[BULLDOG]

HI fellow BHPers. I know import restrictions on cars older than 3 years but must be a way around this? Is it possible to import a car as "parts" if partly dismantled? I have had an offer on my Jaguar that includes an MG MGBGT in very good condition as trade so just toying with the idea of exporting to India if it goes through. I estimate I could sell it (including shipping to Mumbai) for INR450,000 for example.

[canonball]

Well this seems to be a pretty grey area some people have cars down but it seems mighty difficult to get to the bottom of this I too am interested in bringing down classics/vinatges

You may want to talk to custom house clearing agents on how this can be done through TR

[Benson]

Originally Posted by BULLDOG

Is it possible to import a car as "parts" if partly dismantled?

I Think it is not possible to import car as parts since only new spares are allowed to be imported. Other wise you can just go about importing the same and pay penalty. But you will not be able to register it as a car.

[ajay99]

Originally Posted by Benson

I Think it is not possible to import car as parts since only new spares are allowed to be imported. Other wise you can just go about importing the same and pay penalty. But you will not be able to register it as a car.

you can import new parts but you will have pay customs duty on it.

[canonball]

Originally Posted by ajay99

you can import new parts but you will have pay customs duty on it.

but will have to keep car as show piece in your living room as you won't be able to register it

[harit]

As of today, the rules are very clear, no import of cars more than 3 years old. There are many here who have the ability, desire, means and contacts to buy and import some really exclusive cars. But it would have to be done by circumventing existing laws which is just not worth the bother. I dare to suggest that if India would allow import of vintage and classics, the price of these cars in India would drop to a realistic level and foreign dealers would see some increase in their turnover. Remember, earlier Indian tourists were insignificant and not catered for, now that the government allows tourist travel, Indian tourists have become a big factor.

Importing cars in bits and pieces is also a no-no. If caught, then there is hell to pay, even if you buy yourself out of a mess, you still have to pay. And get the goods get confiscated. And sold in customs auctions. And what car would you dismantle and bring into India? Just like cars which got dismantled and went out of India, we recognise them when they resurface. Similarly, cars like Rolls, Bentley and others are constantly tracked, and will stand out when resurfacing. You can bring in new car parts legally, but try bringing in a chassis, or a complete body and see what happens. Thereafter registration will be difficult. Remember the scam about the super bikes. They were assembled from parts brought in by misdeclaration, assembled, registered with some help, and still they were seized. And so far nothing seems to have been settled by way of penalties, amnesties, prosecution, confiscation and whatever. In short cases are going on.

One should forget about bringing into India a vintage or classic car till the government policy changes. There is no provision in the laws permitting this. The laws were framed without application of mind, only current models were thought of. For example, everyone knows that a 5 year old car abroad hits rock bottom in value, and a fancy 5 year old Merc can be cheaper than a brand new Skoda. If imports were allowed, then why not buy a second hand 5 year Merc? That is why also the right hand drive law was introduced. They never thought of our hobby. Anyway, the RHD rule will also restrict the number of vintage/classic cars available for Indian customers.
And, a foreign fitness certificate may not be recognised by our authorities.

Cheers harit

[Stanher]

Does the '3-year old max' law apply to 2-wheelers as well? I had once seen a rather complete but forlorn Lambretta early LD advertised FOR FREE on ebay italy!! It was said to be sans documents. It would've atleast made a very good parts scooter if brought down; for the zero price it was being given for, even the shipping charges/duty/customs I'm sure wouldve been less if not the same as what some of the dealers here currently demand for LDs that they manage to have!

[canonball]

From what I have seen (seen cars physically) people have brought in cars older than 3 years as personal unaccompanied baggage = TR and I have been given to understand that there is a penalty which is charged and once payed you are free to register and use car but no one as yet has been able to give clear information or schedule of charges/penalty. It seems things are done more on case by case.

[DKG]

Actually the government is contradicting itself. On one hand they have restricted the export of cars from India on grounds its India's national treasure. Then why restrict new additions to "national treasure" ?

May I suggest someone with reasonably deep pockets files a PIL challenging this ban on imports. I want to see some Duesenbergs in Hyderabad again and some Packard V12's !!

BTW while on the subject of a PIL we should include challenging the import duties on spare parts for these "national treasures". What a contradiction, on one hand you say its India's heritage and on the other you want to make it difficult for the owner to maintain this heritage.

If I were a rich man...zoobie doobie...am sure I'd be the biggest pain in the Supreme Court's b**t

[Stanher]

Originally Posted by DKG

Actually the government is contradicting itself. On one hand they have restricted the export of cars from India on grounds its India's national treasure. Then why restrict new additions to "national treasure" ?

If I were a rich man...zoobie doobie...am sure I'd be the biggest pain in the Supreme Court's b**t

We'd also become a biggest pain the scooter/bike exporter's b**ts who wouldnt be able to ask half of the kind of prices they now demand for an LD/series 1 Lambretta!!

[harit]

Originally Posted by canonball

From what I have seen (seen cars physically) people have brought in cars older than 3 years as personal unaccompanied baggage = TR and I have been given to understand that there is a penalty which is charged and once payed you are free to register and use car but no one as yet has been able to give clear information or schedule of charges/penalty. It seems things are done more on case by case.

Exactly. There is no clear info. This is a grey area, open to interpretation. While one does see cars older than 3 years being brought in, even in left hand drive, most came in before the rules were made more rigid. And many cars did get stuck in customs and are still stuck. I am sure you heard about a Mini in customs. They want Rolls money to release a Mini!! In the last one year very very few cars got in. And some came under a carnet.

Originally Posted by DKG

Actually the government is contradicting itself. On one hand they have restricted the export of cars from India on grounds its India's national treasure. Then why restrict new additions to "national treasure" ?

May I suggest someone with reasonably deep pockets files a PIL challenging this ban on imports. I want to see some Duesenbergs in Hyderabad again and some Packard V12's !!

BTW while on the subject of a PIL we should include challenging the import duties on spare parts for these "national treasures". What a contradiction, on one hand you say its India's heritage and on the other you want to make it difficult for the owner to maintain this heritage.

If I were a rich man...zoobie doobie...am sure I'd be the biggest pain in the Supreme Court's b**t

Fully endorse what you say. But, government policies are made for the masses. And the masses are not interested to import vintage cars, so our concerns are overlooked. The policy is to restrict import of cars and protect domestic industry. The same problem with used parts. And the same problem with road tax. Simply non application of mind.
In the olden days when the government came up with import policies, they would issue amendments from time to time to correct such overlooked subject or missed items. Now they have a liberal policy why bother for such small things.
Remember, a rich man Mr. Mallya also had trouble bringing back a National Treasure, Tipu's sword. First he was asked how did it come in. After he took it out he was asked how did he do that. Absolute non application of mind. But this heritage is on the fringe of concerns of Indian society, so we have a long way to go. We do have a Ministry of Culture, but I could not find who the current minister is when I googled. Such people have to be invited for vintage car rallys, nutured to become our friends. That would help more than a PIL. In Maharashtra we have such relationships, ministers and politicians have attended rally's, only to have the benefits obtained hijacked by an individual!! And heritage be damned, we play politics.

Originally Posted by Stanher

We'd also become a biggest pain the scooter/bike exporter's b**ts who wouldnt be able to ask half of the kind of prices they now demand for an LD/series 1 Lambretta!!

Sorry, I did not get you. Most scooters are legally exported, demand is high and hence higher prices. What you need is foresight, my LD came for 7K. But before these scooters went out, who ever looked at a Vijay scooter? Plenty were scrapped. All prices of all collectibles will keep on going up, depending on demand. Sad but hard reality.
And do not forget, the value of our money is also going down.

Cheers harit

[DKG]

Harit since the government will have no trouble in deciding if a particular vehicle is national treasure we really should now wangle out duty free import of spares for these cars.

Can you suggest how we launch some kind of a campaign? Maybe a petition signed by all of us sent to the concerned Minister with a copy to the Prime Minister?

We need to get the duties waived asap.

[john a milne]

This is a most important issue that needs to be pursued from all angles, and here are a few suggestions.

1. Contact the editors of the various Car Mags to ask their support.
2. Contact all the Vintage & Classic Clubs.
3. Contact the Statesman for their support and a list of all the participants in their Rallies.
4. Contact Diljeet Titus, one of Delhi's most prominent collectors, a prominent lawyer and a vested interest in this issue.

I'm sure there are other avenues as well and hope that this will be the start of a successful journey.

[canonball]

I am willing to lend a hand out here in Mumbai but as John stated why not talk to Titus on this issue I am sure he can do some basic law referencing/research and may be consider putting up a PIL if there is potential. I don't know him personally but I am sure harit knows him. Perhaps a call to at least bounce this may help how about it? I think it is time for some logical amendments in the import of classics/vintages. The governments main concern will be abuse I am sure some sort of law which comes with certian conditions could be looked at. Perhaps the VCCI can be the deciding/governing body? Not sure of their eligibility.

[DKG]

Originally Posted by canonball

The governments main concern will be abuse I am sure some sort of law which comes with certian conditions could be looked at.

A simple pre-requisite to applying for duty waiver can be submission of proof of ownership. In any genuine case where the owner, RC and car can be produced to support the application the government can easily verify the case and waive duties

I don't think its that complex a issue.