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Old 6th February 2021, 15:52   #31
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Default Re: Automatic | Rough Use Resistant | Mass Market Car

Based on your requirements I would say

1. Honda Amaze CVT Petrol or Diesel
2. Maruti Brezza TC
3. Maruti Baleno CVT
4. Honda Jazz CVT
5. I could see you have Sonet GTX in your list. Can I also suggest you to look at Honda City CVT if you can extend your budget.
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Old 6th February 2021, 19:29   #32
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Default Re: Automatic | Rough Use Resistant | Mass Market Car

So far as safety is concerned , Amaze has 4 star safety rating, it is safer than Glanza/Baleno. See some videos on youtube about Baleno build quality and you will know what I am talking about. Been driving it for 2 years, it is very reliable, still feels brand new. Also, larger boot space sure helps a lot.
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Old 6th February 2021, 20:02   #33
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I would recommend the following (in no particular order):

1. Jazz CVT - My father in law bought one in December and is super happy with it. My father drives a Jazz iDTEC MT and we are happy with it too. It is spacious inside and has a very usable boot too.

2. Vitara Brezza / Urban Cruiser - Powerful 1.5L engine mated to 4 speed TC. You will enjoy it within city and to an extent on highway too.

3. S-Cross - Zeta TC 1.5L will fulfill your needs and more.

4. Toyota Yaris CVT - I am not conversant with the variants but I understand CVT is offered in all variants and has good safety specs too.

5. Honda Amaze iDTEC CVT - get the top end variant. My pick. You won't regret for sure.
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Old 6th February 2021, 20:46   #34
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Default Re: Automatic | Rough Use Resistant | Mass Market Car

Read your post and the three cars that I think suit you the most are:
Suzuki S-Cross
Ford Ecosport
Honda amaze

All three have different body shape. One is a baby American SUV, One is a Japanese sedan and one is a crossover with European vibes. All three are equally good.

1. S-Cross 1.5 petrol AT: It has solid build quality, good ground clearance and drives like a car. It has torque converter auto that is considered very reliable. Service network is largest so finding good service is not hard. But service is not cheap. Also, S-Cross does not have SUV looks if that matters to you. Its a proper crossover. It is also as long as a Creta (4300mm) so longer than amaze and EcoSport by 30cm. This means more cabin space but also more space requirement on the road.

2. Ford EcoSport: It will have the cheapest service and maintenance cost. Many Ford service centers are good but the coverage is not as big as Maruti or Hyundai. It has good build quality, excellent SUV looks. Ride quality is class leading in its segment.

3. Honda amaze: Many members have posted a lot about this one already so I dont have much to add. Honda service is good in most places. Old amaze was closer to Brio, the current one is closer to the city. Recommended if you want a reliable Honda sedan rather than a SUV or a crossover.
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Old 7th February 2021, 17:06   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srirang View Post
Hi,

I am a first time car buyer and I am what TBHP would refer to as a "non-car guy". I am looking for an automatic car purely as a commute tool. So after a bit of reading and talking to friends I have come up with a list of requirements :
You have done your homework well. If I add my two cents here what I have just posted elsewhere today.

My suggestion would be to stick to Japanese. You should not look beyond Baleno CVT, Jazz CVT or Amaze diesel CVT. For intra-city driving, nothing beats smoothness of CVT.

Baleno CVT will be most fuel efficient, owing to its lightweight. But it doesn't have cruise control.

Jazz does. Jazz also has sunroof and paddle-shifters.

And, lastly, if you car the one who racks up more miles even in city driving, then nothing beats Amaze diesel CVT, the only CVT car in India mated to a diesel engine. Convenience of super smooth CVT coupled with economy of diesel.

Others have suggested you Brezza AT but I will tell you why I am such a big fan of CVT. All other types, whether TC, DSG or AMT shift gears up and down, as they move up and down the ratios. CVT, on the other hand, has this infinite ratio which does away with conventional shifts. Let's say you are stuck in traffic in your regular automatic and your crawl speed is such that it is too low for 3rd gear and too high for 2nd, then it won't shift to 3rd but it will stay at the top of 2nd gear with RPM high, resulting in noise and fuel wastage. In such a scenario, CVT will shift to 2.1 gear or 2.2 or 2.3.. ....infinite ratios. As a result, tacho-needle tends to stay closer to idle RPM and wheel speed adjusts to that which aids in better FE.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psankar View Post
I bought an Alto AMT. It has completed about 20,000 kms. I am quite happy with it. The AMT jerkiness is not an issue at all, at least for me. Only if you are used to smooth DCT gearboxes, you may feel the AMTs lagging.
DCTs are not smooth shifting ATs. They shift faster than other types but difference is miniscule. In fact, through the first 3 gears in traffic, they are jerky. CVT is the smoothest, followed by TC.
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Old 7th February 2021, 19:46   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
... but I will tell you why I am such a big fan of CVT. All other types, whether TC, DSG or AMT shift gears up and down, as they move up and down the ratios. CVT, on the other hand, has this infinite ratio which does away with conventional shifts. Let's say you are stuck in traffic in your regular automatic and your crawl speed is such that it is too low for 3rd gear and too high for 2nd, then it won't shift to 3rd but it will stay at the top of 2nd gear with RPM high, resulting in noise and fuel wastage. In such a scenario, CVT will shift to 2.1 gear or 2.2 or 2.3.. ....infinite ratios. As a result, tacho-needle tends to stay closer to idle RPM and wheel speed adjusts to that which aids in better FE.


DCTs are not smooth shifting ATs. They shift faster than other types but difference is miniscule. In fact, through the first 3 gears in traffic, they are jerky. CVT is the smoothest, followed by TC.
I think you should also describe the rubber-band effect that CVTs are notorious for.
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Old 8th February 2021, 00:43   #37
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Originally Posted by rhsakarp View Post
Given the requirements, recommend the Toyota urban cruiser, NA 1.5 4 cylinder petrol, mated to a smooth TC box. Got mine delivered yesterday 😄
That's awesome. Congratulations.. !

In fact after seeing Urban Cruiser getting recommended so many times, I actually did a TD yesterday. I will put up my opinion about the TD separately.

However, would it be possible for you to let me know the pricing details and also which dealer you got it from? Can PM if this forum is not the right place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pashin View Post
The Jazz and Baleno/Glanza are the obvious choices fitting your criteria. If Budget can be extended by a lac or so the Ciaz auto is also a good choice. I was vary of its 4 speed TC, but I was proven wrong after driving a friend's Ciaz automatic.
Correct, Amaze, Glanza / Baleno and Jazz are the lowest costing ones in my list.

But yes, if I am increasing my budget to include Urban Cruiser, then both Ciaz and Ecosport come into competition.. !! More confusion down that road.. !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pashin View Post
I also feel that your omitting DCT and AMT transmissions is based on hearsay and not necessarily true. Take a TD of the polo dct and Ignis amt and evaluate the cars based on your TD experience.
Polo feels a little too premium for me. A friend has it and it's really smooth no doubt. But I don't think I would do justice to that. It is, as they say, "a driver's car". I am looking for a commute car which both me and my wife can drive.

Ignis, let me do a TD. Although it misses out on Hill Assist which is kind of confidence booster for wife to drive. Plus wife did not like the looks of it. But again if I am going down the AMT route, that opens up a whole lot of filtered out options. May be I will do one TD and see of myself the difference in smoothness. Urban Cruiser's TC was very smooth though..!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lina View Post
If you are driving in the city, I would suggest adding an electrical car to the list. The Nexon EV. Thats the best kind of automatic you can get. Running costs will be a lot cheaper but you might have to invest about 16L for getting the car.

It is an extremely practical car. However range is 150-200km and you cant go out of town.
No, a bit too big for me, plus EV costs 16L to 17L.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psankar View Post
I was in a similar situation as you when I bought my car; except I had half the budget.

I bought an Alto AMT. It has completed about 20,000 kms. I am quite happy with it. The AMT jerkiness is not an issue at all, at least for me. Only if you are used to smooth DCT gearboxes, you may feel the AMTs lagging. Since it is going to be your first car and mostly driven within the city, I would recommend Alto. It saves you a lot of money, but more importantly, it is easy to drive around the narrow Bangalore roads. Parking, U Turns are all a breeze with alto. It is good for the occasional highway trips also.

If you want to splurge a little further, you can consider the swift/baleno AMT also. Even though buying a sedan is considered prestigious, it is a pain to drive around cities, especially Bangalore.
Sedan choice is primarily to get more boot space and comfortable seating with parents or in-laws. Will think of AMTs in general after I do one TD.

Btw, Alto has an AMT? Website doesn't say it. Is that an additional thing you get fixed by the dealer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by venkyhere View Post
I wonder whether this is what you wrote in when applying for TBHP membership. Either way, one of these two is a lie
Hahaha, I wonder what made you think that. Both are actually true and I think I did mention precisely that when signing up for TBHP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by venkyhere View Post
jokes apart,
small hatch - ignis
slightly bigger - amaze cvt
even bigger - yaris/ciaz auto
are my suggestions.
Stick with japs, dont go korean/german
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Old 8th February 2021, 01:24   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemantteen View Post
So far as safety is concerned , Amaze has 4 star safety rating, it is safer than Glanza/Baleno. See some videos on Youtube about Baleno build quality and you will know what I am talking about. Been driving it for 2 years, it is very reliable, still feels brand new. Also, larger boot space sure helps a lot.
Cool. Good to know Amaze has been serving you well. Can you please two points about it's maintenance?
  1. Honda service experience
  2. Cost per service for your Amaze.
Quote:
Originally Posted by venkyhere View Post
I think you should also describe the rubber-band effect that CVTs are notorious for.
Yes, I have read about it. I am taking a TD of Glanza tomorrow or day-after. What should I do to check this effect for myself?
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Old 8th February 2021, 06:03   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srirang View Post
Cool. Good to know Amaze has been serving you well. Can you please two points about it's maintenance?
  1. Honda service experience
  2. Cost per service for your Amaze.



Yes, I have read about it. I am taking a TD of Glanza tomorrow or day-after. What should I do to check this effect for myself?
Honda service has been very good so far. They do all things by the manual and do not push for unnecessary items. Even when I asked them to replace air filter, they checked and said it still has good life , no need. I asked them if i should need expensive synthetic, they said no need for my kind of running. Cost for 4th major service last month was around 8k as it had many things changed like cvt fluid. Previous one was 3.5k. And next one is supposed to be less too.

To witness rubber band effect, just push accelerator hard suddenly. To negate rubber band effect, just depress pedal slowly and consistently and speed will increase proportionately.

On another note , if you have budget go for Jazz. Jazz>Amaze>Glanza
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Old 8th February 2021, 06:53   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srirang View Post
That's awesome. Congratulations.. !

In fact after seeing Urban Cruiser getting recommended so many times, I actually did a TD yesterday. I will put up my opinion about the TD separately.

However, would it be possible for you to let me know the pricing details and also which dealer you got it from? Can PM if this forum is not the right place.



Correct, Amaze, Glanza / Baleno and Jazz are the lowest costing ones in my list.

But yes, if I am increasing my budget to include Urban Cruiser, then both Ciaz and Ecosport come into competition.. !! More confusion down that road.. !



Polo feels a little too premium for me. A friend has it and it's really smooth no doubt. But I don't think I would do justice to that. It is, as they say, "a driver's car". I am looking for a commute car which both me and my wife can drive.

Ignis, let me do a TD. Although it misses out on Hill Assist which is kind of confidence booster for wife to drive. Plus wife did not like the looks of it. But again if I am going down the AMT route, that opens up a whole lot of filtered out options. May be I will do one TD and see of myself the difference in smoothness. Urban Cruiser's TC was very smooth though..!



No, a bit too big for me, plus EV costs 16L to 17L.



Sedan choice is primarily to get more boot space and comfortable seating with parents or in-laws. Will think of AMTs in general after I do one TD.

Btw, Alto has an AMT? Website doesn't say it. Is that an additional thing you get fixed by the dealer?



Hahaha, I wonder what made you think that. Both are actually true and I think I did mention precisely that when signing up for TBHP.


Sure thing, I am not sure how to PM anyone though...checking.

Meanwhile, feel free to mail me for any details, will share them pronto, it is <myTBHPhandle>@gmail.com

(replace <myTBHPhandle> with my handle)
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Old 8th February 2021, 07:12   #41
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There's one thing slightly wrong in your analysis - you are not going to remain same you.
Whatever you drive, or do now, you will change. You claim to be "slow and steady", "non-car guy" and all you want is a "commute tool" - No, No, No! The fact that you joined this forum and did all this research means you are a "car guy" already. Let's hope you stay slow and steady, but knowing a bit about human nature, that seems unlikely. After you buy yourself a nice car, you will at least try a trip to Chennai or Ooty, and by then you'd be a "semi car guy" at least, so, not so sure about that part too.

Test drive every car in your list, and may be a few not on your list; and if possible rent the car you like for a while. Good luck and enjoy shopping!

Last edited by mvadg : 8th February 2021 at 07:36.
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Old 8th February 2021, 09:12   #42
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Since your primary requirement is for city use I would recommend the Tata Nexon EV.

Good power, safety well taken care off and Electric will be cheaper to run and maintain.

More importantly it's future proof and the green boards now provide the feel good factor.

Happy hunting.
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Old 8th February 2021, 15:45   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srirang View Post
Sedan choice is primarily to get more boot space and comfortable seating with parents or in-laws. Will think of AMTs in general after I do one TD.

Btw, Alto has an AMT? Website doesn't say it. Is that an additional thing you get fixed by the dealer?
Yes, do take a test drive of an AMT. What you read in team-bhp like forums is by people who own multiple cars for many years, but if you are going to have only one car, you will easily get used to its qualities (both positive and negative).

I am not sure of the Alto website, but in show-rooms, the AMT is available as an option and sells in huge numbers in Bangalore (atleast that was the case when I bought 3 years back). AMT comes from the factory itself and not an extra addition.

If you are going to have only occasional visitors, you can rent even an Innova for multiple times with the money saved from buying an Alto instead of a sedan. It will be easily around 5 Lakhs. Also, spares are cheaper, running cost is less and Alto mileage could be easily double of what many high performance cars offer, if driven sedately, in longer stretches. I do Bangalore outstation trips occasionally and get about 20kmpl too when driven sedately. If you buy a swift, baleno then the savings may not be as substantial but would still be large enough.

When you are taking a test drive, remember to drive in the same road / time as you will use after purchase. It could be your or wife's office commute route or some such. That will help you a lot in the decision. My friend has a small car as well as a SUV and he prefers taking the small car for daily commute, only because it is quite easy to drive in Bangalore roads. The big car is for outstation and weekend trips.
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Old 8th February 2021, 16:40   #44
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Originally Posted by venkyhere View Post
I think you should also describe the rubber-band effect that CVTs are notorious for.
That's a very small trade-off to pay for, IMO, considering super-smoothness. Further, CVTs of yore were notorious for rubber-band effect but new breed of CVTs are much improved. Otherwise, people won't be buying Creta/Seltos IVTs, Baleno/Glanza CVTs, Magnite CVTs in big numbers they are buying. Even MG Hector is launching a CVT variant.

AMTs maybe a bit jerky off the line but they have two positive attributes. One is FE. The other, as told by my mechanic is, they are simplest and cheapest to repair as they are basically same as MT box. Conventional auto-boxes on the other hand are not, in the event of a break-down, repairable in India and their replacement costs are big. But then again, they hardly break-down, especially TC or CVT.
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Old 8th February 2021, 16:47   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srirang View Post
Ooh.. first vote on Amaze from base on (almost) first hand experience. Would love to hear more on two aspects :
  1. The tin like feeling that gets mentioned in reviews everywhere.
  2. The "built to cost" which is getting mentioned in this thread - specifically where has Honda compromised to reduce the cost?
The family who bought the Amaze were upgrading from an Alto, so the improvements were so vast that none of the two mattered.

That said, I don't think these are deal-breakers for Amaze compared to any car of the same segment. Of course, a Yaris will score much better in both aspects, but my recommendation was based strictly on the budget you quoted.
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