[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Simpler body panels on the force one, calls for lesser replacements and easier denting. Btw forday explorer III is in its 5/6 year so body panels shouldnt be an issue.

Thanks for the assurance so hopefully body panels will be available for the next 10 years or so. BTW, these days for newer vehicles, panels are generally repalced than dented.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

ABS is now standard in all SUVs in the 17 lakhs range and above and all Scorpios SLE & Above. Ford actually has a website that you provide this information.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

I am comparing a safari vx/ scorpio highest version to the force one. Force one seems quite reasonably priced compared to these two cars wrt price/performance/equipment wise

You forgot the new kid on the block XUV500 which is offered in the same price range.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

dont agree to this. Simpler body construction, old school ladder on frame and proven engine, translates to lesser mantainance costs, and apart from regular servicing, dont expect gremlins and bugs the kind we see in the safari. Btw at 13lac otr force one is fully loaded, the w6 is not quite there, and w8 is around 15lac. SO if force one 4x4 with abs comes at W8 pricing is'int it perfect?

Jeep Cherokees & Mitsubishi Moteros have been hitting the trail with Monoque structures for many years now. For majority of uses, Monoque will do fine especially since Force 1 is offered only in 2WD.

Body on Frame SUV doesn't necessarily mean lower maintenance costs.

I do agree that If Force 1 comes with 4WD and ABS/Air Bags for about 12 lakhs ex-show room, it will make sense for people who need a proper 4x4 SUV. However, in 2WD guise, it is not making much sense the way it is offered now.

BTW. what do you mean by fully Loaded? MP3, Player, Power Windows, AC, Power Steering, etc?? I guess a couple of years back you could call this fully loaded. If F1 is fully loaded, What do you think about the W8?

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Force one is direct competition to the safari/scorpio price wise and the endevour/fortuner feature wise. Endevour/fortuner size/road presence, gud equipment and half the price. I think it seems perfect in theory, although I dont know how it shall perform. Looking at the trax I am sure force one would be a headache free buy for its customers.

A vehicle competition is generally other vehicles in it's price bracket. Do you think a Safari/Scorpio buyer will not evaluate the F1 against the XUV500 that falls in the same price bracket with more bells & whistles.

[ethanhunt123]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

agreed. Abs/ebd should be given, however I am not sure if the lower version of a 17lac endevour has abs or not

All Endaevour's come with dual airbags and ABS/EBD. Only thing missing in lower version is side airbags.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

I am comparing a safari vx/ scorpio highest version to the force one. Force one seems quite reasonably priced compared to these two cars wrt price/performance/equipment wise

Biggest Miss - no ABS or Airbags or 4x4. This would be essential compared to the other "features" Force One comes with. Other two have wide service network, brand image, cheap spares which Force One misses out on. And as mentioned elsewhere, even Safari/Scorpio highest variants look highly overpriced with the arrival of XUV; no way Force One seems VFM.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

dont agree to this. Simpler body construction, old school ladder on frame and proven engine, translates to lesser mantainance costs, and apart from regular servicing, dont expect gremlins and bugs the kind we see in the safari. Btw at 13lac otr force one is fully loaded, the w6 is not quite there, and w8 is around 15lac. SO if force one 4x4 with abs comes at W8 pricing is'int it perfect?

Scorpio owners dont complain of niggles relating to engine/transmission so there goes Force One advantage. As far as other gadgetry is concerned, even Force One would have similiar niggles, and i would trust M&M to take care of them much better than Force One guys.

BTW what does W6 miss out on which Force One has ? I dont recall any miss on W6 which makes it "not quite there" while the most glaring omission in Force One is lack of any safety features.

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Force one is direct competition to the safari/scorpio price wise and the endevour/fortuner feature wise. Endevour/fortuner size/road presence, gud equipment and half the price. I think it seems perfect in theory, although I dont know how it shall perform. Looking at the trax I am sure force one would be a headache free buy for its customers.

Wrong ! Force One is direct competition to XUV/Endy price wise and Safari/Scorpio feature wise. Only thing is has is space and road presence.

And i am sure Trax is a headache free buy for its customers; after-all with only 4-5 customers per dealer, they would be receiving personalized service isn't it

[ebonho]

Some photos of the Force One taken at their showroom (Pratham Force, Tathawade, Pune). It seems their sole TD vehicle was banged up bad by one of their drivers, and is currently being repaired. So the new "promise" date for the TD is next Tuesday. Let's see ....

[bblost]

On my way to my daughter's monthly doc visit, spotted a new Force Motors Showroom just before Lotus Children's Hospital (Lakdi ka pul, Hyderabad).

They had a Black Force One parked outside. Its looks nice. I hope they rationalize the prices in view of the new XUV500. I would love to have this one, if I could afford it.

Strangely my wife who otherwise hates all the Safari's and Scorpio's and Bolero's found this good looking.

[ebonho]

Ok sorry about the last post .... was figuring out how to upload photos into the post. Here are the remaining:

The engine and chassis


Front suspension



The transmission



Rear suspension



Another view from the side



Engine from the side



Front seating



Middle row seating



Middle row split - first fold



Middle row split - fold and lift (only partial)



Boot space



Third row and boot space



Boot space seating (optional)



Third row seating



Third row leg space



Third row leg space (top view)



Third row seating - leg and head space



Third row seating - shoulder and leg spread space



Getting out of third row (ungainly adult)



Ground clearance rear shot



Under-body shot

[Auto freak]

@ebonho,
Thanks for the comprehensive set of pictures!
That should clear all doubts about the third row and boot space.
i especially loved the boot space seating pic!

I have a doubt about the partial folding middle row seats.
Is it the head rest that is preventing the seat from folding down fully?
Will it fold down completely if head rests are removed?

EDIT: if you can let us know the height of the person seated in the car, please!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Auto freak

@ebonho,
Thanks for the comprehensive set of pictures!
That should clear all doubts about the third row and boot space.
i especially loved the boot space seating pic!

I have a doubt about the partial folding middle row seats.
Is it the head rest that is preventing the seat from folding down fully?
Will it fold down completely if head rests are removed?

EDIT: if you can let us know the height of the person seated in the car, please!

Thanks auto freak! The space may look good but there is something not very comfortable about the seating in the middle and third row which I cannot put a handle on. Thigh support probably. The knees are a little bent, cause the floor in both these rows is higher than normal and has funny ridges, protuberances, which impede comfortable foot placement. Also no space under the seats in front for the feet to tuck/overflow into. The so-called "leather" seats is actually art leather of not very refined quality or stitching.

As for the folding question, I don't think they fold completely, head rest or not, like the Xylo seat does. The back (third) row seats without the headrests actually end somewhat incompletely/abruptly mid-back (not comfortable). When showroom guys were asked why no head-rests in a 13 lac car, the reply was "they would impeded the driver's rear view, so have purposely been excluded." If so, was (mentally) wondering what Force Motors was planning on doing about the heads and shoulders of the passengers on those seats ....

The height of the person is 181 cm (6 ft).

[MAS]

@ebonho

Excellent pictures that speak a lot about the car.

Who is the person in your pictures? Looks like a participant from the WWF. If he is just 6 ft, then the roof of the SUV seems to be too low. My height is 185 cm and i will have difficult in fitting in the front seats.

Will check out the car this weekend and post my comments.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by MAS

Looks like a participant from the WWF.

Thanks man. Good genes and nutrition. 95 kilos and a 40-inch chest.

[ebonho]

It gets better and better as another promised TD date (by appointment) comes and unfailingly goes. I get a call from the Sales Manager at Pratham Force about sending the car over for a TD. Apparently the time slot of 7 pm does not suit them as their showroom is "across the city on the highway" and by the time they get back it will be very late. Can I make it earlier, say 5 pm? Can I make it in the morning? Can I make it in the afternoon? Negatives to all of the above are met with "will confirm and call you back." The call back comes. Can we do this tomorrow? Day after tomorrow? No. Another "call you back." Call back comes, with the Sales Manager now claiming that the TD vehicle is in front of him and has come back from post accident repairs but is not in a fit state for a TD. The AC is not working (wonder what accident does that to an AC). The wheel arch is wrongly fitted. The grille is fixed with only a couple of screws, etc etc. I thank the gentleman politely for his time and put the receiver down. Force One? Thanks but no thanks!

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by ebonho

...but is not in a fit state for a TD. The AC is not working (wonder what accident does that to an AC). The wheel arch is wrongly fitted. The grille is fixed with only a couple of screws, etc etc. I thank the gentleman politely for his time and put the receiver down. Force One? Thanks but no thanks!

Hey..thanks a lot for the pics! Force One is going down the drain I guess. The attitude from most dealers [per the thread] is not re-assuring. Can't really think what is going to be the A$$ experience if this is the pre-sale attitude?!!

And if the dealer's car is serviced this pathetic by their on A$$, do the customers even hold a chance if they get into some major accidents?? Compare their attitude to the blockbuster HIT XUV 500 !! The sales guys are so down to earth even after the product is sold out!! M&M, I give you one more brownie point for your attitude.

Force One, 2 more negative points!

[MAS]

Originally Posted by ebonho

It gets better and better as another promised TD date (by appointment) comes and unfailingly goes. I get a call from the Sales Manager at Pratham Force about sending the car over for a TD. Apparently the time slot of 7 pm does not suit them as their showroom is "across the city on the highway" and by the time they get back it will be very late. Can I make it earlier, say 5 pm? Can I make it in the morning? Can I make it in the afternoon? Negatives to all of the above are met with "will confirm and call you back." The call back comes. Can we do this tomorrow? Day after tomorrow? No. Another "call you back." Call back comes, with the Sales Manager now claiming that the TD vehicle is in front of him and has come back from post accident repairs but is not in a fit state for a TD. The AC is not working (wonder what accident does that to an AC). The wheel arch is wrongly fitted. The grille is fixed with only a couple of screws, etc etc. I thank the gentleman politely for his time and put the receiver down. Force One? Thanks but no thanks!

That is bad. I guess the Sales Manager is on competitor's pay roll. On second thought, who needs competition if we have such jokers as Sales Managers? Force One seems to have cooked up the right formula to fail!!!

[lurker]

And this is happening in Pune, the home base of Force one. Can not the company take ownership of this particular dealership and take stock of things in their own burrow. It somehow seems they are demoralized by XUV's success, but still this is a diesel car and will sell well.

[neoonwheels]

Originally Posted by ebonho

It gets better and better as another promised TD date (by appointment) comes and unfailingly goes. I get a call from the Sales Manager at Pratham Force about sending the car over for a TD. Apparently the time slot of 7 pm does not suit them as their showroom is "across the city on the highway" and by the time they get back it will be very late. Can I make it earlier, say 5 pm? Can I make it in the morning? Can I make it in the afternoon? Negatives to all of the above are met with "will confirm and call you back." The call back comes. Can we do this tomorrow? Day after tomorrow? No. Another "call you back." Call back comes, with the Sales Manager now claiming that the TD vehicle is in front of him and has come back from post accident repairs but is not in a fit state for a TD. The AC is not working (wonder what accident does that to an AC). The wheel arch is wrongly fitted. The grille is fixed with only a couple of screws, etc etc. I thank the gentleman politely for his time and put the receiver down. Force One? Thanks but no thanks!

This seems to be the same 'Pratham' TATA motors had as a dealer. Apparently the dealer was never famous for his service even in TATA era. Force One would sink without a trace post XUV it looks like.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

The attitude from most dealers [per the thread] is not re-assuring. Can't really think what is going to be the A$$ experience if this is the pre-sale attitude?!!

And if the dealer's car is serviced this pathetic by their on A$$, do the customers even hold a chance if they get into some major accidents?? Compare their attitude to the blockbuster HIT XUV 500 !! The sales guys are so down to earth even after the product is sold out!! M&M, I give you one more brownie point for your attitude.

Force One, 2 more negative points!

Exactly. The lest one would expect in a non-monopoly market (not to mention brand new entrant) is an attitude to exceed expectations AT LEAST till the sale is made. Their attitude and the issues with the sole TD vehicle would send chills up the spine of any potential customer thinking of plonking down 13 Lacs for a new vehicle.

Originally Posted by MAS

That is bad. I guess the Sales Manager is on competitor's pay roll. On second thought, who needs competition if we have such jokers as Sales Managers? Force One seems to have cooked up the right formula to fail!!!

The Sales Manager (a Mr. Rahul) seemed cooperative enough in person and did the necessary phone follow-ups. But its the end result that counts .... and that is no TD YET after nearly 2 weeks of following up. INCLUDING a visit to their place as well (the mountain and mohammad paradigm). The scary part is that he is apparently the apex point of escalation at Pratham. Where does one go from there?

Originally Posted by lurker

And this is happening in Pune, the home base of Force one. Can not the company take ownership of this particular dealership and take stock of things in their own burrow. It somehow seems they are demoralized by XUV's success, but still this is a diesel car and will sell well.

That is what is surprising. Notwithstanding the fact that the cars are actually made in Pithampur (MP), the fact remains that Pune is the Firodia's home turf. If Puneites go through this, then one can only imagine what's happening in the rest of the country.

Funny you should mention it but there was actually a tone of resignation in the sales force's voices when they kind of apologised that the company was making very few vehicles, very far apart (as an explanation to why the low key ad campaign, long delivery "promise" dates of 2-3 months, and insufficient display/TD vehicles/showrooms).

Originally Posted by neoonwheels

This seems to be the same 'Pratham' TATA motors had as a dealer. Apparently the dealer was never famous for his service even in TATA era. Force One would sink without a trace post XUV it looks like.

Yes, same Pratham. Though there seems to be a "Company Showroom" somewhere on Symbiosis road as well (close by to the Marriott).