[indian21r]

Service History For Cars. I just got them from the Service Center as the file in the office is missing. Forgot completely about the shock absorbers issue. To many and too frequent to remember or keep track off.

[V-16]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

you know, even the new XUV500 is yet to prove itself in the market with all its electronic gizmos. one of the reasons that Im staying away from that vehicle is exactly this reason.
my Dad's 5.5 year old Tata Indica Turbo Diesel is still going absolutely strong. very few hassles so far touch wood. but this is the point - they've got one or two vehicles right but the rest of their offerings are suspect.
why so many compromises I wonder, considering they also own the real big boys now - JLR etc!

I have heard from many quarters that the Dual Mass Flywheel is packing up in the XUV 500. Though this is the general report that i have received, i have also come across an owner who had this problem so it was replaced but there are some other, related problems which have cropped up. Besides this, there is a problem with the rear mounts (as you know this is a monococque and these rear mounts are probably placed wrongly or simply are of a incorrect shape or whatever, this is just my guess, the matter may be altogether another one) The Body has considerable sway during speed which should not be in a Monococque. Still i will conform and let you guys know.

[raj_5004]

1) Cold starting problem
2) Gear gets stuck
3) Tachometer not working
4) ORVM controls not working properly
5) Cigarette lighter/power outlet not working
6) Door lock problems
7) Inaccurate odometer/tripmeter
8) hard suspension
9) brake pedal felt soft
10) noisy gearbox
11) brake jam
12) brake shudder
13) Clutch failure
14) electrical issues

This does not seem normal. you should definitely demand a replacement.

[souravc]

Sorry to hear about your problems . Thats quite a list of things not working in a new vehicle . I find it strange that people sometimes try to pin the blame on the buyer by saying "PDI not done properly " - what the heck , if I am buying a 17 lakhs worth of machine ( which as is seems to be overpriced as Aria is ) why should a PDI be such a make or break thing ? You are writing the cheque , that should be good enough - its the responsibility of the manufacturer and the dealer to deliver you the goods in perfect order. Just because our consumer protection system is weak because of a slow judiciary , consistent pathetic quality problems continue to go unpunished. I love the Safari for what it is but I would never put my money on a Tata machine because of their quality issues - during monsoons if I am following an Indica I keep enough gap so that in case the Indica conks out, I (and consequently the traffic) won't get stuck behind it. I have been saved thrice including a flaming
one .
Is Tata's Aria assembly line so overworked servicing the piddly trickle of sales that they cannot have an overdose of quality control to justify the price tag?
I would say cut your losses , sell these lemons and go for Innovas . Its no use spending your money and buying headaches and that too ample of them.

[indian21r]

Originally Posted by raj_5004

Just when I had thought that the old TATA days are gone & the ARIA is a good quality car

old habits die hard. I feel the system in Tata has become too rigid to accept change.

Originally Posted by amrisharm

A very well timed Topic. With car companies launching new products left right and centre, issues like these will hopefully make people think a little before jumping onto new products blindly. To say your experience with the Aria has been bad would be a gross understatement. Hope things get sorted out soon. And thank you for your timely warning.

Indian firms have to improve. Automobile manufacturing is probably the one of few manufacturing areas that Indians are gaining ground. But to hold it they have to be at par with the best in quality.

Originally Posted by MaserQ

One would have thought that Tata would have ironed out most of its flaws with the Aria. But the ownership reviews that are emerging seem to suggest otherwise. Niggling issues in a car such as the Aria is simply unacceptable.

A lot of JLR elements have trickled down into making the Aria. But sadly, the QC process does not seem to be one of them. I once had a candid conversation with a Tata Motors executive who said that his company functioned liked a government entity, hinting at a resistance to change with the times. Old habits do die hard...

True

Originally Posted by GTO

Firstly, I'm extremely sorry to hear of your experience. This, exactly, was what all of us are afraid of with Tata's new launches. One line in the first post of my report read:If Tata wants to sell a premium car, they should get the fundamentals sorted first. Heck, a 2.5 lakh rupee Maruti 800 is niggle free...which Aria owner is going to tolerate such serious issues?! I own an Indigo and the experience from the 3rd - 4th year (current) has been depressing. So many niggles & problems that I have lost count.

You have obviously gotten a lemon. Either get Tata to replace them, or minimise your losses, sell the Arias and buy an Innova. There is a reason why the Innova & Fortuner sell so well; to most buyers (moi included), reliability is of paramount importance.

Thank you for this extremely valuable post, and highlighting just the purpose of Team-BHP.

If any verification is required, Team-BHP Moderators will step right in. Indian21r is a BHPian since 5 years, with many posts & threads to his credit. We have no reason to doubt the authenticity of this thread. If anyone wishes to discuss this further, please use the contact us form.

I will see the feedback that we get from yesterdays breakdown and then take a call. For the wider audience I have uploaded the service history so that they have some idea of what may fail. Well practically anything can fail here.

Originally Posted by raj_5004

1) Cold starting problem
2) Gear gets stuck
3) Tachometer not working
4) ORVM controls not working properly
5) Cigarette lighter/power outlet not working
6) Door lock problems
7) Inaccurate odometer/tripmeter
8) hard suspension
9) brake pedal felt soft
10) noisy gearbox
11) brake jam
12) brake shudder
13) Clutch failure
14) electrical issues

This does not seem normal. you should definitely demand a replacement.

Thanks for listing out. This will increase further once we get the feedback and reasons for third breakdown. Infact I asked Tata Motors whether we are being used as R&D team. If they had even an ounce of responsibility they would have addressed it.

Originally Posted by souravc

Sorry to hear about your problems . Thats quite a list of things not working in a new vehicle . I find it strange that people sometimes try to pin the blame on the buyer by saying "PDI not done properly " - what the heck , if I am buying a 17 lakhs worth of machine ( which as is seems to be overpriced as Aria is ) why should a PDI be such a make or break thing ? You are writing the cheque , that should be good enough - its the responsibility of the manufacturer and the dealer to deliver you the goods in perfect order.
Is Tata's Aria assembly line so overworked servicing the piddly trickle of sales that they cannot have an overdose of quality control to justify the price tag?
I would say cut your losses , sell these lemons and go for Innovas . Its no use spending your money and buying headaches and that too ample of them.

Even in a PDI all we can see is what is visible and any odd sounds. Beyond that it is more to do with the quality of parts in running. I just feel that the car is not well designed. Even if they get best parts not mating them properly cause uneven wear and tear reducing the lifespan of the parts. This I feel is the more critical issue. They have to go back to the drawing board.

[Pashin]

Sorry to hear about such a disappointing experience from the Aria. After all its one product that was "supposed" to be niggle free. I just cannot imagine someone spending upwards of 15 lac Rs to own such a product.

I guess the best is to approach the consumer forum and push for a complete replacement or refund. You do have the documents to prove that it is a defective product from day one.

As time goes I cannot imagine the situation improving.

[Lalvaz]

Originally Posted by noopster

Absolutely appalling. But I guess it was the thing a lot of us were fearing. You load a car with electronics the way Tat has the Aria and you're bound to have issues.

I gather from your posts that all this happened when you were not around: how certain are you that the cars were driven well? Not that it matters, because even of they weren't, there is no reason for all this to happen!

Whats the electronics got to do with serious mechanical issues such as clutch plate failure, disk break failure, shock absorber failures?

I also see a lot of posts requesting the threadop to write to Mr.Ratan Tata or Mr.Behram or someone else, and I appreciate the attempts to help resolve his issues, but is'nt that a pathetic request. This bloke has trusted a particular brand name, and assumed he was buying a premium product, but gets a lemon, sorry, 2 lemons. He escalates the issue through the service center, which is the correct procedure, and he still does not get any resolution for such serious issues.

In some other threads, some folks have asked why people are bashing a particular brand, be it a Skoda or a Tata. Its because these companies, by and large, do not value their customers, and do not believe in giving quality products and quality after sales and service.

Indian21r, I think you ought to just sell these 2 lemons, and move onto Toyota Innova, which Im sure will give you many miles of comfortable motoring.

[RadiantKarma]

This is indeed shocking. It's not only about product quality issues, though that really is the gravest part. Your experience also reflects horribly on overall quality practices of the entire Tata system. It all started with lack of PDI, delivery of new premium vehicles in dirty condition, accessories not getting delivered with the car, non-receipt of extended warranty... The extent of your overall experience, even as a rarity, is mind-boggling.

Tatas (oh I so love them as a patriotic citizen!) somehow seem to be breeding government-type bureaucratic organizations. It's one of the private organizations that offers great job security and hardly fires its employees. Wonder if the customer somehow goes for a toss in this employee-centric culture. Tatas, please wake up. We want you to go out and beat the hell out of all those Japanese, European and American car makers. But first get the customer in the centre of the frame!

This experience further reaffirms my belief that inherent quality practices, be it manufacturing or service-related, of a manufacturer are far more important than a car that comes with great looks having premium-quality interiors and fancy gadgets and features. I'd even say, beware of so-called VFM cars!

I do hope that you get your rotten lemons replaced asap for whatever further action you feel appropriate within the organizational setup. Pl. do keep us updated. And all the best!

[Guderian]

This does come across as a rather sad reading and a just simply unacceptable state of affairs. Raises my hackles no end.
The thread kindles my memories of another era altogether, almost 16 years ago - when in one of my previous companies a Tata Estate was ordered rather grandly for my boss, who enjoyed the ride for just a week when it went back to the ASC for one week. And thereafter began its tryst with the ASC and destiny. It was quite an amusing tryst - as in due course of time it became pointless asking as to where the Tata Estate was if it wasn't around, for everyone and his uncle knew that it was at the ASC. So much so my boss was praying for a kindhearted thief to steal the vehicle. But back then even good ol' car thieves had their standards and went by it. After almost 2 years of stormy live in/out, umpteen letters to the company & ASC etc the relationship ended quite sourly for my company which had purchased it and rather joyously for my boss who was condemned to use it.

OK before I am accused of being a Tata basher and wildly going OT - let me state why these memories flashed in my mind.
Mea Culpa ! I confess that at that point of I had influenced the decision of the company to go in for the hulking sloth of a product.

I thought processes and attitudes would have evolved over the years to meet the changing auto scenario after having observed so many products having being launched by the company over the years.
That today the situation in most of the auto companies in India (whether of Indian origins or international brands) is that the products per se are brilliant but are ruined by the sub-standard ASCs thanks to lack of processes, shop floor skills. poor ethics on the part of the proprietors and the inability of the auto cos to control them. I guess I was wrong.
And so was rather sorry to read this thread and realise that things may not really have changed in some of the companies. It could be that this is a one off case - but even then, the experience of the way the company handled the matter is quite disheartening. In this case as the owner of the vehicles is a company there could be a little less of the angst as compared to say and individual owner. One can only imagine the pain if an individual was owning it - not that it is any less in the former for the influencer/decision maker and user in the company which purchased the utterly sour lemons.

I for one have never owned a Tata vehicle after my company's experience as nothing could wash the queasy feelings away, but have a great respect for that brand as far as most of the other products and services are concerned and as a former employee, years ago, in my first assignment.

And the end of my diatribe all I can say is that sell off the Lemons and if it still rankles file a case for compensation in the Consumer Courts.

What can't be compensated is the blow to your reputation in the company for having influenced the decision in favour of the Lemons earlier. But do make amends by boldly suggesting a knock off (of the Lemons !) and suggesting a better quality product - hopefully they'll listen to you this time around too, though with pursed lips and narrowed eyes (just kidding !).

[Sunilrj]

@ GTO The Most dreaded Line in your reviews "Apprehensions over initial niggles with new Tata cars" made me revisit my decision to purchase the Aria when it was launched.

the best option for indian21r would be to send a legal notice to the ASC, Seller and manufacturer and ask them to replace the vehicle or refund the money paid. ofcourse the ASC, Seller and Manufacturer will try to wriggle out of this by quoting the fine prints in their user manuals and warranty certificates that the vehicle has not been used as recomended in the manuals. store the service history very safely, and hunt for a good Lawyer. alternatively you can contact the consumer online research and empowerment centre @ Consumer Online Resource & Empowerment Centre which is supported by the ministry of consumer affairs, Govt. of India who will take up the matter with the Manufacturer. if this also fails then the last option would be the Consumer Court!

[Durango Dude]

Wonder why we don't hear of the word "recall" ever when it comes to the Indian market. Extremely sad to hear of your woes with the Tata Aria Pride. This is an absolute lemon. Goes to say that don't ever jump to buy a newly launched vehicle, especially from Tata and M&M: I think they have the largest R&D center in the world: The Indian populace. Their research and development is half baked and they unleash products on us that are hardly road worthy, we become 'guinea' pigs for these companies in the bargain.

[Guderian]

Originally Posted by Durango Dude

Wonder why we don't hear of the word "recall" ever when it comes to the Indian market. Extremely sad to hear of your woes with the Tata Aria Pride. This is an absolute lemon. Goes to say that don't ever jump to buy a newly launched vehicle, especially from Tata and M&M: I think they have the largest R&D center in the world: The Indian populace. Their research and development is half baked and they unleash products on us that are hardly road worthy, we become 'guinea' pigs for these companies in the bargain.

Hi DD,
When I had the Scorpio CRDe (got one of the first ones in 2005) although a great vehicle in my eyes, I used to joke that the owners are extended arm of M&M's R&D wing. If the rest of the world is outsourcing why not them ?
And by the time I sold it (5.5 years) it had almost 7 retrofits - Vacuum modulator, heat shield, a section of wiring harness, clutch system design change and so on.
But to their credit M&M did the same quite proactively. Though the ASCs are rather loath to inform you of retrofits etc when you land up for routine servicing. Two of the retrofits were spotted by me after reading a circular on the shop floor meant for the Supervisors and some were uncovered through the very active Scorpio Owners' Yahoogroup.

Anyway the old wisdom that one should wait for at least 6-9 months before buying any vehicle introduced by an Indian company still holds good I guess. It's only by then that the issues are truly sorted out through feedback/screams from the extended R&D wing.

[manasmadaan]

Its appalling to say the least, and even that s an understatement. Now one understands why people are skeptical of buying a tata product, especially the one which comes at such a premium. I had recommended aria to 3 people, one of them bought it and s doing fine and the other 2 are still waiting. This will sound as a red alert for them.
I wonder with all these problems in a new car, cant this be returned?? Is not any legal option available regarding this??

[Racer_X]

Man this is Shocking!! Tata rolling out not 1 but 2 lemons!! pathetic!!

Haul them to the consumer court and make them pay for the damages and the mental harrasment you had to go through.

[Dr.Suraj]

Originally Posted by indian21r

This is not the Quality that we were expecting from Tata ARIA after the rigorous testing it had undergone worldwide. I have personally been following the Car from the time the first test Mule was spotted in Europe. Based on the user reviews about improved parts Quality, I was happy that finally TATA MOTORS may have a niggle free car in version1. But they have proven me wrong. I was worried whether I advised my Company a wrong vehicle when 1st Car failed. After the failure of both the Cars I am confident that I made a mistake of not taking Toyota Innova. Their Flagship Product is worse than their cheapest offering, NANO. I have lost Credibility with my Management for taking a decision to buy ARIA when everyone else wanted to go for Innova. I have marked mails to Mr. Telang, CMD Tata Motors, which were acknowledged but I still see no difference
)

This is RIDICULOUS.

Really really upset & sorry to hear about your troubles.

I completely agree with you - this is thoroughly unacceptable. By ANY standards - Tata or non-Tata.

Very bad - if the company continues like this ..... It will spell doom in a very short span.
Such gross technical problems. Absolutely ridiculous.

At the risk of getting some flak - I am going to stick out my neck & say this -
"Do consider for a moment - that this could somewhere be the fault of the Dealer. Since I have had quite some experiences with them in the past & multiple other reviews. Even Tata Motors - usually does not recommend these particular Dealers. They are not willing to be quoted - but I have known a couple of people who have quoted that since this particular dealer has 'volumes' often they push in 'defective' cars - thus ruining the name of the company with their poor service & pathetic policies. Also - I am sure the service centre is also run by the Dealer with the same name - because THEY are the WORST!"