[Chalu]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

I agree. The 3rd-gen City was a bit more sturdy and had better fit-and-finish and overall quality than this generation. Even the color quality has gone down quite a bit. If you are keen for this generation's City and all those wonderful features, it's a worthy upgrade, specially if you are thinking of the diesel option. Otherwise, I would suggest to you to stick to your City, until this generation's one sees a facelift, with (possibly) better build and quality.

I was planning to go for a petrol because my running is less than 1000 Km per month. I had mostly decided to go for the new City but after going through the New City the Build Quality has come down drastically. So let me wait for some more time and see if Honda has a facelift and take care of these build issues or wait for some other new cars from other manufacturers

[abhijitnallani]

@RavenAvi Great thread man...

how does the footwell light come on ? Is it always on? Or does it come on
when u put the parking lights on? Because generally in most premium cars where footwell lights are standard there are ON when u unlock the car and then they go off when u start the car and they come back On again when u pull the key out after the stopping the ignition..

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by Chalu

I was planning to go for a petrol because my running is less than 1000 Km per month. I had mostly decided to go for the new City but after going through the New City the Build Quality has come down drastically. So let me wait for some more time and see if Honda has a facelift and take care of these build issues or wait for some other new cars from other manufacturers

It's already 7 months, and normally it takes about 2½-3 years for the facelift to come in, so you don't have long to wait. I am guessing we should see the facelift to this 4th gen City by 2016-end at most.

Originally Posted by abhijitnallani

@RavenAvi Great thread man...

how does the footwell light come on ? Is it always on? Or does it come on
when u put the parking lights on? Because generally in most premium cars where footwell lights are standard there are ON when u unlock the car and then they go off when u start the car and they come back On again when u pull the key out after the stopping the ignition..

Thank you, Abhijit.

The ambience footlights are connected to the parking light switch. Rotate the knob once to turn the parking lights on outside, and the ambience lights inside.

I guess it was easier for the accessory guy at Honda to wire it up this way.

Originally Posted by dre@ms

Excellent write-up buddy. Pictures make equal justice. Empress with your princess is Gorgeous!!!

The DRLs look pretty neat and reminds me of Iron Man. BTW, where did you source the door visors? They look pretty neat and love its style and design. Will it fit my 2012 City?

Thanks, dre@ms my friend.

Door visors for the 3rd-gen City are still available in most workshops. Ask for a set similar to this one and you will get it. Make sure the company is Galio India.

http://www.galioindia.com/doorvisors.html

[dre@ms]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

http://www.galioindia.com/doorvisors.html

How much did you pay for it. BTW, I was not able to find door visors in the above link, only wind visors. Hope both are same.

In Snapdeal, its Rs. 1915
http://www.snapdeal.com/product/lets...vtec/149493819

Is it the same?

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by dre@ms

How much did you pay for it. BTW, I was not able to find door visors in the above link, only wind visors. Hope both are same.

In Snapdeal, its Rs. 1915
http://www.snapdeal.com/product/lets...vtec/149493819

Is it the same?

It cost me 1,200/-. Printed price was 1,400/-.

The weblink to the Galio India site was just to give you an idea. The visors were sourced by my local accessory guy, who also clarified that door visors for the 3rd-gen City are still available at most shops.

Too expensive at Snapdeal. I suggest you get in touch with an accessory shop near you.

----------------------------------------------------

I clarified this again yesterday when Empress was running low on fuel - the "low fuel/refill" icon in the ODO lights up when there's exactly 2.5 liters of fuel left in the tank. Which means that the City fuel tank has 37.5 liters on main.

In the diesel variants, this roughly translates to 50 kms DTE (distance-to-empty) range (mine showed 54 kms because the mileage inside the city right now is at 21.6 kmpl), so diesel City owners can take it a bit easy. However for petrol City owners, this could be a cause for worry if you don't have a petrol pump station within 20-25 kms range. I strongly suggest to all petrol City owners to fill up before the "low fuel" icon lights up on the bar, which is when there are the last 2 bars showing in the fuel bar.

[harry10]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

It cost me 1,200/-. Printed price was 1,400/-.

The weblink to the Galio India site was just to give you an idea. The visors were sourced by my local accessory guy, who also clarified that door visors for the 3rd-gen City are still available at most shops.

Too expensive at Snapdeal. I suggest you get in touch with an accessory shop near you.

----------------------------------------------------

I clarified this again yesterday when Empress was running low on fuel - the "low fuel/refill" icon in the ODO lights up when there's exactly 2.5 liters of fuel left in the tank. Which means that the City fuel tank has 37.5 liters on main..

Don't know if it's correct. When I got the delivery they filled 5 liters of diesel as customary. The low fuel light was on when I started. After reaching petrol pump which was 8 kms from there tankful was 36 liters.
So reserve has to be more 4 liters at least.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by harry10

Don't know if it's correct. When I got the delivery they filled 5 liters of diesel as customary. The low fuel light was on when I started. After reaching petrol pump which was 8 kms from there tankful was 36 liters.
So reserve has to be more 4 liters at least.

Similar experience during my delivery process as well. Initially I went by the manual which states that 6 liters are in reserve, but all findings point to this fact - the reserve is not more than 3 liters, and the main tank is not more than 37 liters.

Either that, or the fuel tank MID is faulty.

Page 124 in the official City review thread, harry - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...eview-124.html

----------------------------------------

Found a few more "bugs" in my Empress in the meanwhile. I clarified these at least 3 times before concluding that they are indeed "bugs" or glitches:

- As soon as I crank up and start the ACC, changing the temperature to a higher value (suppose, from 25ºC to 27ºC) results in the air-flow direction to suddenly change by itself, from FACE to FACE/FEET. This happens intermittently. At first I thought one of my other fingers might be touching the Air-flow direction icon, but I subsequently confirmed that I don't touch any other part of the panel except the red upward arrow to adjust the temperature.

- Same happens when I go over a sharp speed-breaker sometimes. Again, it's an intermittent problem.

- Powering on the HU and then immediately pressing the "-" button, on the Volume Control buttons provided on the steering, results in the volume going down all the way to "0". Not sure if this is a feature or a glitch, but it didn't happen in the initial days of ownership.

- Pushing the Auto-fold button for the ORVMs results in different speeds of folding for either ORVMs - sometimes the passenger-side ORVM folds faster, sometimes the driver-side ORVM. Same happens when opening the ORVMs as well.

- One of the dual horns had conked off by itself in the morning about a couple weeks back, and came back on by itself later in the evening. I suspected loose wiring might be at fault here. But the problem has not resurfaced in the past 2 weeks since it happened. I tried to check access to the horns from the engine bay, and it isn't easy. A job for the A.S.S. guys during next service I guess.

- Paint quality of the 2014 City is simply not up to par. The scratches, even light ones, reveal the quality underneath. In comparison, the 3rd-gen City had top notch paint quality.

- The alloys are getting chipped. Already 2 small chunks have come off from the front passenger side alloy, possibly due to stray pebbles. Goes to show the quality of those horrendous OEM "propeller" alloys.

Like I said in one of my posts above, I am just waiting for "what's next?" one by one. Honda's quality has definitely dropped for this generation's City. If this trend of manufacturing their latest cars with plenty of quality compromises continues (as is evident with the Mobilio as well), my next car definitely won't be a Honda.

[pdma]

Thank you Avi as usual for the unbiased and clear updates. I guess the small issues around the electronics raised should be sorted out by the service station , however the paint quality is definitely a major concern. As you rightly pointed out Honda would eventually be loosing loyalists like us if they continue this way , which unfortunately seems to be the " New Way Forward " at Honda India atleast.

[vista_qjd]

Couldn't agree more to this statement. Having owned the city for 3 months now, I can say that there are way too may issues which sum up to one fact - the cheapness that Honda is pursuing. Be it panel gaps, paint quality, flimsy build, sub-par service experience, hands free (SV )which doesn't work, doors which doesn't shut properly etc.
Their customer service does not bother either when these issues are reported. They always have a work around - "shut the door harder" or "speak with the mouth close to the mic". Don't acknowledge the problem at all and provide these creative solutions. Extremely frustrating.

Everything seems to have been built to a price! The brand and quality image Honda built is slowly eroding away for sure.

[neel911]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

- One of the dual horns had conked off by itself in the morning about a couple weeks back, and came back on by itself later in the evening. I suspected loose wiring might be at fault here. But the problem has not resurfaced in the past 2 weeks since it happened. I tried to check access to the horns from the engine bay, and it isn't easy. A job for the A.S.S. guys during next service I guess.

Same here. I saw this issue once rains started. Its again intermittent. Sometimes both of them work and sometimes only one. This is something I'm planning to bring up during next service as well

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

- Paint quality of the 2014 City is simply not up to par. The scratches, even light ones, reveal the quality underneath. In comparison, the 3rd-gen City had top notch paint quality.

True. Also, if you notice closely, there is lot of orange peel effect (specially on the sids) even in the metallic shades. It does not give a nice gloss shiny feel.

I would highly recommend getting some sort of premium paint protection such as C-Quartz. As yours is a darker metallic shade, even swirl marks will come up very soon if not protected well.

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

- The alloys are getting chipped. Already 2 small chunks have come off from the front passenger side alloy, possibly due to stray pebbles. Goes to show the quality of those horrendous OEM "propeller" alloys.

I've seen some scratches more than chips on my Neo Alloys. Again, my car does go through places where road quality/construction goes and I have had a stone kit the lower part of the driver door as well causing a mild point dent

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Like I said in one of my posts above, I am just waiting for "what's next?" one by one. Honda's quality has definitely dropped for this generation's City. If this trend of manufacturing their latest cars with plenty of quality compromises continues (as is evident with the Mobilio as well), my next car definitely won't be a Honda.

[/quote]

It is indeed sad to see this. Luckily, I haven't faced majority of these so I'm hoping they are one off situations. Honda also does not have a right channel for escalation. A person buying a car around 10L should have access to someone who understands/takes action rather than just having a call centre whose main job is to forward the same to Dealers

Just off topic, but I saw the Mobilio and the front console is so pathetic. I find the Ertiga front panel much better to be honest. Maybe Honda is just taking us for a ride and believe that no matter what they give, we shall continue to buy their cars.

[pdma]

Originally Posted by neel911

Maybe Honda is just taking us for a ride and believe that no matter what they give, we shall continue to buy their cars.

Hello Neel,

That definitely seems to be the thought from Honda and in one way we are complimenting this thought. A close look at the booking numbers of Mobilo seals this thought from Honda and they have even dared to push the production of the city to the back seat to accommodate the demand of Mobilo. As many mentioned in the multiple threads on this topic it is our mentality (Indians) that is pushing many to buy a "H" for its status / society value apart from the technical brilliance that these cars always come with and reputation that the brand earned over the years.
Honda can ride on this tide for a while but if the same continues then they are to hit the lean patch soon.

@ Avi : Apologies for discussing a different car on your thread but I was not able to resist posting my thoughts.

cheers,
pdma.

[RavenAvi]

So, apparently, I am not an official 2014 Honda City customer!

Or at least I wasn't, until Honda India's databases got "updated" a few days back.

And all this came to the fore upon my one query to Honda India's Customer Care regarding the gift package Honda India has been sending to most 2014 City owners - the black one containing a "thank you" note from Hironori Kanayama and a metallic key ring.

This is a sequence of events which followed, from August 19th through to the 20th:

August 17 - Janmasthami & Sunday. I had a bit of free time and had been reading left and right about other City owners receiving the gift package, some of them who had taken delivery in June and July even (!), so decided to send an email to Honda Customer Care saying that I was a City VMT i-DTEC owner since 25th March 2014, and asked them if such a similar package was sent to me (I hoped!) and had gotten lost in transit or something.
Dealership had pleaded ignorance on the matter.
Got an automated reply from the CRM team that they were unavailable from 15/08 to 18/08, and to expect a reply on the 19th.

August 19 (1:30 PM) - I receive a call from the dealership's CRM that I have lodged a "complaint" with Honda regarding "not receiving a keyring which I was supposed to receive during car delivery as per understanding with dealership, and to provide me the same and close the matter immediately."

(Yes, your eyes must be wide open, as were mine!)

Had to explain everything in detail to the dealership CRM, and she understood the matter fully. She said she would get in touch with the Central Zone ASM and clarify the whole situation to him. I told her not to bother, since Honda's Customer Care had taken the matter so lightly that they didn't bother reading my email carefully and in full, and merely forwarded it to the dealership as a complaint.
Didn't receive a reply from Honda Customer Care till then.

August 19 (2 PM) - Sent second email to Customer Care pleading with them to read my email in full and in totality before merely forwarding it to the local dealership, and that my email was directed at Honda Customer Care. Added Jnaneshwar Sen's email addy as a CC in it.

August 19 (3:25 PM) - A lady called me saying she was speaking from Honda Customer Care, and asked for clarification on the entire matter. Despite my heightened annoyance, I clarify it (yet again). She said, according to official records, that my details are not present in the database of 2014 City owners.
Which means, me and my Empress didn't exist, as per official Honda India records!
I gave her an earful, and said I was thankful that this wasn't a warranty-related problem or some serious technical issue with my City because if it was, the company would have declined any help regarding it, by simply saying that me and Empress didn't exist!
Also told her not to bother about this trivial thing, since I was done with their Customer Care and this matter, seeing how efficiently they were "caring" for their "customer".

August 19 (4 PM) - I get the first email reply from Customer Care thanking me for choosing a Honda car and sharing my feedback with them. And with regards to my query, "they requested me to share my car details and my Postal Address so that they could send me the gift".

(Yes, jaw-dropping moment again!)

So, the company really didn't know me and Empress existed somewhere out there in the world!

August 19 (5:40 PM) - I email Customer Care back, politely saying thank you and declining to receive their "gift" by "providing" my postal address, and if they had bothered to read my first email to them completely, they would have gotten my car's details and delivery date already. Also, if I "provided" everything and received "something", then it wouldn't remain a "gift" anymore.
Also added that I was sure they didn't ask other owners for their addresses before sending them the gifts, and that by then I had a good idea of how things were working at Honda India's famed Customer Service.
The matter was closed from my end from that moment onwards, and I told them not to harrass the local dealership since they had no idea about this matter.

August 20 (4:30 PM) - I receive a reply from Customer Care, apologising "if my feelings had been hurt", and they were informing me that the gift has been dispatched to my address which has been taken from their database (updated or address taken from the dealership, God knows).

Such a trivial matter, but it exposed the 2014 Honda-way-of-working-things completely. I don't care about their stupid gift anymore - all I wanted was to be acknowledged as a City owner, and they didn't even have me in their records!

Received a call from the dealership manager couple days back in the morning and he tried to clarify on the whole matter, saying that "databases were not updated due to the extreme rush of bookings/deliveries", "gift might have been definitely sent but might have returned due to non-delivery", "my delivery was to be in April/May so there was some confusion", etc. I told him that I am not blaming the dealership for anything, and it's the company who was at fault here. I didn't care for a stupid keyring because I could purchase hundreds which are MUCH better, but my disappointment lay with the fact that the company didn't acknowledge me as a valid, bonafide customer.

Maybe I am over-reacting, and purists might say "why are you complaining, now that they have apologised and sent you the stuff". I guess they won't get why I am hopping mad. In an alternate, bizarre reality, maybe this is the company's way of punishing me for being unbiased in my views of the 2014 City, and how critically vocal I have been of the famed Honda quality's declining standards in recent times.


BTW, my driver-door issue still remains unsolved. The SA, Deepak, had called me about 2 weeks back and asked me to email the photos I had taken during the second free service inspection, specially the ones of the faulty door part, since he had lost those in-between. I did the same about 10 days back, and am yet to get a clarification from him if he received my email.

Re-sent the email a few minutes earlier back to Deepak, adding the dealership CRM and manager's emails as CC. Hoping for a resolve soon. Meanwhile I am driving Empress with rolled-up windows, for fear of the glass shattering if I try to roll it down.

Originally Posted by pdma

Thank you Avi as usual for the unbiased and clear updates. I guess the small issues around the electronics raised should be sorted out by the service station , however the paint quality is definitely a major concern. As you rightly pointed out Honda would eventually be loosing loyalists like us if they continue this way , which unfortunately seems to be the " New Way Forward " at Honda India atleast.

As long as they gather new customers in large numbers, I don't think Honda India is bothered about loyalists like us. This should be a lesson for us.

Originally Posted by vista_qjd

Couldn't agree more to this statement. Having owned the city for 3 months now, I can say that there are way too may issues which sum up to one fact - the cheapness that Honda is pursuing. Be it panel gaps, paint quality, flimsy build, sub-par service experience, hands free (SV )which doesn't work, doors which doesn't shut properly etc.
Their customer service does not bother either when these issues are reported. They always have a work around - "shut the door harder" or "speak with the mouth close to the mic". Don't acknowledge the problem at all and provide these creative solutions. Extremely frustrating.

Everything seems to have been built to a price! The brand and quality image Honda built is slowly eroding away for sure.

Things have taken a drastic U-turn since 2012 times, that's for sure. I remember representatives from the company called me directly to take feedback on how my Silver Pegasus was performing!

No such thing this time.

As for the famed Honda quality, the less said the better.

Originally Posted by neel911

Same here. I saw this issue once rains started. Its again intermittent. Sometimes both of them work and sometimes only one. This is something I'm planning to bring up during next service as well

"Don't drive through water or in the pouring rain", might be their explanation. Loose wiring might be at fault here, but they will acknowledge that only after exhausting all other options.

Originally Posted by neel911

True. Also, if you notice closely, there is lot of orange peel effect (specially on the sids) even in the metallic shades. It does not give a nice gloss shiny feel.

Yes, it is very evident. Thankfully the Golden Brown shade is a premium shade, so there's a nice gloss to it. But I am wondering about all the other shades, specially white.

I don't think these shades will last long.

Originally Posted by neel911

I would highly recommend getting some sort of premium paint protection such as C-Quartz. As yours is a darker metallic shade, even swirl marks will come up very soon if not protected well.

Unfortunately my friend, the state which I live in is completely useless in this regard. My city does not have any such outlets, and even the state capital has only one 3M shop. I have to travel 600 kms to and fro if I have to get any of that sort of work done.

Originally Posted by neel911

I've seen some scratches more than chips on my Neo Alloys. Again, my car does go through places where road quality/construction goes and I have had a stone kit the lower part of the driver door as well causing a mild point dent

The panels are quite thin. A larger pebble hit with some force might create a hole in the door/front panel, I am afraid! The OEM alloys are pathetic in their build, and might crack at moderate force.

Originally Posted by neel911

It is indeed sad to see this. Luckily, I haven't faced majority of these so I'm hoping they are one off situations. Honda also does not have a right channel for escalation. A person buying a car around 10L should have access to someone who understands/takes action rather than just having a call centre whose main job is to forward the same to Dealers

Read my experience above and you will have a good idea of how things work at Honda these days.

Originally Posted by neel911

Just off topic, but I saw the Mobilio and the front console is so pathetic. I find the Ertiga front panel much better to be honest. Maybe Honda is just taking us for a ride and believe that no matter what they give, we shall continue to buy their cars.

They are exploiting the badge and their reputation in India to the full. There's no other explanation.

Originally Posted by pdma

That definitely seems to be the thought from Honda and in one way we are complimenting this thought. A close look at the booking numbers of Mobilo seals this thought from Honda and they have even dared to push the production of the city to the back seat to accommodate the demand of Mobilo. As many mentioned in the multiple threads on this topic it is our mentality (Indians) that is pushing many to buy a "H" for its status / society value apart from the technical brilliance that these cars always come with and reputation that the brand earned over the years.
Honda can ride on this tide for a while but if the same continues then they are to hit the lean patch soon.

@ Avi : Apologies for discussing a different car on your thread but I was not able to resist posting my thoughts.

No apologies needed, my friend. Well, Honda has well and truly gone "mainstream" in India, so expecting all this from them is natural. Thing is, whatever sort of products you send into the market, at least treat your customers well and listen to their feedback, because ultimately it's them who BUILD your brand's reputation.

All this negative feedback must be deterring at least ONE potential customer from buying a Honda product, and that ONE today might translate into HUNDREDS tomorrow and THOUSANDS the day after. They shouldn't forget the situation they faced before introducing their famed i-DTEC, when every single customer was valuable for them. Today, it's just about monthly numbers (7000-this, 8000-that), and it's not about the customer anymore.

A sad truth.

[harry10]

Interesting read Avi about your 'Gift' ordeal. I am actually surprised that they didn't register you in their database considering you are in the group of initial buyers. On the contrary I received 2 same 'Gifts' from them in first 10 days of ownership itself. I mentioned this in my ownership review as to be a privileged Honda customer

Its unfortunate to see you have niggles to deal with and service people not able to provide solutions at the earliest. Mine has run 2k till now and I haven't faced any niggles (touchwood). It might be possible that initial batches had quality issues.

Regarding the paint protection I will suggest why not do it yourself. It's highly recommended and as you aren't able to get it done from outside so buy the products and do it yourself. I have done it myself so if you need any inputs regarding it let me know. It's time consuming and lots of elbow grease is required but the end result makes up for the effort.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by harry10

Interesting read Avi about your 'Gift' ordeal. I am actually surprised that they didn't register you in their database considering you are in the group of initial buyers. On the contrary I received 2 same 'Gifts' from them in first 10 days of ownership itself. I mentioned this in my ownership review as to be a privileged Honda customer

And guess what - I got a call from Honda One-to-One in the afternoon earlier today, inquiring if the problem I had mentioned via email had been successfully solved by the dealer!

(insert eye-rolling emoticon here)

Originally Posted by harry10

Its unfortunate to see you have niggles to deal with and service people not able to provide solutions at the earliest. Mine has run 2k till now and I haven't faced any niggles (touchwood). It might be possible that initial batches had quality issues.

I did some active pursuing of the Service Head of Honda India, who had come to Raipur for a visit to the Shubh Honda dealership recently. I sent them an email highlighting this issue, via the pictures I had taken. I also linked my Team-BHP 2nd Free Service report from this thread in the email.

The team studied it and have sent for a replacement part (of that door connector). Once they replace it, we will find out if that part was at fault, or if the glass has shifted from it's place.

Originally Posted by harry10

Regarding the paint protection I will suggest why not do it yourself. It's highly recommended and as you aren't able to get it done from outside so buy the products and do it yourself. I have done it myself so if you need any inputs regarding it let me know. It's time consuming and lots of elbow grease is required but the end result makes up for the effort.

Let me see if I can prise out some free time from my busy schedule for this. Will send you a PM for details, my friend.

--------------------------------------------------------

Received the Team-BHP keychains + sticker set earlier today.

Excellent finish of all 3 keychains, I must admit, although getting them to open was really tough as the rings were stuck to each other.

The complete set.


"Got BHP?" attached to Empress's key + silver Honda "H" keychain.


"Live To Drive" attached to (Dad's Swift) Silver Queen's key.


"Team-BHP" attached to my office keys.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

So, apparently, I am not an official 2014 Honda City customer!

Or at least I wasn't, until Honda India's databases got "updated" a few days back.

Received the "gift" a week back (almost 6 months after my purchase & delivery), but it had lost all it's charm for me now, considering the ordeal which went into the enquiry of it.

Still, I liked the heavy-set, rotating "H" central logo, so I am using it. I prefer my "Got BHP?" keyring over it, though.

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

BTW, my driver-door issue still remains unsolved. The SA, Deepak, had called me about 2 weeks back and asked me to email the photos I had taken during the second free service inspection, specially the ones of the faulty door part, since he had lost those in-between. I did the same about 10 days back, and am yet to get a clarification from him if he received my email.

Meanwhile I am driving Empress with rolled-up windows, for fear of the glass shattering if I try to roll it down.

Received an SMS from Deepak 4 days back that a replacement for the "defective" part, the driver-door holder, has reached the A.S.S. center. There is a Service Van trip scheduled for later this month (from 18th to 21st), so they will be sending the replacement part together with it.

I don't think it will solve the issue, but let's see what happens. I tried to roll the driver-door window down once, about 2 weeks back, and it stopped coming down at around the halfway mark. Didn't budge. At all. Rolled it back up and haven't rolled it down since.


FE stands at 19.3 kmpl, as per MID.