for about half a minute and fitted it back. The problem persisted. He then said ' yeh to koi electrical fault hai mechanical nahi, gadi le jata hun hamara electrician dekh lega '. So sent it to him.
Now im scared to think of the result. Will probably have to take it to the Honda Dealer. This is the first problem the car has had after four wonderful years, but its turning out to be a bad one.

Any advice on what it could be? Will keep everyone posted about the result and seek advice before doing anything else.

@MODS: Please change thread title to ' City ZX clutch changed, now Check Engine Light is ON. ' or anything more suitable to make this thread visible and get an eye of the experts.

manikjeet · 26th October 2010, 12:11

its a O2 sensor and would require changing

you will also feel a little power drop and the engine would be rough

it will cost you around 14k from the dealer and about 3.5k from outside original from a totaled nhc but push your friend for the replacement as its totally their fualt

guptavis · 30th October 2010, 23:07

Sorry for the late update.

Car was returned in the afternoon. They said there was some fault with a wire being loose. Now the light behaviour is normal. Comes on for a second when switching to 'ON' position and then goes away. Car is running fine since then. It turned out to be a smooth change with a minor hiccup after all ! Alls well that ends well.

@manikjeet: Issue fixed. thankfully without changing the sensor. And the garage is run by my father's friend not my friend.

Thanks to all who posted!

21st October 2010, 00:37	#1
guptavis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: chandigarh Posts: 339 Thanked: 66 Times	NHC ZX 2006 43K, Starting very 'heavy' Hello all, I started my NHC this morning to get fuel top up for our drive to Delhi tomorrow morning. To my horror upon releasing the clutch the car could barely move! Its difficult to explain, but it felt like there was something stopping the car. It was needing more accelerator to move. I checked if handbrake was applied and then if any tyre was puncture but all was ok. I again started and shifted to 2nd gear, again it seemed like car had no real power or clutch mechanism was not working properly. But on higher gears the problem is lesser than 1st gear. Decided against taking it anywhere. This car is used by my Dad for local chandigarh travel (not much traffic and speeds around 50-60 Kmph), and I drive it only occasionally for highway trips. There was no major problem at all. It was running in top condition till about a month ago, when I noticed a strange behavior. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ml#post2105444 But everything was normal within city driving since then. My dad said there was a little lag for past two days (hardly driven 10Km) but not like this. Last service was major 40K service at dealer in Jun 2010. We are now taking my Alto tomorrow as reliability is in question. Am feeling anxious, this is the first time there has been a problem other than puncture in the car in over 4 years of ownership. Will take it to Honda Dealer when we return from delhi in 2 days. What could be the cause of the problem and possible solution? Feel free to ask for any other info that will be relevant. Will appreciate any insights into this. Thanks and Regards, Vishal
	() Thanks

21st October 2010, 11:21	#2
benbsb29 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Brisbane Posts: 9,963 Thanked: 13,142 Times View My Garage	Vishal, looks like either the clutch acting up, or else the brakes not disengaging. Please get these checked.
	() Thanks

21st October 2010, 13:20	#3
condor Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Speed-brkr City Posts: 15,863 Thanked: 16,006 Times View My Garage	Vishal, how is the play in the clutch pedal, brake & hand-brake ? Are these clutch behaving normally ? Drive a little and then check the brakes - are the brakes warm / hot ? This can indicate that the brakes are not disengaging. See if you can avoid using the brakes during this small drive.
	() Thanks

22nd October 2010, 20:33	#5
narayanang76 BHPian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: KA 53/KL 9 Posts: 451 Thanked: 835 Times View My Garage	2 possibilities for the problem you are facing. I have seen similar behaviour in my relative's santro Clutch failure - typically cluch would feel 'too light' Transmission failure - meaning the engine power not getting transmitted to the front wheels
	() Thanks

22nd October 2010, 21:46	#6
guptavis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: chandigarh Posts: 339 Thanked: 66 Times	Clutch Gone! How to be sure of genuine replacement? Hello all, The car was undrivable this morning! Took it to a garage owned by a friend of my father. The mechanic got in and drove for less than 5 metres. Came out and said 'clutch khatam ho gaya hai' ! The Service Advisor of the garage made a few calls and said that price of new Genuine Honda clutch assembly is ~Rs 7500. Only available as set including Clutch Plate, Pressure Plate and Clutch Release Bearing. A Honda Dealer quoted the price as ~Rs 8500. What should be the correct Price? I would not mind paying Rs1000 more but i dont have much confidence in the dealer either. Even more importantly, can the private garage get original Honda Clutch? Is there some way i can check if the clutch obtained by the private Garage is Genuine Honda part? was advised against driving the car at all to prevent further damage. Will have to decide by tomorrow on what to do. WOuld be great if i can find the actual price of Honda City ZX Clutch Set. Any inputs appreciated. OT: Isnt 43k KM too soon for the cluth to give way all of a sudden. Car is mostly used by my dad who is 73 and drives VERY patiently. Gradual pickups and speeds under 70Kmph. Mileage used to be around 14Kmpl. The SA said Honda Clutches usually last atleast 60-80k KM but sometimes they do go early.
	() Thanks

26th October 2010, 11:20	#9
guptavis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: chandigarh Posts: 339 Thanked: 66 Times	UPDATE: Got the clutch replaced. Further problem. Hello all, In the absence of any other good options (asked Honda dealer and they said flywheel has to be replaced in 90% cases and the total cost would be around 19-20K, was pushing for flywheel change even before seeing the car!) , finally dad decided to give the go ahead to this private garage on Sunday. The job was done by evening and car was delivered by morning on Monday. Dad did a test drive and it was ok. He settled bill for Rs. 8800 (~6800 + VAT for clutch assembly and ~1000 labour). When i came home i was thrilled to see the car back! But when i asked dad how it was during he day he said there is a problem. He said some light comes on in the panel. When i checked i was horrified to see it was the Engine Malfunction Light. He does not remember if it was there when the car was delivered but it probably was. Looked up the owner manual. It says it comes on if the ECU detects a problem with the emmissions control system. Here is the sequence of the light. All lights turn on for a few seconds when the switch is turned to 'ON' position. Then they go off. Crank the engine and it starts fine. After about 5 seconds the yellow coloured Engine malfunction Light comes on and stays on. Goes off only when engine is switched off. Called the garage, they said would send a mechanic to check it out in the morning. I read up here to find its usually an O2 sensor problem on the city. There was some mention that it comes on because of O2 sensor only when engine is hot. So tried cranking this morning after the car was standing overnight. The light again came up within 5 seconds even though the engine was cold and in high RPM. The service center guy came. he checked the light and immediately opened the bonnet. Removed the negative terminal for about half a minute and fitted it back. The problem persisted. He then said ' yeh to koi electrical fault hai mechanical nahi, gadi le jata hun hamara electrician dekh lega '. So sent it to him. Now im scared to think of the result. Will probably have to take it to the Honda Dealer. This is the first problem the car has had after four wonderful years, but its turning out to be a bad one. Any advice on what it could be? Will keep everyone posted about the result and seek advice before doing anything else. @MODS: Please change thread title to ' City ZX clutch changed, now Check Engine Light is ON. ' or anything more suitable to make this thread visible and get an eye of the experts.
	() Thanks

26th October 2010, 12:11	#10
manikjeet Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: chandigarh Posts: 1,618 Thanked: 295 Times View My Garage	its a O2 sensor and would require changing you will also feel a little power drop and the engine would be rough it will cost you around 14k from the dealer and about 3.5k from outside original from a totaled nhc but push your friend for the replacement as its totally their fualt
	() Thanks

30th October 2010, 23:07	#11
guptavis BHPian Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: chandigarh Posts: 339 Thanked: 66 Times	Sorry for the late update. Car was returned in the afternoon. They said there was some fault with a wire being loose. Now the light behaviour is normal. Comes on for a second when switching to 'ON' position and then goes away. Car is running fine since then. It turned out to be a smooth change with a minor hiccup after all ! Alls well that ends well. @manikjeet: Issue fixed. thankfully without changing the sensor. And the garage is run by my father's friend not my friend. Thanks to all who posted!
	() Thanks