[bhuvan_prasad]

Originally Posted by vishal.jayakuma

What fuel are you using? Yes i'm doing a thorough check up of my car. I'm from Chennai too, btw.

Am using normal/regular petrol. Car has been to Goa and back, so filled at random highway pumps, and touchwood everything is fine.

I wouldn't recommend you run on any fancy fuel, as the Civic is meant to run just fine on stock fuel. Get your injectors and throttle body cleaned along with the rest of the checks, that might help.

Hope to see you in the Chennai TBHP Meets.

[vishal.jayakuma]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

Am using normal/regular petrol. Car has been to Goa and back, so filled at random highway pumps, and touchwood everything is fine.

I wouldn't recommend you run on any fancy fuel, as the Civic is meant to run just fine on stock fuel. Get your injectors and throttle body cleaned along with the rest of the checks, that might help.

Hope to see you in the Chennai TBHP Meets.

Apparently i have a throttle body sensor problem and needs to be replaced. It's 45K
Already spent a fortune on the car.

[bhuvan_prasad]

So, the dream run, reliability-wise, of the civic, post the turbo jobs has come to an end, after 2.5 years. (Feb 2013)

Last Friday, I started the car and began heading out of my colony on my way to work. AFR's were fine in the 12-14 range as usual. I had barely driven 300m, when I noticed that the AFR was showing sub 10(meter doesn't read sub 10 numbers), I blipped the throttle, hoping it would fix it. But no. Then after 10s, the AFR's went past 18, and the meter stopped giving a reading. I stopped on the side, and restarted 2-3 times, thinking it was some pulse issue between the piggyback and the stock ECU, but it did not make any difference.

I knew this was something serious, and managed to drive back home, parked the car, took a quick peek inside the bonnet, to see if anything had leaked, thankfully no, and took an auto to work.

Over the weekend, I just turned the ignition to the on-switch, to prime the injectors, and checked for leaks, nothing. Weird, as leaky O ring seals on my injectors was my first guess.

Anyway, on Wednesday a friend came over. We began removing the plugs, maybe there had gone bust and stopped firing. Plugs were soaked in fuel, and 2 had broken tips(from the pressure during gapping maybe?), and plugs seemed fairly gone.



Got a new pair of NGK copper plugs to test, coils were fine, and we were getting a spark. Installed the new plugs, and tried cranking. Nothing. This was when we noticed, the header wrap, wastegate, turbo had fuel all over, which had leaked out of the exhaust system, via the various gaskets.



Removed plugs, and tried to crank, fuel spurted out like a fountain. Removed the injector rail, injector number 3 was leaking like a jet washer, just on priming, and even with the connector detached, indicating a stuck open injector. The volume of fuel coming out was tremendous. All the fuel was coming out of this and nothing from the others, and had flooded the engine. I swapped the injector wires, and next even the injector position, and the same injector kept spurting out fuel. These are larger 330CC injectors, the stock civic has 185cc injectors .



RRP and Joel sell only sets of 4. So for now, Anoop(TBHP handle: blahman) has sent his stock injectors, with which I will atleast be able to run the car, can't rev high and go into boost, as the stock injectors will max out mostly, will remap and tune accordingly. Injectors will reach in 2 days hopefully. Have to crank without the plugs, to get the fuel out, and mostly change the engine oil, which I changed 3 months ago only. Once I confirm it was just that one injector, will figure out if I should spend the 20-24k to get a new set of larger injectors.

I've also bought jack stands, 3/8" ratchet sets, socket sets, oil wrench, etc and have been doing oil changes, brake pad changes at home itself.

Changed from Mintex to brembo, as I was getting judder at 100KMPH plus speeds. The brembo's dont have the bite and reassuring feel of the mintex, will get the discs skimmed to ensure better contact. All this, once the car is up and running. The hawks I got from the US, were a size smaller, current city size. Pic below for reference. I went to the hawk website, and via pics figured out that the Indian(JDM) 2006 Civic hawk model number is HB366F681.



Fingers crossed right now. Hope car gets back to normal soon.

[ssjr0498]

Issue sorted? Were you able to figure out what was wrong with the injector?

[fieroid]

Originally Posted by ssjr0498

Issue sorted? Were you able to figure out what was wrong with the injector?

One injector has flooding. He is waiting for a new replacement set from the foreign land.

[yzfrj]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

Did you manage to find out where the missing piece of the spark plug went? A piece that big bouncing around inside a cylinder is trouble.

Also, why is a Civic running plugs meant for a City that are missing the sealing washers?

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

the stock civic has 185cc injectors .

Honda City engines are smaller and they come with 195cc injectors. D16s come with 240cc injectors. A 1.8 liter engine running 185cc injectors is almost certainly impossible.

[bhuvan_prasad]

Originally Posted by yzfrj

Did you manage to find out where the missing piece of the spark plug went? A piece that big bouncing around inside a cylinder is trouble.

Also, why is a Civic running plugs meant for a City that are missing the sealing washers?




Honda City engines are smaller and they come with 195cc injectors. D16s come with 240cc injectors. A 1.8 liter engine running 185cc injectors is almost certainly impossible.

The plugs are the correct model number. Honda recommends a cold step '6' for the stock engine and since I'm pushing 100hp more I am using a 2 step colder plug, incidentally full-race runs this same plug on their R18 turbo civic. Plugs were changed at raceconcepts and I am as bewildered as you, regarding the washers not being there, as washers are quite hard to remove.

The R18 engine comes with 185cc injectors, hence, even for 6psi boost one needed to upgrade injectors. It was never meant be a mod-friendly engine, and hence I guess honda put these injectors.

Regarding the car now : No, it is not yet running. I received the new plugs and injectors(350CC) from the US.

When i put in new plugs, oil, oil filter, stock injectors and started the car on a stock map, the oil pressure was very low, with barely any flow to the head, causing huge tappet noise. The oil warning light did not come on though, as pressure in the block would not have been that low.

I thought this might be due to all the carbon that would have washed off the cylinder head by the fuel and clogged up the pan/pickup. With the help of a friend dropped the oil pan(huge pain to remove it in the R18 civic), there was a little carbon gunk at the bottom, and some foreign particles in the pickup, but the flow was not that badly affected, to cause such low oil pressure in the head.

My only other guess now is the main crank bearings have worn out, increasing clearance and reducing pressure. Don't really know what to do now, so just put the pan back loosely with two bolts and have left the car as is. Am anyway a little busy with travel/work. Any advice will be much appreciated.

Oil starved head , oil was flowing very slowly up one passage to the head


En-route to removing the oil pan


Oil pan, carbon gunk at the bottom, I cleaned this out


Oil pickup, cleaned the strainer with pressurized water, cannot open this pickup



Clean looking cylinder walls, pistons, con rods, after 25k Km of turbo, can see the oil jets the R18 has


Clean looking cylinder walls, pistons, con rods, after 25k Km of turbo


New plugs, New injectors - Will install this only once I sort out the oil pressure - stock injectors and normal copper plugs are present now

[yzfrj]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

The plugs are the correct model number. Honda recommends a cold step '6' for the stock engine and since I'm pushing 100hp more

The plug number for an R18 is IZFR6K11. What you need is IZFR8K11. That plug does not exist. BKR6/7/8E is for a City. The threads for both plugs are the same, but the Civic plug is a bit longer. So while you may be able to fit BKR6/7/8E into your head, it will be recessed. If you have your stock plugs with you, compare them side by side with the BKRs.

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

The R18 engine comes with 185cc injectors, hence, even for 6psi boost one needed to upgrade injectors. It was never meant be a mod-friendly engine, and hence I guess honda put these injectors.

That misinformation probably originates here: https://www.hondata.com/tech-boost-r18-engine

Try putting the following numbers in this calculator: https://www.injectorrx.com/injector-size-calculator/
Injector size: 185 cc/min
Number of cylinders: 4
Injector duty cycle: 100%

You will still end up at a number lower than the 160 HP that the Hondata page says. Change those numbers to 285 cc/min and 75% duty cycle and the result will be closer to what Hondata says. What you see there is probably a simple typo.

[bhuvan_prasad]

Originally Posted by yzfrj

The plug number for an R18 is IZFR6K11. What you need is IZFR8K11. That plug does not exist. BKR6/7/8E is for a City. The threads for both plugs are the same, but the Civic plug is a bit longer. So while you may be able to fit BKR6/7/8E into your head, it will be recessed. If you have your stock plugs with you, compare them side by side with the BKRs.





That misinformation probably originates here: https://www.hondata.com/tech-boost-r18-engine

Try putting the following numbers in this calculator: https://www.injectorrx.com/injector-size-calculator/
Injector size: 185 cc/min
Number of cylinders: 4
Injector duty cycle: 100%

You will still end up at a number lower than the 160 HP that the Hondata page says. Change those numbers to 285 cc/min and 75% duty cycle and the result will be closer to what Hondata says. What you see there is probably a simple typo.

Listen, sorry if I'm being blunt, but I am not here to win an argument, and I don't really care what the stock size injectors/plugs are, as I anyway have a new set of plugs/injectors, the exact models of which have been used by various reputed tuning establishments across the world, on this very engine, and have met with a lot of success.

The only reasons I posted, was to see if knowledgeable people on this forum could help out with the issue at hand, before I plunge into a full engine rebuild, as most people I speak to are sort of stumped as to what the issue could be.

[yzfrj]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

Listen, sorry if I'm being blunt, but I am not here to win an argument, and I don't really care what the stock size injectors/plugs are, as I anyway have a new set of plugs/injectors, the exact models of which have been used by various reputed tuning establishments across the world, on this very engine, and have met with a lot of success.

The only reasons I posted, was to see if knowledgeable people on this forum could help out with the issue at hand, before I plunge into a full engine rebuild, as most people I speak to are sort of stumped as to what the issue could be.

I am not trying to argue with you. I only wanted to bring some discrepancies to your notice.

Before you try to start the engine again, do double check that the missing pieces from your spark plugs are not sitting inside your cylinders.

Good luck.

[bhuvan_prasad]

Originally Posted by yzfrj

I am not trying to argue with you. I only wanted to bring some discrepancies to your notice.

Before you try to start the engine again, do double check that the missing pieces from your spark plugs are not sitting inside your cylinders.

Good luck.

Appreciate the intent. The piece were not in the oil pan and had not scoured the cylinder walls.

The valves have no play, and are not stuck, and are opening and closing fine on cranking.
The only thing left to do is to open the head and see if they are there.

[yzfrj]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

Appreciate the intent. The piece were not in the oil pan and had not scoured the cylinder walls.

The valves have no play, and are not stuck, and are opening and closing fine on cranking.
The only thing left to do is to open the head and see if they are there.

Try fishing with a magnetic pickup through the spark plug tubes.

[james]

Originally Posted by bhuvan_prasad

Attachment 1403515

Side gapped and washer missing. How in the world could this happen? Ive heard of the ground electrode breaking off at the weld due to incorrect gapping techniques but never ever seen such a clean cut. Im apprehensive about this having happened in the motor.

I hope you get the ol' girl running soon.

Cheers!

[bhuvan_prasad]

Originally Posted by yzfrj

Try fishing with a magnetic pickup through the spark plug tubes.

No luck, did not find anything in the 4 cylinders via the magnetic pickup. While that is sort of a good thing and means that the pieces are went out of the exhaust valve or the plugs were side-gapped to begin with, it also means that the racket on starting up is because of lack of oil pressure to the head.

Beats me, as to why a well maintained engine would suddenly have such major issues with oil pressure. Any help would be much appreciated.

[fieroid]

Fuel mixed with oil is a major issue.
An oil pump can always fail without any warning. Bearings cant get loose overnight.
I still see the bottom engine perfectly fit after all the abuse given.
The injector played dirty here, failing all of a sudden.
Have u got the injectors?