[herculesksp]

Ya... sound like some new Apple product more than anything else... But, lets move on shall we?

Right. So this colleague of mine bought a new Hyundai i10 car. Some of the guys were pestering him for a drive and so just after lunch on Friday, we took the car out for a spin. 2 of the guys took it for a drive around Whitefield/ITPL area at first and then it was my time. I don't like to car others cars out for a spin. What if something happens inadvertently, either due to a fault of mine or due to no fault of mine(say the fault of some other car on the road while I have been driving perfectly fine). The end result would be that the bump happened while I was driving.

Anyway, I did take the ride and this was the first time(not exactly the first but more of that later) that I was driving a car with power steering and power brakes. Now I have owned a M800 since over an year and I am too damn confident driving that car. I have had no problems with it till date, whether it be braking suddenly, or overtaking another car, or squeezing in between narrow gaps, I have done that without a hint of hesitation. I've been pretty damn comfortable with that car.

Now when I sat in the i10, of course the other guys who drove it before me had the seat pulled all the way to front, I had to push the seat back. I thought I had pushed it all the way back, but my knees were still bent close to a right angle. I like my knees to be as straight as possible while I am driving a car(or at least that's how I am used to it right now), as I want only my ankles to control the pedals and not my knees.

Anyway, all that was fine and now I was driving the car. Power-assist is such a change from the unassisted cars. I just touched the brakes to allow an Indi-cab to overtake and the car almost screeched to a halt. Damn irritating. Again, the gas pedal was also very sensitive to the touch. Since there were 5 of us in the car, I had to step on the gas while releasing the clutch but the car started revving like a loose since the accelerator was very sensitive. Felt very very different from the M800. Ultimately after a few sudden braking maneuver's and a few stalls(thanks to not wanting to rev a new engine while taking off from the first gear) when it was time for me to handover the car to the next person want to drive it, I managed to stop it slowly and softly without jerks. Of course that took an ultimate amount of concentration from my side and I think I stopped the car at least a few feet further than where I would have stopped my 800 during normal braking. Actually this makes me wonder. The power-assisted steering is supposed to provide power assist only at lower speeds and is supposed to cut off at higher speeds, say on the highways. Why can't such a thing be done for the brakes as well? Give power assist only at high speeds, and cut it off at lower speeds so that you can stop the car smoothly without shaking up the insides of the passengers in the car.

The funny thing was that even though the accelerator was feather touch types, I felt the pull was not as much as my 800. In the 800 you could feel the G-forces when you accelerate out of a gear. I guess the i10 has very short gear ratios as a gear runs out of steam very soon. Good car and very smooth, you can hardly hear the engine when the windows are rolled up, but not necessarily sporty. Also, the gear was very short throw and very smooth, but somehow it lacked the feel. While driving, I didn't know whether I had slotted it into 3rd gear or 1st gear and only when the car pulled away without revving, did I realize that it was indeed in the right gear.

Now thinking back, I had learnt driving on the 1st generation Santro and this didn't have any power assist. My 800 too doesn't have any power assist. So obviously driving the i10 was something totally new for me. But then I remembered the first car that I had taken for a test drive was the Swift. This was almost 1 year after I had learnt driving and before I bought the 800. This too had power steering, power brakes and definitely had more power than the i10. But I remember, I was at ease driving this car and it felt so natural to me. This was one of the cars that I really fell in love with. I never revved the car while releasing the clutch, never braked suddenly jerkily in horrible traffic(drove on Bannerghatta road during almost rush hour). And the gear throw felt perfect. Swift too has a very short gear throw and so did the Santro. They both felt really good. Slotted in perfectly and also felt like you were indeed changing the gear. The i10 was too short for comfort. When I think about it, it seems that the pedals of the Maruti cars have much more 'play' than the Hyundai cars. In fact when I sat inside the Verna, the gas pedal had hardly an inch of play from 0-max. Now the diesel car has 100 horses of power and with such a sensitive pedal, I, for one, will definitely go mad driving it in Indian traffic. So another reason why I was not too comfortable in the i10 was the short 'play' pedals.

Another thing about the Hyundais are the brake and gas pedals are too close to each other. It might help in the brake to accel switch while taking off on up-slopes from a standstill, but its not in my taste. I prefer using the handbrake to do that. Oh and while we are at the subject of the handbrakes, it is somewhat slightly raised, so when its fully down and you look at it, you wonder if it has been completely released.

So, lets go on to the ratings of the car.
Negatives:
1) Very short gear throw
2) Not sporty enough in terms of pulling power
3) Very short play of the pedals
4) Driving position could have been a bit higher
5) Brake and Accelerator pedals were too close to each other

Positives:
1) Smooth and refined gear lever
2) Rear seat has lots of leg room
3) Smooth and quiet ride
4) Nice looking interiors

[jkdas]

Power assist? All Santros had these. Short gear throw helps a lot in city drives.

The issue with space between accelerator and brakes, one needs to get used to it. Guess fairer sex will be happy with these.

[iraghava]

Hercules, while I agree with some of your points, I still feel that most of the gripes that you've expressed are due to non-familiarity with the controls & how to modulate them. I drive my mum's i10 every now & then & face none of the problems you describe.

Originally Posted by jkdas

Power assist? All Santros had these.

No, the first gen (Pre-Zip Drive) came with Non-PS on the lower & middle model. Only the DXII version had the PS.

[aaggoswami]

A nice and honest review of i10.

1)
Hyundai i10 has Hydraulic Power Steering ( HPS ) and not Electric Power Steering ( EPS ) as offered in Maruti Wagon R, Maruti Swift, Maruti SX4. So it wont cut off on highways.

2)
The engine is not having good power to handle i10, so they have gone in for lower gearing. However this makes the third gear a great one for city driving. They are coming up with 1.2 ltr engine with 77bhp.

3)

Originally Posted by herculesksp

Now when I sat in the i10, of course the other guys who drove it before me had the seat pulled all the way to front, I had to push the seat back. I thought I had pushed it all the way back, but my knees were still bent close to a right angle. I like my knees to be as straight as possible while I am driving a car(or at least that's how I am used to it right now), as I want only my ankles to control the pedals and not my knees.

I am facing the same problem in Maruti 800 and Baleno. After driving both the cars for more than 15 minutes, I suffer from right knee pain.

4)

Originally Posted by herculesksp

Another thing about the Hyundais are the brake and gas pedals are too close to each other. It might help in the brake to accel switch while taking off on up-slopes from a standstill, but its not in my taste. I prefer using the handbrake to do that. Oh and while we are at the subject of the handbrakes, it is somewhat slightly raised, so when its fully down and you look at it, you wonder if it has been completely released.

I am having a broad toe. Now even in 800, I am hardly able to brake properly. Whenever I press the brake pedal, the Accelerator pedal is also pressed slightly. This is very dangerous. So I have to press clutch the moment I lift off the accelerator.

5)

Power assist? All Santros had these. Short gear throw helps a lot in city drives.

No, power assisting was not offered in Santro untill the Zip drive edition. Power steering in Santro debuted in Zip Drive.

[deepakvrao]

Why can't such a thing be done for the brakes as well? Give power assist only at high speeds, and cut it off at lower speeds so that you can stop the car smoothly without shaking up the insides of the passengers in the car.

With more driving experience you get used to the different braking of different cars. My car that I drive mornings is 10 yrs old and has much weaker brakes than the car I often take out at night. Its not an issue at all - just have to get used to it.

[herculesksp]

Originally Posted by iraghava

Hercules, while I agree with some of your points, I still feel that most of the gripes that you've expressed are due to non-familiarity with the controls & how to modulate them. I drive my mum's i10 every now & then & face none of the problems you describe.

Originally Posted by deepakvrao

With more driving experience you get used to the different braking of different cars.

Ya Ya... I agree with that. I too insist that I am not used to the controls on i10 and hence I faced these problem. Just a heads up for the ones who want to switch over to i10. More importantly, I meant to show the difference in the controls between Maruti and Hyundai. Hyundai's have always had these short throw gear boxes and sensitive pedals. Maruti have had long throw boxes(except the new swift based ones) and still have pedals with long play. If not long play, then at least ones that exponentially provide power as you depress the gas pedal. At least thats how I feel from my experience.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

1)Hyundai i10 has Hydraulic Power Steering ( HPS ) and not Electric Power Steering ( EPS ) as offered in Maruti Wagon R, Maruti Swift, Maruti SX4. So it wont cut off on highways.

Isn't that dangerous? I expect even HPS to cut off at high speeds. Btw, is power assist linked to speed or RPM? i.e Do the ones that cut off cut off at high speeds or at high RPMs?

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by herculesksp

Isn't that dangerous? I expect even HPS to cut off at high speeds. Btw, is power assist linked to speed or RPM? i.e

1)
The HPS consumes more engine power as it uses engine power to run.

2)
Generally, the power available to the PS ( Power Steering ) motor is not related with engine RPM.


3)

Originally Posted by herculesksp

Do the ones that cut off cut off at high speeds or at high RPMs?

If I understood correctly, then only EPS are capable of cutting off. The newer technology allows to have EPS and HPS and is called Hybrid power steering. ( correct me if wrong ).

[PatienceWins]

Originally Posted by iraghava

No, the first gen (Pre-Zip Drive) came with Non-PS on the lower & middle model. Only the DXII version had the PS.

I owned a 1999 Santro without power steering.

[deepakvrao]

Originally Posted by PatienceWins

I owned a 1999 Santro without power steering.

Me too and I never realized how much PS is needed/useful in a small car too till I drove a PS Santro.

[rks]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

Hyundai i10 has Hydraulic Power Steering ( HPS ) and not Electric Power Steering ( EPS ) as offered in Maruti Wagon R, Maruti Swift, Maruti SX4. So it wont cut off on highways.

I don't think i10 has hydaulic PS. I read in the web that i10 comes with "Motorized power steering" and that it is similiar to EPS. Must be in tune with the latest technology.

No, power assisting was not offered in Santro untill the Zip drive edition. Power steering in Santro debuted in Zip Drive.

And I own probably one of the earliest ZipDrive models (1 lit) with HPS. The HPS is heavier than EPS, requires more maintenance and consumes a little power too. Actually the non-HPS Santro should be quicker on two counts; it is lighter, and does not consume the power of an HPS. Secondly the older Santro is Euro-I, probably meaning less back pressure from catalytic converter.

But the Santro's HPS is well worth its weight and power consumption. At high speeds, the HPS-equipped Santro will be driven with much higher confidence and should out-perform the non-PS one. The Santro's HPS is responsive and superbly accurate. The assist that it gives at high speeds is vital for precise control in lane-cutting, swerving, overtaking, etc. I can cut from left lane to right on the Expressway even at 150 kmph with great confidence.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by rks

I don't think i10 has hydaulic PS. I read in the web that i10 comes with "Motorized power steering" and that it is similiar to EPS. Must be in tune with the latest technology.

Yes you are correct, I thought that Hyundai has one of the most sensitive HPS, but its not HPS, its MDPS ( Motor Driven Power Steering ).
I am sorry for this.

However, if this is the case then surely there must be a cut off at high speeds. Can anybody make sure ?

[blue_pulsar]

@herculesksp: Swift's steering is more heavier than the i10. All i10 controls are extremely light. But regarding braking, I feel the Swift's brakes are similar to the i10.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

Yes you are correct, I thought that Hyundai has one of the most sensitive HPS, but its not HPS, its MDPS ( Motor Driven Power Steering ).

However, if this is the case then surely there must be a cut off at high speeds. Can anybody make sure ?

Isn't EPS more or less the same as MDPS?

I have driven the i10. It has a cutoff at 60kmph.

[Steeroid]

Originally Posted by rks

I can cut from left lane to right on the Expressway even at 150 kmph with great confidence.

Saar, not everyone is rks. Not everyone drives a Super Santro.

Please dont try to reduce the number of Santro drivers on the road.

[rks]

Originally Posted by Steeroid

Saar, not everyone is rks. Not everyone drives a Super Santro.

Please dont try to reduce the number of Santro drivers on the road.

You can see many reviews on the web regarding the lane-cutting abilities of the Santro at 140+ kmph. The steering peforms best on stock wheels and stock-size tyres. And my Speed 97-hogging, alloy wheels-laden Super-Santro (with overinflated tubeless tyres) is positively devilish these days.

But wait till I get my hands on the Kappa (1.2 lit) i10, once my SS retires. I will absolutely scorch the Mumbai-Pune route with that babe. Fortunately for all other road users, SS is still going strong and shows no signs of retiring in the near future. And I am firm that I will not retire my beloved SS till I get a request from her.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

Isn't EPS more or less the same as MDPS?

I think that there is a small amount of difference.
However, Electric Power Steering - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and after reading this article, I feel EPS is same as MDPS.
I am still searching the reality between EPS and MDPS.

I am attaching an image of the MDPS given at Hyundai i10 website.

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

I have driven the i10. It has a cutoff at 60kmph.

When I was once forced to drive i10 , I never went above 50kmph and hence I am not having practical experience. Will also be searching on this one.