[suhaas307]

^^ The 'box was not tweaked in the Jazz, not for any particular reason. It just wasn't. In fact, most Hondas have similar transmission setups. The power is there, but you need to rev the car to get it. The Jazz begins to fly after 3k RPM. The power delivery gradually increases as the revs are built up. But anything below 3k and even my grandmother can beat it. On foot.

Enthusiasts comprise of only 5% of the automobile buying fraternity, IMO. The rest of them buy cars as owning a car is a 'status-thing' and the majority buy them for 'point-A to point-B' commuting.

So naturally, car companies will design and build a car, keeping in mind the 95% of the people who are more interested in space, ride comfort, etc.

If the Indian market was enthusiast-driven, the Dzire wouldn't exist. The reason why it does, is that the boot 'supposedly' adds practicality to the Swift-package. And that appeals to the 'general-public' more than the enthusiast.

An enthusiast would be happy with the Swift as he wouldn't need the boot to enjoy the dynamic ability of the car. Similarly, the average-Joe wouldn't give two-hoots to the car's dynamics. He is more concerned about getting to his work-place or his weekend getaway in comfort , without burning a hole in his pocket.

Hence the softer suspension setup.

[Turbokick]

Recently had a test drive of new dzire and I must say it drives 90% like the swift and softer suspension doesn't hamper the handling much.
Rather I would say dzire is one fun to drive entry level sedan (in its diesel version which I drove)

Brio on the other hand has got different characteristics. Its superbly chuckable,zippy and very sharp in its behaviour. On city it will be super fun.
On the other hand dzire should be a more matured drive which will be more stable on highways and should handle uneven roads more consistently than the smaller brio. Steering is direct as well

Both cars have excellent engines and revving them should be real fun IMO

[srinivaspai]

Had a look at new D'zire today at a auto expo show in my town.The boot looks definitely miniscule.What question pops up to me is - which is more practical in terms of luggage loading -the new D'zire or swift, considering that at some point the boot has to be closed whereas in the swift the luggage can be loaded to the roof?
having to carry my family of 5 with their luggage on long drives this is a very pertinent aspect .Could some one who has tried it out reply so that I can decide between the two cars?
There has been discussion in this thread about the small boot but does anyone who has a first hand experience reply?

[cruiser_1982]

Originally Posted by srinivaspai

Had a look at new D'zire today at a auto expo show in my town.The boot looks definitely miniscule.What question pops up to me is - which is more practical in terms of luggage loading -the new D'zire or swift, considering that at some point the boot has to be closed whereas in the swift the luggage can be loaded to the roof?
having to carry my family of 5 with their luggage on long drives this is a very pertinent aspect .Could some one who has tried it out reply so that I can decide between the two cars?
There has been discussion in this thread about the small boot but does anyone who has a first hand experience reply?

Loading till roof, though may be an option, should not be done for practical reasons. The rear visibility as such is not very good in swift/Dzire.So if you want a bigger boot like other premium hatches (i20/Punto/Figo/Liva), but still require a Maruti reliability and A.S.S, then Swift Dzire makes sense.I opted for Swift Dzire over swift, purely because of a slightly bigger boot and rear leg space as I am 6 foot 3 inches tall. One area where Swift is more practical than Dzire is the rear seat folding , this would be really helpful during airport runs.IMHO Dzire should be compared against i20/Punto/Liva/Figo rather than proper sedans, due to the smaller boot.

[MadhuG]

Originally Posted by pganapathy

Given that you must have test driven both cars well, how do you feel the handling of the two compare. I test drove the Brio and felt it was one of the best handling cars out there. Reminded me a lot of the old Mini's in the way it was packaged with the wheels out at the corners. The 1.2 engine is peppy enough for the Brio but feels a bit underpowered in the Jazz when the Brio and Jazz are driven back to back.

Yes pganapathy... I have test driven both and I would say that as far as the engine smoothness, gear shift, peppyness etc. is considered, the Brio is better. Having said that, I must empohasize that the Dzire engine is not far behind and is a very competant unit.
However the ride quality of the Dzire is better. Brio is bouncy but dzire suspension soaks the potholes much better.

[MadhuG]

As promised earlier, here is my experience of booking a new car.

Pl. note that the views expressed reg. the various cars here are based purely on my personal experiences and might not have been experienced by others.

Having driven a 2004 Santro Xing for a few years, I felt it was time to upgrade to a better car and hence started my research on the same. I had planned to sell my Santro by end of 2011 and hence started the research in early 2011. My budget for this car was around Rs, 5.25 lacs and hence with that in mind started my research. A diesel hatch was ruled out since I donot drive more than 500kms a month.

The following cars were shortlisted:

1) Ford Figo
2) Hyundai i10
3) Etios Liva
4) Honda Brio

When the research started I had only the Figo and i10 in the list. The other cars within this price such as Ritz, Beat Wagon R etc. were not considered due to various personal preferences.
I test drove all the 4 vehicles. Wifey was there with me for all the test drives. The main idea behind this was to get a feedback reg,. the ride quality from the passenger point of view – both in the front passenger seat and reat seat.

1) Figo – A very spacious car with good interiors and good build quality. The A/C was also good and effective.
Test Drove the Figo Petrol at Chennai Ford at Aminjikarai. The view from the driver’s seat is excellent and a boon for short drivers like me. However, remember that I was driving a Santro and matching the Santro engine’s peppy nature is a tough ask. I found the Figo very sluggish and hence this car was ruled out. Since I had read in a few forums that the FE of Petrol Figo is around 9-10 in the city, I checked this with the sales executive and to my surprise, she agreed to this and explained to me that the reason for this was due to the heavy body for good build quality

2) i10 – The i10 interiors are very good with lot of features incl. gear shift indicator and comparable to hatches offered at a much higher price.
I test drove the i10 at KUN Hyundai, Anna Nagar. I found the engine refined and peppy. However, the ride is bouncy esp. at the rear seat, similar to Santro. However, as an overall package, I found this an excellent choice. With the i10 one cannot go wrong. However, I have read the complaints from a lot of owners about the low FE of i10 which is around 11 in city.
This car was Wifey's original choice

3) Etios Liva - This car was a late entrant into the list since I did not like its shape. It was after my friend purchased a Liva and praised the drive quality of the car that I paid attention to it. Test drove the Liva at Lanson Toyota, Koyembedu. The ride and handling of Liva are excellent. The steering is very light and precise. Another important point worth mentioning is that this was the only car in all 4 which I could drive in the 5th gear at 30 kmph speeds. This shows the performance of the engine. The car is very spacious inside; infact the most spacious among all the cars in the list. The boot too is good enough at 251 ltrs. However, the interiors of the Liva are very mediocre and cost cutting is evident at many places. The dash board, placed at the centre, of the test drive car was easily shaking when I tried shaking it.
The noise and vibration levels inside the car are high especially at the rear seat.
Since wifey accompanied me for all test drives, I received a very important input from her during the Liva test drive. She was complaining that sitting at the rear seat, she felt as if she had kept her hand on the mixie that we use in the kitchen instead of the rear seat. Such was the amount of Vibration at the rear. This in-spite of the fact that the test drive was conducted on the Chennai Bye-pass highway at a speed of 60 kmph.
As a result, Liva was out of reckoning.

4) Brio: For the Brio, I have only one word – WOW!! What a package. I hope that explains it all.
I test drove the vehicle at Olympia Honda, Ambattur. It has great looks, the super smooth i-Vtec engine is very peppy and responsive and the E.P.steering is spot-on and ultra light. The turning radius at 4.2 mtr is one of the lowest in the segment – not sure whether it is THE lowest - thus makes it very easy to maneuver, park etc. The interiors are very good and the space inside is surprisingly high keeping in view the compact appearance of the car.
The all Glass hatch is a new concept and looks great. It also aids rear visibility. The ride though is a bit bouncy on potholes. The Liva is miles ahead of the Brio in this aspect. The only sore point in the Brio is the boot which, at 175 ltrs is small, though deep.
Wifey was all praise for the car for its looks and interiors.
Since boot was of least preference to me, I finalized the Brio S MT RED which had all the features except Airbags, alloy wheels and ABS and a few tit bits. I booked the car on 17th Dec 2011 at Olympia Honda. While booking, I was told that the car would be delivered by Feb 1st week.

Hence, the wait started and on Jan 21st, I went to the showroom to enquire reg. the dispatch/arrival of the car and they informed me that the car had not arrived yet.
After waiting for a few more days, I called up Honda Customer care and enquired about the expected delivery date of the car to the Olympia showroom. I was informed that the car would arrive in Feb 1st week and delivery would be made by 2nd week. Again the wait started and it was already Feb 15. I once again enquired with the SE reg. the delivery and this time he informed me that the car would be dispatched from Noida by Feb and I would get the car by March 10th only.

Enter Swift Dzire:

Meanwhile, the New Swift Dzire was launched in Feb 1st week and I saw the review in a few news channels and read it in this forum. I never liked the shape of the first Dzire as well as the swift. But I like the new Dzire and the pricing was a huge surprise to me.
Test drove the Dzire at Popular Motors, Anna Nagar and was mightly impressed with the ride, handling and the peppy and responsive engine. The inside space, features and premium interiors (compared to usual Maruti interiors) were way ahead of the old Dzire.
The rear of the car looks much much better now and the tail lamps give a sporty and dynamic look to the car.
Hence, I booked the Dzire LXi Pacific Blue and later upgraded the booking to VXi. I feel that at 6.1 lacs, the Dzire Vxi is a great package.

I was told that the waiting period is around a month, but I am trying to get it earlier than that. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Would be writing in detail reg. the PDI and delivery process once I get the car.


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[misquitas]

Originally Posted by MadhuG

1) Figo – A very spacious car with good interiors and good build quality. The A/C was also good and effective.
Test Drove the Figo Petrol at Chennai Ford at Aminjikarai. The view from the driver’s seat is excellent and a boon for short drivers like me. However, remember that I was driving a Santro and matching the Santro engine’s peppy nature is a tough ask. I found the Figo very sluggish and hence this car was ruled out. Since I had read in a few forums that the FE of Petrol Figo is around 9-10 in the city, I checked this with the sales executive and to my surprise, she agreed to this and explained to me that the reason for this was due to the heavy body for good build quality


...I booked the Dzire LXi Pacific Blue and later upgraded the booking to VXi. I feel that at 6.1 lacs, the Dzire Vxi is a great package.

I was told that the waiting period is around a month, but I am trying to get it earlier than that. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Would be writing in detail reg. the PDI and delivery process once I get the car.

Interesting to note your process of elimination and final choice of Dzire. What I noticed is that in this process you ended up hiking your budget from Rs 5.25L to Rs 6.1L.

With a budget of Rs 6.1L, other candidates could have entered the fray. For instance, I could quickly think of the Figo diesel. The reason why you opted out of the Figo petrol was its poor mileage. A diesel Figo (and you could have opted for a higher end version of the Figo diesel with the extended budget) a would have given you a capable engine, a good boot space, great driver visibility, superb AC, a better FE, PLUS the benefits of cheaper fuel (whether you drive a lot or not).

But then, you can hardly go wrong with Dzire, one of the most popular sedans in the country. Or is the new Dzire still classified as a sedan?

[MadhuG]

Originally Posted by misquitas

Interesting to note your process of elimination and final choice of Dzire. What I noticed is that in this process you ended up hiking your budget from Rs 5.25L to Rs 6.1L.

With a budget of Rs 6.1L, other candidates could have entered the fray. For instance, I could quickly think of the Figo diesel. The reason why you opted out of the Figo petrol was its poor mileage. A diesel Figo (and you could have opted for a higher end version of the Figo diesel with the extended budget) a would have given you a capable engine, a good boot space, great driver visibility, superb AC, a better FE, PLUS the benefits of cheaper fuel (whether you drive a lot or not).

But then, you can hardly go wrong with Dzire, one of the most popular sedans in the country. Or is the new Dzire still classified as a sedan?


PS: Your post contains too many Smilies. Isn't that restricted to only two per post on this forum?

Thanks misquitas.
There were a couple of reasons for not booking the figo diesel. One the relatively higher maintenance cost of Ford cars after a few years, as I understsnd from my friends. Not sure whether this is true.
Two, the low GC - many Figos in our apartments have their bottoms hitting the pothole ridden roads, inviting high repair costs.

Is there a cap on the smilies? My post is quite big, hence i presume I get an exemption

[misquitas]

Originally Posted by MadhuG

Thanks misquitas.
There were a couple of reasons for not booking the figo diesel. One the relatively higher maintenance cost of Ford cars after a few years, as I understsnd from my friends. Not sure whether this is true.
Two, the low GC - many Figos in our apartments have their bottoms hitting the pothole ridden roads, inviting high repair costs.

Ford cars may have had the earlier perception of being expensive to maintain, but I understand that that perception may not exist now, or at least with the Figo, since parts are localized and are as cheap as those of the Swift.

Having said that, the Figo's ground clearance is an issue with many owners and it is a real pity that Ford did not address this issue while testing the car.

My point is, with a budget of about Rs 6.1 lakh, you would have had a wider choice of vehicles. It is interesting that you opted for the Dzire. If I wanted a petrol car and if my budget was about Rs 6.1 lakh, I would have considered only one car -- the base Jazz.

Or else, the soon-to-be-launched Petrol Ertiga, assuming that the Petrol Ertiga falls within the the Rs 6.1 lakh bracket.

[MadhuG]

Originally Posted by misquitas

Ford cars may have had the earlier perception of being expensive to maintain, but I understand that that perception may not exist now, or at least with the Figo, since parts are localized and are as cheap as those of the Swift.

Having said that, the Figo's ground clearance is an issue with many owners and it is a real pity that Ford did not address this issue while testing the car.

My point is, with a budget of about Rs 6.1 lakh, you would have had a wider choice of vehicles. It is interesting that you opted for the Dzire. If I wanted a petrol car and if my budget was about Rs 6.1 lakh, I would have considered only one car -- the base Jazz.

Or else, the soon-to-be-launched Petrol Ertiga, assuming that the Petrol Ertiga falls within the the Rs 6.1 lakh bracket.

Jazz again has a problem with GC. My neighbour has a Jazz since the last 2 years but due to severe hits at the belly, had to purchase another car. When he enquired with Honda to rectify the issue, the reply he got was that he should drive only on good roads

[rameshnanda]

"Maruti Suzuki has said it expects the new Dzire to generate a higher market share in the entry-level sedan market. The company has already fuelled a price war in the segment as the new version is priced around Rs 25000-30000 cheaper than the previous-generation model. "

Link to the news - Maruti Suzuki bets big on the new Dzire - The Economic Times

Clever Marketing I should say. Facelifted entry level sedan (?) available at a lesser price .

[MadhuG]

My 2 cents-

I feel that buying the new swift dzire with the terrific engine, driveability, ride & handling and A.S.S coupled with unmatched low maintenance costs of a Maruti at a cost lower than the old Dzire makes terrific sense. The LXi, without music system, power windows and central locking, costs just 35 to 40K more than a hatch like i10/Honda Brio/Etios Liva.
For those aspiring for a feature rich sedan, the VXi is a fully loaded one (except Airbags, ABS and alloy wheels) and comes at 6 lacs which is a very good price for a sedan. The interior quality as mentioned by GTO has improved a lot over the earlier Dzire. And as we all know, a sedan (read big car ) always gets more respect and envy than a hatch, atleast in India.
I am sure most of those who had the earlier Dzire would have rarely used the full capacity of the boot. Hence this is a ideal package, esp. for for majority of us who want the space and features of a sedan, at a lower cost. I foresee a lot of people, planning a hatch, upgrading to this one.

BTW, hope I would not be wrong in calling this a SEDAN

[misquitas]

Originally Posted by MadhuG

My 2 cents-

I feel that buying the new swift dzire with the terrific engine, driveability, ride & handling and A.S.S coupled with unmatched low maintenance costs of a Maruti at a cost lower than the old Dzire makes terrific sense. The LXi, without music system, power windows and central locking, costs just 35 to 40K more than a hatch like i10/Honda Brio/Etios Liva.
For those aspiring for a feature rich sedan, the VXi is a fully loaded one (except Airbags, ABS and alloy wheels) and comes at 6 lacs which is a very good price for a sedan. The interior quality as mentioned by GTO has improved a lot over the earlier Dzire. And as we all know, a sedan (read big car ) always gets more respect and envy than a hatch, atleast in India.
I am sure most of those who had the earlier Dzire would have rarely used the full capacity of the boot. Hence this is a ideal package, esp. for for majority of us who want the space and features of a sedan, at a lower cost. I foresee a lot of people, planning a hatch, upgrading to this one.

BTW, hope I would not be wrong in calling this a SEDAN

The reason why I questioned the status of Dzire as 'sedan' is because Maruti Dzire's own website describes the 'body type' as a NOTCH BACK.

Having said that, it is true that sedans tend to get better respect here in India. And it is equally true that the new Dzire is upgraded in almost every area from its predecessor.

I, however, doubt that I would have considered a Dzire, if I had to buy a car at this point in time, because of the following reasons:

1. In my opinion, the Dzire is neither here (hatch) nor there (sedan). It is not a compact hatch nor is it a "caaaar" like a proper sedan. If I wanted a petrol sedan, I may have considered a Toyota Etios or a Tata Manza, both of which would have been within or around the Rs 6.2 lakh bracket. Moreover, they would have had a big cabin and a huge boot.

2. Newer hatchs (Figo, Jazz, Polo, etc) feature fairly large booths, which are almost as large as the Dzire boot. Moreover, most of these hatches offer either split seats or a fully folding rear seat and this adds huge depth and height to the cargo area, if and when the need arises. The new Dzire neither has a rear folding seat nor has the height of the boot (with the parcel tray removed) in a hatch.

But, you have every reason to opt for the Dzire, especially since the features and benefits of the Dzire appeal to you. Hoping to read your ownership report soon.

[p'arth]

Originally Posted by srinivaspai

Had a look at new D'zire today at a auto expo show in my town.The boot looks definitely miniscule.What question pops up to me is - which is more practical in terms of luggage loading -the new D'zire or swift, considering that at some point the boot has to be closed whereas in the swift the luggage can be loaded to the roof?
having to carry my family of 5 with their luggage on long drives this is a very pertinent aspect .Could some one who has tried it out reply so that I can decide between the two cars?
There has been discussion in this thread about the small boot but does anyone who has a first hand experience reply?

I have done similar boot size comparison between i20 and new Dzire. I found the boot of i20 more practical - I could accomodate 2 international sized suitcases in standing position in i20 but no way in new DZire. Refer to my ownership thread for pics on this.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post2691882

In your case, the Swift has even less boot space - only advantage being you can fold the seats. I'd recommend if boot space is important for you, go with the DZire and think of options like roof carraige when required (Also pointed out by GTO). Else think of hatches with large boot space like i20, Polo or Figo.

[MadhuG]

Originally Posted by misquitas

The reason why I questioned the status of Dzire as 'sedan' is because Maruti Dzire's own website describes the 'body type' as a NOTCH BACK.

Having said that, it is true that sedans tend to get better respect here in India. And it is equally true that the new Dzire is upgraded in almost every area from its predecessor.

I, however, doubt that I would have considered a Dzire, if I had to buy a car at this point in time, because of the following reasons:

1. In my opinion, the Dzire is neither here (hatch) nor there (sedan). It is not a compact hatch nor is it a "caaaar" like a proper sedan. If I wanted a petrol sedan, I may have considered a Toyota Etios or a Tata Manza, both of which would have been within or around the Rs 6.2 lakh bracket. Moreover, they would have had a big cabin and a huge boot.

2. Newer hatchs (Figo, Jazz, Polo, etc) feature fairly large booths, which are almost as large as the Dzire boot. Moreover, most of these hatches offer either split seats or a fully folding rear seat and this adds huge depth and height to the cargo area, if and when the need arises. The new Dzire neither has a rear folding seat nor has the height of the boot (with the parcel tray removed) in a hatch.

But, you have every reason to opt for the Dzire, especially since the features and benefits of the Dzire appeal to you. Hoping to read your ownership report soon.

1) I agree that the Manza is a very good car and I like that car. However, Tata and Fiat cars were always out of question due to the A.S.S/maintenance issues.
As regards Toyota Etios, the cost of the the G variant is 6.4 lacs on road in Chennai (G variant is with speakers alone w/o a music system/radio, w/o fog lights) which is 30K more than the Dzire Vxi. Also, the Toyota can never match Maruti in A.S.S, mileage and spare parts cost. Also, the Etios Pertol is not as fun to drive as Dzire. Moreover, a huge boot was never my requirement. Hence the notchback made sense to me.

2) As regards the hatches mentioned here, I already had written about the GC issue with Figo. The Jazz though an excelent car and a Honda at that, was again having an uncertain waiting period and bookings were not being taken at all. Moreover, I earlier wrote about the GC issue that my neighbour had with his Jazz and the reply that he got from Honda. Reg. the Polo, yes, I agree that this too is an excellent car. But again I had concerns on the A.S.S and maintenance costs. I understsnd from a couple of my friends about the hazzles that they face when they need to give their Polo or for that matter a Micra for service, esp. if it is an unplanned service. Another car that was in contention whed I decided to upgrade to VXi was i20 Magna. But in this case, I have read about the low FE figues esp. in City where 80% of my usage would be.

I could not hear a single such stories from any Maruti Dzire/Swift owners. Hence was more inclined towards the Dzire. Though I agree that all the 3 hatches mentioned by you are excellent products, a few aspects here and there made a big difference.

Yes. I will be writing in detail about the PDI and delivery experience and later on the ownership experience.