Tubeless tyres on Steel rims

anupmathur · 17th July 2010, 14:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by shyamhegde

Hi Spike, why it is technically incorrect to use a tubeless tyre on steel rim? Concern if it is true ecause, I am also using tubeless tyres ...

'Technically' wrong because steel rims are two halves welded together whereas Alloys are single-piece castings!
Steel rims CAN leak at the weld seam; not that it always happens, but the possibility exists.

Tubeless tyres are best on alloy rims for optimum performance and benefit.

SPIKE ARRESTOR · 17th July 2010, 23:37

Hi Shyam,

It is incorrect to use a tubeless tyre on a wheel rim suited for tube type tyre and not for any steel rim as interpreted by you. The reason being the bead seat profile for tubeless and tube type rims are different.

Spike

nitrous · 18th July 2010, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

Hi Shyam,

It is incorrect to use a tubeless tyre on a wheel rim suited for tube type tyre and not for any steel rim as interpreted by you. The reason being the bead seat profile for tubeless and tube type rims are different.

Spike

Could you post self explanatory pictures of the two different profiles?

sgiitk · 19th July 2010, 11:59

I agree with nitrous, the only point is that rim should be suitable for tubeless tyres (as all for the past two decades are), should not be damaged (else get it straightened). Bead profiles are not an issue by and large.

navan49 · 21st July 2010, 05:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPIKE ARRESTOR

Hi Shyam,

It is incorrect to use a tubeless tyre on a wheel rim suited for tube type tyre and not for any steel rim as interpreted by you. The reason being the bead seat profile for tubeless and tube type rims are different.

Spike

I do agree with spike arrestor. I do use the tubeless on steel rim (OEM) since Sept 2009 and i did not come across through out my 30k kms drive till date.

citron · 21st July 2010, 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by nitrous

Could you post self explanatory pictures of the two different profiles?

Please check out the following link.

Wheel tech - Tubeless tires & Safety rims

vnabhi · 23rd July 2010, 19:22

I've changed my stock tubed Bridgestone tyres on the Waggie 2 years ago with 46.5 K on the odo. I've put Bridgestone tubeless on my stock steel rims. So far not a single issue for the past 8500 kms, though a month back the rear right wheel lost air---but there was no puncture. I suspect some kid must have played a prank on me, as even my neighbour had the same issue with one of his tyres on the same day.

navan49 · 25th July 2010, 00:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by anupmathur

'Technically' wrong because steel rims are two halves welded together whereas Alloys are single-piece castings!
Steel rims CAN leak at the weld seam; not that it always happens, but the possibility exists.

Tubeless tyres are best on alloy rims for optimum performance and benefit.

Just look any Ritz car except ZXi all these cars are coming with JK tubeless in the steel rims. If it is technically wrong how can the great MUL can sell the Ritz with Steel rims with Tubeless. Please check before telling like technically wrong, which might break the hearts of some people.

radek · 30th July 2010, 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by navan49

Just look any Ritz car except ZXi all these cars are coming with JK tubeless in the steel rims. If it is technically wrong how can the great MUL can sell the Ritz with Steel rims with Tubeless. Please check before telling like technically wrong, which might break the hearts of some people.

Your point is correct. I also think that stock steel rims that comes with tubeless tyres, will be appropriate for tubeless. Having said that I do not see any reason why steel rims will create problem like 'breaking the heart'.

sgiitk · 30th July 2010, 23:14

@anupmathur: Never heard of the joints leaking. I do remember in the 1970's there was a question about wire rims. Here the leakage was an issue. The AA of UK advised extreme caution with tubeless tyres on wire rims. I had tubeless in the UK in the early 1970's even then the question of leakage from the rim welds never came up.

magikrider · 15th September 2010, 15:09

Guys, I had changed my factory fitted 155/70 R13 tube tyres with new 165/65 R13 Tubeless tyres on the same old regular factory fitted rims on my Santro sometime back. my rims seemed ok without any bends anywhere. but i did notice some rust inside them.

now the problem is that it leaks air and i have to fill up air every week atleast or it gets flat. I have already had two flat tyres at the same time because it was unused for a couple of weeks. I also tried changing the valves as suggested by the tyre dealer but in vain. when checked it was found that air leaks slowly throughout the walls almost. the dealer and also my garage guy suggested that I put tubes inside those tubeless tyres to get rid of the problem if I dont want to buy new alloys! I took a second opinion from a different dealer and he suggested that it was a mistake to install the 165/65 R13 tubeless tyres at the first place. and now it can be solved by repairing the rims by removing any rust within and painting it and it should solve the problem and there is no need to put tubes inside the tyres. but I don't think it will work properly as when I got new valves installed the last time, the tyre guy did scrape the rust formed on the borders of the rims but still it didnt work so.

so now my question is how safe is it if I put tubes inside those tubeless tyres. so shall I again exchange those almost new (few months old) tyres again for the regular 155/70 R13 tube tyres?? or is there any other option? please let me know what to do as I am really bugged with this problem.

Note: Mods please post this in the right thread if any and delete this thread. I did not find any right active thread so I started new thread.

Jaggu · 15th September 2010, 15:15

Option 1: Buy a new set of steel rims, they don't cost much.

Option 2: Do a thorough clean up of surface and paint it and refit the tyres, works most of the time.

Option 3: Fit tubes, but then the whole point of having tubeless tyre is wasted.

magikrider · 15th September 2010, 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Option 1: Buy a new set of steel rims, they don't cost much.

Option 2: Do a thorough clean up of surface and paint it and refit the tyres, works most of the time.

Option 3: Fit tubes, but then the whole point of having tubeless tyre is wasted.

Thanks Jaggu. I did thought of replacing old rims but my garage guy said that it might work only temporarily because these regular rims are not suited for tubless tyres. and I am also skeptical as what if it still leaks like on my current rims as my current rims are also not in bad condition. there is no bend also anywhere but it still leaks. and there is not too much of rust either so. a driver in my building said that these tubeless tyres doesn't work properly on regular rims. he also had similar problem with his owners car and he got them installed with tubes and thats the only solution.

but I also read somewhere on net that it is not safe to install tubes in tubeless tyres as the side walls of tubeless tyres are more thick than tubed tyres and so it causes more friction and the result can be in a burst!

so what should i do now?

sgiitk · 15th September 2010, 15:56

@magikrider; I have a similar problem with my Accent which had OE alloys, in excellent condition. One day I accidentally found the bug - the tyres were leaking on the bead. Two tyres were bad, the other three were Ok. Not had any issues with my Santro though. This has steel rims. May be the older Bridgestone beads did not seal that well.

amit_mechengg · 15th September 2010, 16:09

if there is rust or perforations in the rim the air will leak.

i am using tubeless michelins since long time on my stock rims on alto.

no issues at all.

17th July 2010, 23:37	#122
SPIKE ARRESTOR Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 2,854 Thanked: 1,532 Times	Hi Shyam, It is incorrect to use a tubeless tyre on a wheel rim suited for tube type tyre and not for any steel rim as interpreted by you. The reason being the bead seat profile for tubeless and tube type rims are different. Spike
	() Thanks

19th July 2010, 11:59	#124
sgiitk BANNED Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gurugram Posts: 7,969 Thanked: 4,788 Times	I agree with nitrous, the only point is that rim should be suitable for tubeless tyres (as all for the past two decades are), should not be damaged (else get it straightened). Bead profiles are not an issue by and large.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2010, 19:22	#127
vnabhi Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2007 Location: DC -> DC Posts: 5,958 Thanked: 2,393 Times View My Garage	I've changed my stock tubed Bridgestone tyres on the Waggie 2 years ago with 46.5 K on the odo. I've put Bridgestone tubeless on my stock steel rims. So far not a single issue for the past 8500 kms, though a month back the rear right wheel lost air---but there was no puncture. I suspect some kid must have played a prank on me, as even my neighbour had the same issue with one of his tyres on the same day.
	() Thanks

30th July 2010, 23:14	#130
sgiitk BANNED Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gurugram Posts: 7,969 Thanked: 4,788 Times	@anupmathur: Never heard of the joints leaking. I do remember in the 1970's there was a question about wire rims. Here the leakage was an issue. The AA of UK advised extreme caution with tubeless tyres on wire rims. I had tubeless in the UK in the early 1970's even then the question of leakage from the rim welds never came up.
	() Thanks

15th September 2010, 15:09	#131
magikrider BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: MH-01 Posts: 513 Thanked: 119 Times	Air Leak on my new Tubeless tyres on regular rims! Guys, I had changed my factory fitted 155/70 R13 tube tyres with new 165/65 R13 Tubeless tyres on the same old regular factory fitted rims on my Santro sometime back. my rims seemed ok without any bends anywhere. but i did notice some rust inside them. now the problem is that it leaks air and i have to fill up air every week atleast or it gets flat. I have already had two flat tyres at the same time because it was unused for a couple of weeks. I also tried changing the valves as suggested by the tyre dealer but in vain. when checked it was found that air leaks slowly throughout the walls almost. the dealer and also my garage guy suggested that I put tubes inside those tubeless tyres to get rid of the problem if I dont want to buy new alloys! I took a second opinion from a different dealer and he suggested that it was a mistake to install the 165/65 R13 tubeless tyres at the first place. and now it can be solved by repairing the rims by removing any rust within and painting it and it should solve the problem and there is no need to put tubes inside the tyres. but I don't think it will work properly as when I got new valves installed the last time, the tyre guy did scrape the rust formed on the borders of the rims but still it didnt work so. so now my question is how safe is it if I put tubes inside those tubeless tyres. so shall I again exchange those almost new (few months old) tyres again for the regular 155/70 R13 tube tyres?? or is there any other option? please let me know what to do as I am really bugged with this problem. Note: Mods please post this in the right thread if any and delete this thread. I did not find any right active thread so I started new thread. Last edited by Jaggu : 15th September 2010 at 15:13. Reason: Please use Search before opening a New thread. Thanks
	() Thanks

15th September 2010, 15:15	#132
Jaggu Team-BHP Support Join Date: May 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 20,215 Thanked: 15,904 Times	Option 1: Buy a new set of steel rims, they don't cost much. Option 2: Do a thorough clean up of surface and paint it and refit the tyres, works most of the time. Option 3: Fit tubes, but then the whole point of having tubeless tyre is wasted.
	() Thanks

15th September 2010, 15:56	#134
sgiitk BANNED Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gurugram Posts: 7,969 Thanked: 4,788 Times	@magikrider; I have a similar problem with my Accent which had OE alloys, in excellent condition. One day I accidentally found the bug - the tyres were leaking on the bead. Two tyres were bad, the other three were Ok. Not had any issues with my Santro though. This has steel rims. May be the older Bridgestone beads did not seal that well.
	() Thanks

15th September 2010, 16:09	#135
amit_mechengg Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 2,487 Thanked: 2,251 Times View My Garage	if there is rust or perforations in the rim the air will leak. i am using tubeless michelins since long time on my stock rims on alto. no issues at all.
	() Thanks