Using Tube in Tubeless Tyre!

mmmjgm · 17th March 2009, 14:38

Dude, remove the tube and have the tyre replaced/repaired ASAP.

We had a safari, with Tubeless radials on it, some how during the course of its life many drivers drove the car, someone placed tubes to repair a puncture, one fine day, the tube burst due to excessive flexing against the sidewall (heat generated due to friction with the internal walls of the tyre), luckily we were at low speeds and meters away from home.

Extensive tube use in a tubeless tyre is not safe. The tubeless tyre is designed to have a layer of impermeable rubber inside to avoid leakage of air.

Have it changed as soon as you can and avoid high speed runs (anything over 60kmph while the tube is on).

Cheers
M

PankajP · 17th March 2009, 14:51

Hey all,

Thanks for all your replies.

just wanted to tell you all that the tyre is all right nothing has happened to it. This tyre is new one which I had replaced after 1st bump.

The problem is only with alloy wheel which is bent slightly. I just now called up Tata-Fiat showroom in Pune and they quoted 5900 for a single Fiat Alloy wheel.

What I am thinking is to keep that bent alloy wheel as a spare(5th) and put on new one on the car.

But I think 5900 is too much for a single alloy when I had heard that we get all 5 in 12k. Need to research on that

sgiitk · 17th March 2009, 15:00

Have we forgotten the fifties and sixties. All cars came with tubeless tyres. As son as you had the first puncture you had to put in a tube since there was no facility for fixing tubeless tyres. I think the first car to come with tubeless tyres in the recent past was the Cielo.

The only difference between tubeless and tube tyres is a soft rubber lining to hold the air. Otherwise theya re identical. So go ahead and use the 'now tubed' tyre with impunity.

goel.honey · 19th March 2009, 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgiitk

Have we forgotten the fifties and sixties. All cars came with tubeless tyres. As son as you had the first puncture you had to put in a tube since there was no facility for fixing tubeless tyres. I think the first car to come with tubeless tyres in the recent past was the Cielo.

The only difference between tubeless and tube tyres is a soft rubber lining to hold the air. Otherwise theya re identical. So go ahead and use the 'now tubed' tyre with impunity.

If this is true then I might find some use of the two A-Drives in my garage. But will it be safe having a tube in a tubeless tyre??
Also I'll need to get a sidewall patch in one of the tyres as well. So please let me know if it is safe as well.

Raccoon · 20th March 2009, 00:56

Dude, is this even a valid question? Do you know a single tyre company that says you can use tubes in a tubeless?? Now supposing some smart-*** bloke like me

, on the internet, says that you can safely do so, and you belive me, and end up in a hospital due to some mishap or something, you can be pretty sure I won't be paying your hospital bills...

sgiitk · 20th March 2009, 10:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by goel.honey

If this is true then I might find some use of the two A-Drives in my garage. But will it be safe having a tube in a tubeless tyre??
Also I'll need to get a sidewall patch in one of the tyres as well. So please let me know if it is safe as well.

1. No problem in putting a tube in a tubeless tyre. Perfectly fine.
2. Any repairs outside the tread area are a big NO-NO. So patching a sidewall is definitely out. You have to get a new tyre.

goel.honey · 20th March 2009, 20:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raccoon

Dude, is this even a valid question? Do you know a single tyre company that says you can use tubes in a tubeless?? Now supposing some smart-*** bloke like me

, on the internet, says that you can safely do so, and you belive me, and end up in a hospital due to some mishap or something, you can be pretty sure I won't be paying your hospital bills...

Thats the reason I was asking. Just wanted to confirm the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgiitk

1. No problem in putting a tube in a tubeless tyre. Perfectly fine.
2. Any repairs outside the tread area are a big NO-NO. So patching a sidewall is definitely out. You have to get a new tyre.

Thanks mate. Atleast now I can use 1 of those tyres.

zensure · 21st March 2009, 04:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by yzfrj

Tube-type and tubeless are made differently.
Tubeless tyre is supposed to have a stiffer side wall.

Yes a tube can be used in a tubeless tyre, but this is not a permanent solution and should be used in case of any emergency.

A tubeless with tube as a spare will be fine.
But for regular use, I'm not sure.
Its not designed for that so the results of a tube in a tubeless is a bit of uncharted territory and is definitely "not" recommended in the long run.

During the recent wheel balancing, I realized that all my my tyres (stock on Swift VXi -- JK Tornado Tubeless) have tubes!! I had driven this car for 16K Kms in almost three years on quite a a few occasions on real bad roads!! No punctures so far (touchwood).

The tyre has a clear marking on it saying tubeless

I presume this is as per Maruti standard, since that's how this car was delivered to me!

I am just curious -- does all the swifts' sotck tubeless tyres have tubes in it? Can folks corroborate this?

Is it recommended to remove the tubes?

regards

SS-Traveller · 21st March 2009, 10:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by zensure

does all the swifts' sotck tubeless tyres have tubes in it? Can folks corroborate this?

Is it recommended to remove the tubes?

Zensure, my Swift ZXi has JK tubeless tyres, and there are no tubes inside. This (fitting tubes in a tubeless tyre) would be a highly unusual practice, sometimes followed by commercial (taxi) drivers.

Was your car run/maintained by any other person during its lifetime? Otherwise, if you have been the 1st owner, you can lodge a complaint with the dealer you procured it from.

And please get rid of the tubes from the tyres, since the puncture-resistant characteristics of a tubeless tyre are lost when a tube is present inside.

anupmathur · 21st March 2009, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

And please get rid of the tubes from the tyres, since the puncture-resistant characteristics of a tubeless tyre are lost when a tube is present inside.

Very interesting thought!
How does this happen?

SS-Traveller · 21st March 2009, 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

puncture-resistant characteristics of a tubeless tyre are lost when a tube is present inside.

Quote:

Originally Posted by anupmathur

How does this happen?

With a nail buried in the tyre tread of a TL tyre, the leakage of air is only through the thick rubber around the nail - a slow process. With a nail going thru the tread and the tube, while the tyre rolls, the tip of the nail gradually makes a bigger hole in the tube (due to a slight shuffling movement between tyre and tube) -this makes for faster air loss from a tubed tyre (or a TL tyre with a tube in it).

MindSpeeDs · 21st March 2009, 11:10

A puncture on the side wall made me go for a tube in a tubeless tyre. 5k km done, no issues as yet.

anupmathur · 21st March 2009, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

...... the tip of the nail gradually makes a bigger hole in the tube (due to a slight shuffling movement between tyre and tube) -this makes for faster air loss from a tubed tyre (or a TL tyre with a tube in it).

Two things:
1) What if the puncturing nail does not stay embedded?
2) What if the nozzle of the tube is fitted to the rim with suitable gaskets to prevent air leaks from that portion?

SS-Traveller · 21st March 2009, 11:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by anupmathur

Two things:
1) What if the puncturing nail does not stay embedded?
Ans: Ok, so you mean the nail performed a quick in-and-out action on the tyre and did not continue the journey with you? So the tyre also will have premature loss of air!
2) What if the nozzle of the tube is fitted to the rim with suitable gaskets to prevent air leaks from that portion?

Ans: I haven't seen such gaskets that'll make nozzles leakproof in tyres.

Humans?

anupmathur · 21st March 2009, 11:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by SS-Traveller

Ans: I haven't seen such gaskets that'll make nozzles leakproof in tyres.

Neither have I, LOL!
I asked because the air loss would occur from the nozzle mounting hole. What is the other possibility?
The bead is well sealed against the rim, the tyre rubber is the same. Rapid loss does not occur from the hole that a nail has left behind.
So the quick loss occurs from the nozzle fixing hole in the rim? If this is sealed with ordinary rubber/fibre washers, would not air loss take place as slowly as in a tubeless condition?

Just thoughts!

17th March 2009, 14:38	#16
mmmjgm BHPian Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: BOM, PNQ, DXB Posts: 398 Thanked: 30 Times	Dude, remove the tube and have the tyre replaced/repaired ASAP. We had a safari, with Tubeless radials on it, some how during the course of its life many drivers drove the car, someone placed tubes to repair a puncture, one fine day, the tube burst due to excessive flexing against the sidewall (heat generated due to friction with the internal walls of the tyre), luckily we were at low speeds and meters away from home. Extensive tube use in a tubeless tyre is not safe. The tubeless tyre is designed to have a layer of impermeable rubber inside to avoid leakage of air. Have it changed as soon as you can and avoid high speed runs (anything over 60kmph while the tube is on). Cheers M
	() Thanks

17th March 2009, 14:51	#17
PankajP BHPian Join Date: May 2008 Location: Pune Posts: 67 Thanked: 0 Times	Hey all, Thanks for all your replies. just wanted to tell you all that the tyre is all right nothing has happened to it. This tyre is new one which I had replaced after 1st bump. The problem is only with alloy wheel which is bent slightly. I just now called up Tata-Fiat showroom in Pune and they quoted 5900 for a single Fiat Alloy wheel. What I am thinking is to keep that bent alloy wheel as a spare(5th) and put on new one on the car. But I think 5900 is too much for a single alloy when I had heard that we get all 5 in 12k. Need to research on that
	() Thanks

17th March 2009, 15:00	#18
sgiitk BANNED Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gurugram Posts: 7,969 Thanked: 4,788 Times	Have we forgotten the fifties and sixties. All cars came with tubeless tyres. As son as you had the first puncture you had to put in a tube since there was no facility for fixing tubeless tyres. I think the first car to come with tubeless tyres in the recent past was the Cielo. The only difference between tubeless and tube tyres is a soft rubber lining to hold the air. Otherwise theya re identical. So go ahead and use the 'now tubed' tyre with impunity.
	(1) Thanks

20th March 2009, 00:56	#20
Raccoon Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Poona Posts: 1,851 Thanked: 116 Times	Dude, is this even a valid question? Do you know a single tyre company that says you can use tubes in a tubeless?? Now supposing some smart-*** bloke like me , on the internet, says that you can safely do so, and you belive me, and end up in a hospital due to some mishap or something, you can be pretty sure I won't be paying your hospital bills...
	() Thanks

21st March 2009, 11:10	#27
MindSpeeDs BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: hyderabad Posts: 116 Thanked: 84 Times	A puncture on the side wall made me go for a tube in a tubeless tyre. 5k km done, no issues as yet.
	() Thanks