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Old 18th August 2021, 14:08   #1
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Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

In an article in Autocar U.K. by Mr James Ruppert, that I was going through, it has been revealed that the 10 % ethanol blended in unleaded petrol as concoction causes damage to older engines. E10 petrol is expected in fuel dispensing stations in the U.K. from next month onwards. Some of these facts had come to the fore earlier, that most of us were in the know.

In the U.K. they have three choices for petrol namely the E5 super-unleaded high octane, E5 (5% blending of ethanol with 95% unleaded petrol) and E10 (expected from September 2021) as options for petrol buyers. The E5 is expected to be available for a further next five years. The costlier, high octane (97-99% Ron), superunleaded E5 petrol as an option is available to buyers at an extra cost of 12p/ litre. The article says that if by mistake an old car owner has got a fill of the E10 petrol, damage control by way subsequent topping up with with the high octane super-unleaded E5 petrol is recommended but not habitually, according to the oil companies including Shell.

Here, there are words of caution for users of E10 petrol in older cars and bikes that is universally sold now in India. We have no E5 option here at all of any kind.

According to the article:-

Quote:

"Certainly, proper classics that are 40 years old or more will all have problems, but so will modern classics from the 1990s, a lot of cool motorbikes, stupid mopeds and most likely petrol lawnmowers. It couldn’t be easier to check whether you need to worry, of course (simply visit gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol), but what are the main downsides for owners of older cars? The higher bioethanol content in E10 is corrosive to rubber parts, gaskets, seals, metals and plastics, which causes engine damage, so it could dislodge deposits in older engines and fuel systems, causing blockages. It should only be used with expert advice, which means pretty much never".
It further recommends corrctive measures and says:-

Quote:

"What owners of vulnerable cars can do is source replacement engine components made with ethanol-compatible materials."
This is a very tall order for the older classics and vintages in India, as getting the conventional, non bio-fuel compatible spares becomes a challenge on most occasions.

Among the plus points is that ethanol in E10 actually absorbs CO2, partially offsetting greenhouse gas emissions.

During the past ten years of usage he U.K. data says:-

Quote:

"blending renewable fuels in this way has contributed to a CO2 emissions reduction equal to taking more than a million cars off the road."
Incidentally, diesel in U.K. is blended with 7% biofuel.

The downside of E10 according to the article is:-

Quote:

"research carried out by our sister title What Car? revealed that E10 is potentially less efficient than the current E5 blend of petrol, with the problem being worse in smaller-engined vehicles. Drivers of shopping cars would end up filling their cars more often, which isn’t the point of owning a small car with a tiny engine."
The U.K. scenario as the article says is that:-

Quote:

"92.2% of the petrol-engined vehicles in the UK are compatible with E10. Since 2011, all new cars sold in this country have had to be E10-compatible. Vehicles manufactured from 2019 onwards usually have an E5 and E10 label close to their fuel filler caps, showing which fuels they can accept. So what’s the problem? Well, drivers of cars registered before 2002 have been advised not to use E10 in their vehicles, because problems have been reported."
The full article:-

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/u...ffect-your-car

Our oil companies need to take a cue and make available E5 (a lesser evil) as an option for older petrol vehicle users as the long term damages could be monumental for the vintage and classic car and bike community.

Last edited by anjan_c2007 : 18th August 2021 at 14:12.
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Old 18th August 2021, 18:26   #2
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re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

GoI is planning big for use and export of Ethanol. We are going to see a lot of blending.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anjan_c2007 View Post
Our oil companies need to take a cue and make available E5 (a lesser evil) as an option for older petrol vehicle users as the long term damages could be monumental for the vintage and classic car and bike community.
Any thoughts on how you plan to try and mitigate the effects on your classics ? What about the older bikes - does the 2T oil help any ?
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Old 18th August 2021, 21:53   #3
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re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

We are moving to E20 petrol in another two years.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.the...17728.ece/amp/

I don't think this decision shall change, nor would the oil companies make a quantity of E5 available at major outlets, if not all.

It can be investigated if a an additive or filter that can absorb/separate the ethenol can be designed and installed in the vehicle. Off course, this shall reduce the quantity of useable fuel.

Regards,

Last edited by Anwesh : 18th August 2021 at 22:03.
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Old 19th August 2021, 08:32   #4
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re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

Here is an interesting video on how to remove ethanol from petrol



Cheers

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Old 19th August 2021, 08:48   #5
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Re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

Not just old cars, there are doubts on ethanol-blends damaging newer petrol engines too. Link to a recent discussion on the same (Impact of 20% ethanol petrol on current petrol engines).
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Old 27th August 2021, 13:10   #6
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Re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

Though the government is in a pushing hurry to switch over to bio-fuels, the long term interests of all stakeholders also needs to be taken into account. For vintage and classic car owners, the spares are extremely difficult to source many a time, and such damages to crucial components of the machine due to the wrong fuel usage would be like a bolt from the blue, thrust upon the respective owners.

The Niti Aayog’s “Committee on Roadmap for Ethanol Blending in India by 2025”, in its report says that ethanol blending reduces the petrol engine’s fuel efficiency by 6-7 % for four wheelers and 3-4 % for two wheelers. These are official figures. This Committee in it's 72 page report appears to be oblivious about the existence of older automobiles and also to existence of vintage and classic automobiles, 99% of which have petrol engines. These do not find any mention anywhere in this ethanol blending report. Bulldozing aside the damage caused to such categories of automobiles and thereby causing agony and financial losses to the owners is unjust.

The petrol presently sold in our country universally has an octane rating of 91, whereas for ethanol blended fuel, higher 95-99 octane content would be recommended to partly offset the potential damage. Since May 2021, Indianoil has started marketing Octane 95 (XP95) petrol in select outlets. The availability needs to be expanded and other oil companies need to also retail similar 95 octane petrol. High octane fuels burn cleaner and ensure better combustion of fuel. This XP95 petrol is just about 60 paise costlier than the 91 octane being sold now. Octane rating of a fuel essentially highlights its tendency to resist knocking – a phenomenon caused by the untimely ignition of fuel inside the combustion chamber that can damage the engine. The higher the rating, the better the knock resistance, which translates into improved performance and fuel economy.

The plus points for ethanol blending include the fact that it is a proven absorber of carbon dioxide and hydrocarbons in the noxious petrol engine emissions by upto 20 % of volume. All the newer petrol engines are however compatible to use only upto 10% of ethanol and no more as many car’s owner’s manuals caution.

Our oil companies need to be mandated to also offer E5 high-octane petrol as an option for older vehicle owners, to prevent avoidable and undue damage to these machines.

Last edited by anjan_c2007 : 27th August 2021 at 13:12.
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Old 9th September 2021, 15:11   #7
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Re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

This does sounds like bad news to us vintage car owners. Which begs the question- are all petrol pumps across India selling E10 fuel as yet or is this a future plan only to be implemented with E20?
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Old 3rd August 2023, 00:23   #8
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Re: Warning! E10 ethanol-blended petrol can be damaging for older cars & bikes

Hi, today I filled petrol in my car at Indian oil in Pune and pump had it clearly written as 'petrol with 10% ethanol'. Then I read a few articles suggesting that Government has already rolled out E10 from quite some time now but it's not very clear. Can someone please clarify whether whatever petrol we get these days is only E10 or is it an option along with pure petrol. I also read that even E20 pumps are rolled out in some states.
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