tl;dr
Test drove the XUV, Fortuner & Santa Fe.
Looked at other cars like the Q3, X1, Rexton.
Bought the CRV.
The Longer Version
In the beginning...
The itch to buy a new car started sometime in August 2013. At that time, had spent close to an year working in San Francisco while my poor Civic was languishing in Chennai. I had come back for a visit and had decided to sell my car then since it was lying unused and its resale value was going down exponentially considering that civic production had stopped in 2012 . I got an offer of 6 (which later became 7) lakhs from TSM and that was not good enough for me. In addition, my plans of staying long term in SF went kaput due to personal reasons and I knew that I would be returning in a couple of months.
So I returned to Chennai in Oct 2013. My priorities had changed and my wife and I were looking out for houses to purchase. There were a couple of houses we had paid an advance on but then fate played its hand. My father, who was unwell on and off, fell extremely sick in November. We went back to the builders and got our advance money back from them. All buying decisions were put off.
By Feb 2014, my father's health was a little better and I started looking at buying cars again. I was very impressed and interested in the XUV. We test drove it. We also went to Audi & looked at the Q3. But then health reasons cropped up again and the car purchase was postponed. Come September, the health issues were all resolved and we started looking out at vehicles again.
My wife really didn't want me to go with the XUV as it came only in with MT and she felt we ought to upgrade to a higher segment. How can we go against the better half's wishes? As always, she's been instrumental in helping with the purchase decision.
My upgrade path has been Hero Ranger -> second hand TVS 50 -> TVS Champ -> Honda Dio -> Santro XP -> Fiesta SXi -> Civic S MT
Why change the Civic?- Low-slung sedan - This caused issues at night with most headlights being at my eye level. Also, getting in and out of the car became difficult once I got a herniated disc in my back.
- Resale value - the value was coming down exponentially
- Manual Transmission- I needed an AT as I couldn't deal with the traffic on my commute any more
- Ride quality - Good but with back problems, it became difficult to sit in the sedan.
- Safety - Perception that we needed a vehicle with safety features.
Now, I haven't covered the longer list of positives that the Civic has as this is covered in my Civic review thread.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...nda-civic.html Factors considered while making the purchase decisions
(descending order of priority)
- Safety -This was unquestionably one factor we refused to compromise on. We were looking at vehicles with a minimum of 6 airbags (front, side & curtain) along with TCS, EBD etc
- Reliability - I didn't want to deal with rattles, niggles, moody engines etc. I get enough of that at home and work.
- Comfort/Ease of driving - The ride quality had to be good. The seats had to be comfortable. The steering wheel needed to be light but not too much. Visibility had to be good. Lights had to be good. Lumbar support was needed due to my bad back.
- Size - We wanted the new vehicle to be at a minimum, the same size as the civic. Ideally, we would have liked to have a 7 seater.
Dealership Experiences Audi
Mar 2014, Q3
Unimpressive throughout. Not really expected from a premium brand
- I didn't get call backs for test drives and a lot of opacity around costs/payments in my first visit.
Sep 2014
- The second time we called them up, we were rudely rebuffed saying that Q3s were booked for 8 months and that bookings on the Q3 manual were closed. Upon further probing, it was evident that the saleswoman was not really interested in closing any kind of deal with us. She told us to call her back
when our budget matched the cars she had! Kun BMW
Sept 2014, X1
Impressed with the Sales effort
- The saleswoman who spoke with us called us back on time and insisted that we test drive the
X1 even though we told her that it was beyond our budget. Now that’s Sales.
- The saleswoman also tried to do her best to give us a car which would fit her budget
Didn't see the cars in person but I was considering the X1.
When I buy a premium brand, I will probably look at BMW first and Audi will not be considered.
MPL Mahindra
Feb 2014, XUV W8
Initial visit was good but very poor follow-up
- The Initial sales experience was good. The RM was reasonably well informed and spent quite a while with us explaining the features of the XUV.
- Follow up for Test Drive was poor. We had to call her a couple of times before the XUV came for the Test Drive.
- The showroom also wasn't that great looking
Avenue Nissan
Mar 2014, Teana, Terrano
Poor Experience
- they didnt have a Teana on display and the sales guy didn't know what we were talking about
- he was trying to sell me the Terrano by comparing it to my Civic.
India Garage Mahindra
Jul 2014, Rexton RX7
Not a great experience at showroom and no follow-up
- We went on a Sunday and there was literally no one in the showroom
- I think the RM was sleeping and we probably woke him up
- Didn't explain the features well
- Asked for a TD the following week and no follow-up occurred
Since both Mahindra dealerships were apathetic, I didn't really want to deal with either of them. This is a pity because I think the XUV (even with all its warts) is a brilliant vehicle and I would have loved to buy an AT version of it (if it existed).
MPL Ford
Mar 2014, Endeavour 4*4
Decent Sales Experience
- We didn't visit the showroom but we got all the information we needed via calls and email
- Very prompt in sending the information across and following up when needed. I have interacted with MPL ford before - I had purchased my Fiesta from them. Their sales is strong but support is pretty weak. Also given my experience with an unreliable fiesta and overall impression of Ford vehicles, I wasn't too keen on them in the first place.
Concorde Motors
Mar 2014, Tata Aria
Abysmal experience
- didn't get greeted on entering the showroom.
- no one came to help us out when we were looking at the vehicle
- no follows up obviously
Again, like Mahindra, it is a pity that the dealership is partly responsible for killing the Aria. The Aria felt like a solid vehicle inside and out.
Maya Motors
Mar 2014, Pajero
Decent Sales Experience
- didn't go the showroom
- We called on a Sunday and the security guard picked it up. He was trying to sell the car to us!
- We got multiple follow up calls from them
Ultimately, given the long term viability of Mitsubishi in India, we decided not to pursue the Pajero.
MPL Toyota
Mar 2014, Innova
Sep 2014, Fortuner 4*2 AT
Decent Sales Experience
- Went to see the Innova and the sales person was ready to give a test drive on the spot
- Multiple follow ups on time regarding the Innova
- We didn't visit the showroom for the Fortuner but got all info via calls and email.
- Booked a test drive on their website and got a call from Toyota itself, confirming the time and
place.
- The vehicle came on time and the sales person was courteous and explained what little was
there to be explained in the fortune :P
- Brochures and price list handed over which was good.
Again, I have interacted quite a bit with MPL Toyota and they have consistently been good in their sales.
Kun Hyundai
Sep 2014, Santa Fe 4*2 AT
OK Sales Experience
- We didn't visit the showroom but got all info via calls
- Booked a Test Drive in the morning and the vehicle came in the afternoon.
- Didn't hand over the brochure (big negative) but handed over the price list at least. I don't know why there is this reluctance from some dealerships to give brochures to customers.
Capital Honda
Sep 2014, CRV 2.4 non-AVN
Great Sales Experience
- We asked for and got the same sales person as the one who had sold us the Civic.
- He came multiple times to our house in a CRV so that we could test drive it whenever we
wanted
- Managed the buyback of our civic and sales of the CRV in a good fashion.
- Delivered the CRV to our house in spite of pouring rain.
This is the benchmark against which I will weigh future buying experiences.
Test Drives
I stay in T-nagar and there is a well rounded mix of smooth roads, cratered roads, narrow roads, wide roads, flyovers, traffic etc. All test drives followed the same route which comprised of all the above - roughly about 3 km. They were all around the same time in the afternoon. My wife & I were present on all occasions.
XUV
+ Brilliant ride quality. I was apprehensive about this after reading the huge XUV threads here but I found it to be the most comfortable ride amongst all the cars I drove. The seats are like sofas.
+ Great power delivery. I assumed that it would be harder to drive than my civic but I was amazed by the ease of driving - power delivery was linear and steering was perfect.
+ Great Visibility - speaks for itself.
+ Passionate Ownership threads. I love the XUV even though I haven't bought it and I see that many owners feel the same. This feels like the same passion Apple owners have.
- Interiors. Enough has been said about this. I drove my friend's XUV and immediately afterwards got into my civic to go home. There was just no comparison in terms of quality or look and feel.
- Reliability. Now, I don't have much to go on this except for the humungous niggles thread on team-bhp. I really don't want to spend my time molly-coddling a car hoping that the service center would fix it. Though on the flip side, I hear that Mahindra customer service is excellent.
Fortuner
+ Tremendous road presence. This is not very important to me because I don't bully other drivers on the road. One instance that comes to mind that exemplifies this presence - this is the only vehicle I drove that autos gave way to. During the Test Drive, we were going in a cramped street (Rajabadher street of the Rathna Fan House fame) and an auto came in front of us. I was indicating that he come first but that dude stopped some way off and asked me to come first. Didn't experience this in any other vehicle I drove
+ Good power/AT - Obviously, there's a lot of power on tap and it comes very fast. Even though the AT is not the latest and greatest, it does its job exceedingly well. The best combo would have been a 4*4 and an AT combo.
+ Reliability. I can only go by the generally prevalent notion of Toyota's reliability.
- Poor ride quality. I could feel every bump in my back. Also, the seating position was quite low slung for a vehicle which is so tall and I felt like I was sitting in a sedan. No lumbar support was also disappointing
- Interiors & Safety. What can I say that others haven't said before? Zilch premium feel and abysmal safety features ruled this vehicle out of the running
- Heavy steering. Now, I am quite big and strong but at the end of the test drive, my shoulders felt like I had been in an upper body workout. Maybe I am pampered by the EPS systems on the civic and other cars I have driven, but I wouldn't want to deal with this in stop and go traffic.
I suppose Toyota is doing something right because the Fortuner still keeps selling 1600 units a month. But this is not the vehicle for me. We will have to see what happens when the CRV comes out with its new iDTec engine and the 9-speed AT next year.
Santa Fe
+Power/Transmission. Very easy to drive with lots of power and a good AT.
- Very very light steering. In spite of trying out all three steering modes, I found that there was zero feedback from the steering.
- Claustrophobic interiors - that' s the first impression my wife and I had when we sat insider the vehicle.
- Unrealistic prices - 34 lakhs OTR for getting a vehicle with 6 airbags? No thanks. I generally dislike manufacturers who offer lower variants with lower safety features. This reasoning just does not make sense to me.
Honorable Mentions Q3
- Saw the car in person
- Cramped
- Didn't really see value for money in the lower variants
Aria
- saw the car in person
- looked solid but concerns on TATA
Rexton
- looked good in person
- Lots of features
- Reviews weren't that great
X1
- didn't see it in person.
- lowest end was not good enough and the higher ends were beyond budget
Endeavour
- Didn't see it in person
- Seemed very utilitarian
- wasn't sure about reliability & ride quality
- also it was a model that was going out so wasn't too keen on it in any case
Yeti
- wasn't really a contender due to a lack of AT & it being a Skoda
Pajero
- Concerned about lack of AT and Mitsubishi's viability in India
MU7
+ Space. This car is HUGE!
- Not premium
- One of the my wife's clients who works for Isuzu told her not to buy one!
Considered for 5 min & discarded
A3, 1-series, B & C classes, Skoda Octavia, Skoda Superb
The Honda Experience
Now, the CRV was a vehicle I had discounted a while back. I liked it but it didn't seem to be selling well and hence it was not on the top of my mind. After the test-drives of the Fortuner and Santa Fe, my wife & I were dissatisfied with both of them. My wife then suggested that we look at the CRV. So she called up Capital Honda and asked for Mr. Vignesh who had sold us the civic 4 years ago. He bought the car the next day. We sat in it and we were blown away. We decided to go with the CRV then and there.
The CRV ticked almost all the boxes except for the fact that it was not a pseudo 7-seater. I was not bothered about the fact that it was petrol only as I believe that before I buy a 28 L vehicle, I should be able to afford its fuel costs. Yes, its resale value will be poorer but that is something I can live with.
+ Brilliant Ride Quality. It feels like gliding on bad roads. The only other vehicle which was comparable was the XUV. I did not drive the Safari Storme, so I don't know if that is better
+ Quality Interiors - While not being a luxury car, it comes with enough bells and whistles to put the Fortuner & the middle variant Santa Fe to shame. Of course, there are other cars out there which are priced lower than having more features. So it is only a question of what you compare it against.
+ Reliability - My experience with the Civic. Enough said.
+ 2.4 L engine with paddle shifts and AWD - This car is powerful and revs all the way to the red line like any typical Honda engine.
+ Spacious while not being a pseudo 7-seater - More spacious than my civic. I think the Fortuner & XUV are bigger inside though. The Santa Fe felt cramped.
+ Safety - 6 airbags, VSA, EBD, BA, HIDs etc etc
+ Ease of driving - It is an AT, has very good visibility, the steering is a little bit lighter than my civic while giving enough feedback, the seats are uber comfortable with lumbar support for the driver and it pulls away very cleanly. The lights are also very good while not blinding the opposing traffic.
- AT - This is an old school 5 speed AT. It shows in the whine when we accelerate. The fortuner's AT was better and the Santa Fe's was the best.
- Noise - Yup, this car is noisier than my civic. I don't know why but all reviews mentioned this fact.
- AVN - Why is the AVN almost 1.8 L more? It just offers touchscreen navigation & bluetooth connectivity. Honda gives bluetooth connectivity by default in almost all European & American variants.
- ORVM - They are taller than my civic but seem narrower and thereby seem to offer a lesser field of visibility.
We checked with Vignesh about buying back the civic. The price Auto Terrace quoted was above our expectations and we said yes. We got our loan processed through my relationship manager through my local ICICI branch. I got preferential rates and the loan was processed and disbursed in less than 24 hours.In between, there was a lot of debate between my wife & I on the colour and the variant. Finally we decided to go with the 2.4 L AT non-AVN Carnelian Red version and we told Vignesh this. Vignesh advised me to come to the dealership in my civic and drive home with the CRV.
There was some drama in between. I had gone to Singapore for a week and the battery on my civic went dead. This was probably due to the wifi OBD that I hadnt removed. So I informed capital honda to come and take the car away as I didnt want to keep this with me considering that it was sold to them. This happened suddenly & unexpectedly that none of us got a chance to say goodbye to it. This was the car in which both of my newborn daughters had come home and had served us very well over the last 4 years. We all (my wife, elder daughter & I ) felt really bad that the civic was gone. My elder daughter told my wife multiple times that she didnt want a new car but rather she wanted her civic back. She asked me a couple of times "Dad, why did the civic go away?" I did not have an answer for her.
Vignesh had promised that we would get the CRV before Diwali (about 3 weeks from booking) & we did. We had estimated that the CRV would be delivered to the dealership on a Saturday and that it would take 5 days for registration. Given this, Vignesh had said that we could expect to take delivery the coming Friday/Saturday. Unfortunately, the shipment got delayed and Capital Honda received the CRV on Wednesday only. Somehow Vignesh got the registration done in a couple of days and said that he could deliver it that Friday. Apparently the auspicious time that week was only after 6:45 PM on Saturday. Chennai experienced heavy rains that weekend and Amma got released on that day. Vignesh asked me if he could deliver it on Sunday or if we insisted that it be delivered that day itself. I told him that he could deliver it on Sunday. On Sunday morning, in pouring rain, the CRV was delivered to my house.
Coming to the CRV itself Exteriors
The car is well built. It looks deceptively small for its size, which may not appeal to the average Indian buyer. It is only when you come close or you see other cars next to it, that you realize its actual dimensions. The front grill is a bit more aggressive than before and in combination with the headlights, the front looks somewhat menacing - like a cat baring its teeth at you.
The low beams are HIDs and all variants come with front fog lights.
The ORVMs are big and are controlled electronically. They feel taller but narrower than the civic and I feel that the civic mirrors were probably better. We don't get the mirror tilt on reverse option in India though. The indicators on the ORVMS are placed such that you can see them even from all sides. This is the same case with the rear indicators too. There are no rear fog lights available on any variant.
The wipers are the standard swoop set and not butterfly like the civic. There is a rear wiper available too which is helpful in rainy conditions. The tyres are 17" and feel proportionate to the body. There is some amount of tyre noise when we drive.
A side step may not be required as compared to other SUVs (I am looking at you Fortuner) as the door sill is not very high. But, my aged parents didn't particularly find it very easy to get in though but it wasn't a big hassle either. They needed a bit of help though. Getting out is easier for them as they just have to slide out from the seats. The official ground clearance is stated to be 170 cm but it feels way higher than that. I have not scraped the car or even come close to scraping it on speed-breakers or potholes.
Interiors
The interiors are well put together. There is this feeling of quality that you get when you sit in it. Now it is not in the same league as the luxury brands but it is quite close. The switches, toggles, dials are feel very nice and satisfying to use. The ergonomics are spot on and I bet the average driver could figure the controls without referring to a manual. The design is just so clean.
There is some faux wood on the dashboard but thankfully it is dark and doesn't stand out. The driver side gets auto-up/down windows while the rest of passengers will have to make do without. The driver side also gets the child lock options. The ORVM options are also present on the drivers hand-rest. The mirrors don't close fully as the civic though.
All doors have decently sized deep pockets and smaller sized pockets in the hand-rests. There is a drop down sun glass holder on the roof, a 3 cup holder, some cubby holes and a deep pocket in the center arm rest. This space has been released partially because the AT lever in on the console and the hand brake is actually a foot brake. There is power socket outside and one inside the center console.
The dash has an iMid which shows time, personal pictures, audio options, rear camera, trip meter etc. I think the resolution is something like 300*400 which, while not big, is decent enough for viewing the content especially the rear camera view. In addition to this, the console also has a separate trip meter, DTE etc along with the usual speedometer, rev counter, fuel & engine temp dials. All this is put together in a nice 3D fashion. There is a back-light which is meant to indicate to the driver when he is driving economically (green) or not (white). This is slightly gimmicky. Also, there is an Econ button which is meant to increase fuel economy. I haven't tried it though and the reviews seem to indicate that its effect is minimal. The dual zone climate control is very effective and rear vents are available for the rear seat passengers.
The steering wheel is your standard Honda one and comes with audio & cruise controls on it. You get both tilt and telescope options on it. The wiper stick (rear/forward) is on the left and the light stick (fog/low/high) is on the right. Both front and rear wipers come with intermittent and standard speed settings. While driving in the night, I have found the combination of low beams (HID) and fog lights to be good enough to cover almost all low speed driving conditions. Also, judging by the lack of flickering headlights, I don't think that the opposing traffic minds it too. In this variant, we get the paddle shifts. I haven't used them yet.
This variant comes with 6 speakers (no sub-woofers) like the civic. The head unit is basic but the overall sound quality is acceptable. We get a USB port inside the center console. I will eventually end up replacing this HU with a better one. Hands free and Bluetooth are a given in today's world and Honda India has made a mistake by not giving these as default options.
The seats are very comfortable and are made of faux leather in beige. The driver seat is 8-way electrically adjustable with lumbar support but it does not have memory functions . The seats are also placed relatively high up so that you can sit upright akin to a tallboy hatch. The rear bench will seat 3 comfortably because there is no transmission hump and the rear vents do not intrude in the passenger space. The 60:40 split rear seats have a one pull flip option. Basically you tug on either one of two places (in the boot or under the seat) and the seats automatically flip themselves and fold. You will have to manually unfold them though. I don't remember the exact dimensions but I think the boot is around 510 liters and on flipping the seats you get about 1710 liters of space. The boot has a low lip which makes getting luggage into it a bit easier. There is a compact size spare tyre in in the boot along with tools etc. We don't get a tonneau cover by default though, which is a bummer.
We get an automatic sunroof which provides some additional lighting, not that the interiors aren't airy already. I wouldn't recommend opening it during the summers though unless of course you stay in San Francisco or one of the more northern nations with chillier climes.
Visibility from the driver's seat is very good - all the reviewers have called it a "commanding view". Front & side visibility is great while rear visibility is not so but this is compensated by the rear camera. The combination of ORVMs, IRVM and rear camera make do for decent visibility in the rear, even in dark conditions. One issue I have noticed is that the camera tends to get wet when it rains. I never experienced this in my civic.
The foot well is generously sized and pedals are standard Honda. Instead of a handbrake, there is a foot brake which works the same way.
The Drive
Turn the engine on and you will be hard pressed to hear it, inside and outside the car. What you will hear though is the audible seat belt warning, which is present only for the driver's side. The other passengers get a small indication in the console. Put it into drive and the car starts creeping. You will still not hear anything. But put your foot on the accelerator and you will hear the engine whine. This is especially true on lower speeds. Once it starts cruising, the engine sounds drop back to a murmur. When you do kick-down, you can hear the engine roar and that is nice to hear. There is ample power and its easy to pull away from the traffic, if that's your thing. Overall, the noise levels in the cabin are higher than those in the civic but not loud enough to be a deal breaker. This is one of those subjective things that individuals will have figure out for themselves.
So far, what all my passengers have said and I have felt is that the CRV feels like its gliding on the roads. Of course, when the bumps are big, you do feel them but it is similar to the tugging feeling you get when you are on local anesthesia while the dentist is poking around in your mouth. You know something is happening but you don't feel it much. There are very little thuds and crashes - my civic was notorious for it. You don't get thrown around except in the case of extreme maneuvers.
The handling has been top-notch. I am able to drive this almost like my civic. Once in a while, I get reminded of the fact that this is a heavier, taller car but those occasions are extremely rare. Contrast this to my ride in the fortuner, where it felt as though I was giving suggestions to the fortuner and it decided what to do in the end. My wife had noticed me struggling with it and had remarked that it felt like a boat. The Santa Fe would have been equally brilliant if not for the dead steering.
I am slowly trying to unlearn some of my sedan habits - namely, slowing down for undulations or bumps in the road as the CRV eats those for breakfast. The CRV is still a softroader though and I would be wary of doing this on very bad roads or on mud roads. The fortuner felt way better in that kind of terrain.
Miscellaneous
My car has been getting a lot of looks on the road. I guess the reason is the rarity of the CRV as it doesn't sell well nowadays while the Fortuner is ubiquitous on our roads and even the Santa Fe or Q3 are more common.
Coming to the big thing - fuel economy. So far, in this Diwali stop and go traffic, I have been getting 7km/L. I stay in Pondy Bazaar and commute to Ascendas, so it covers quite a lot traffic jam prone spots. Only time will tell whether this goes up.
Some of the neat features that I liked
+ the intermittent wipers speed up when the speed increases
+ Both the keys are remote enabled and are flippy keys.
+ love the sunroof (the west gets panoramic sunroofs and power hatch though)
+ the horn is very loud
+ the audio system is quite decent for a stock one
+ if you have driven a civic, the learning curve to move to a crv is minimal
+ Customizable lighting/locking options in addition to the usual trip meter etc
+ ability to load custom images on the iMid which gives that extra personalization touch.
A feature I haven't tested yet is the paddle shift in either D or S mode. The D mode is supposed to be fully automatic but you can use the paddle shifts to change gears; once you get back into cruising, the automatic takes over. The S mode is where you will have to change gears using the paddle shifts throughout.
What I would have liked to see
( in descending order of priority)
- Bluetooth option by default. I mean its so cheap and every car offers it nowadays
- A CVT or a 7 speed new age AT.
- Power Rear Hatch
- A tonneau cover
- High beam HIDs
- Panoramic Sunroof instead of the smaller one the Indian version gets
- Rear Fog Lights
About this Review Reviews
This forum does not have any CRV ownership threads. So I had to rely on the official team bhp review
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...-v-driven.html
Autocar india reviews and whole bunch of US & UK reviews of the CRV. Specifically, the Everymandriver (US) and Carbuyer (UK) youtube channels were exceedingly good.
Summing up- What I have realized is that there is no substitute for test driving a car (which is obvious) but sometimes in the rush, we miss this point.
- Reviewers apply their bias (consciously/unconsciously) and their priorities need not be the same as yours. A classic example is under thigh support or headroom. Other than in team-bhp, I rarely see reviewers mentioning their height or weight when talking about these subjective features. What works/doesn't work for them will not be the same for you.
- Ownership threads are great sources of reference sometimes even better than the official reviews because the owners go back and update their threads more frequently as their car ages.
- Expect a lot of nay sayers even after buying a car.
- There is no relation between the car brand, dealership brand and the experience you get, in India. Like almost everything else here, it heavily depends on the people you interact with.
- The Indian customer always gets a short shrift when it comes to prices and features.
- My views on the vehicles above are simply those. There is no intent to hurt or denigrate owners or followers of those vehicles.
- Apologies over any grammatical, syntactical, spelling errors & redundant statements.
- This Red Viper will not die like its namesake in the GoT.
25th October 2014, 07:28
(32)
Thanks
