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Old 24th July 2021, 08:59   #1
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Default New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Dear friends:

This is t2k4, from Chandigarh.

I am wondering if you'd be amenable to providing your $0.02 for my car selection thought process.

If yes, here goes:

I drive a (2016) Hyundai Creta 1.6 SX+ Diesel AT [and love it] and wifey drives a (2008) Honda City 1.5 i-VTEC Petrol MT.

The Honda City is coming up for the road tax renewal (15 years) in a couple of years. We're considering replacing it. It has about 85K, city kms (no pun), on the ODO.

Based on what we end up buying, my wife's okay with driving our Creta and me driving the new/pre-worshipped entrant.

I've always wanted a Toyota Fortuner (even since it costed INR 18-odd lacs many years ago):

- street creds
- high stance / ground clearance for long trips
- 7-seats, in that off chance we need them (not a huge thing for me personally, but it also means better boot capacity with seats folded)
- fuss-free ownership

Toyota, however, continues to make Fortuner ownership unaffordable with each passing year, and the ride quality continues to give pause.

The budget we have for the exercise is INR 20-25L. If something is super appealing, we can consider stretching a bit.

With XUV 700 launch around the corner, it would be a good option. Dunking 20-25 on a Mahindra though, not sure. And, quality control issues with Mahindra and Tata cars (rusted door frames, electronic failures, etc.), really not sure. I would love Mahindra to turn it around with XUV 700 but don't want to be the guinea pig on the first batch to find out if they have or haven't.

I'd go with a pre-worshipped German if I believed I'd be happy with the maintenance costs every year. I know I wouldn't.

Because we have a Creta, several similar cars such as Seltos, Compass (arguable), etc. are automatically disqualified.

I won't be seen driving an MPV, so that excludes Innova and Carnival.

I'd consider a used Endeavour 3.2 4x4 AT but the following give me pause:

- spare parts availability down the line, given that the 3.2-spec engine has been discontinued
- American brand longevity in India, Ford almost has the tail out of the door (per rumors, precedents and reconstruction of facts)
- fall-from-the-cliff depreciation of Ford cars as they age

I'd happily wait for next year's Fortuner & Everest/Endeavour refreshes, but my patience is not going to be rewarded with the additional monies I'd need to park either of them in my garage.

I looked at some 2015-year pre-worshipped Fortuner models as well, but the dated dashboard technology and bumpy ride quality continue to work against this line of thought.

Test drove the new Safari. The engine response is not too bad but cramped interiors, a heavy low-speed steering wheel and pedestrian interior quality/plastics work against it.

I can understand if you're wondering what does this guy want but I'd appreciate your suggestions and input.

Many thanks.

Last edited by t2k4 : 24th July 2021 at 09:06.
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Old 25th July 2021, 09:57   #2
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Default re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

XUV700 might be worth the wait, but as always with Mahindra & Tata cars, buy 2 - 3 years after launch.

Quote:
I'd go with a pre-worshipped German if I believed I'd be happy with the maintenance costs every year. I know I wouldn't.
1 - 1.5 lakhs a year average. If you are fine with that, I would strongly recommend a pre-owned C-Class or 3-Series to you. Think of that 1 - 1 .5 lakhs maintenance a year as "satisfy the petrolhead in me" money.

Quote:
I'd consider a used Endeavour 3.2 4x4 AT but the following give me pause:
This should be your top choice. It's a phenomenal SUV. Good engine, presence, comfy ride quality (unlike the Fortuner), loaded with equipment and timeless design. There are enough of them on the road for dealers & after-market vendors to offer parts support. Don't worry about that.

More options = used Kodiaq / Octavia / Superb / Passat. Get a 2 - 3 year old car, extend the warranty to 6 years and its almost zero risk.

Last edited by GTO : 25th July 2021 at 09:59.
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Old 25th July 2021, 10:08   #3
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t2k4 View Post
- I've always wanted a Toyota Fortuner.

- The budget we have for the exercise is INR 20-25L. If something is super appealing, we can consider stretching a bit.
If you're willing to stretch that budget a wee bit, you could look at good 2017 Fortuners. Just be wary of abused examples. Although rare, there will be low run examples in the market, and you wouldn't be disappointed with the resale price when you want to sell again. The fact that the prices of new Fortuners is always on the rise makes used ones hold value well too.
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Old 25th July 2021, 12:13   #4
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

If you genuinely like the Ford Endeavour, go for it without worrying about the spare parts and after-sales. Even if Ford exits India, they will provide after-sales for many years to come (Case in point: Happy Chevrolet owners on the forum).

Regarding depreciation, the first buyer is already taking part of the hit, and with a car costing upwards of 25 lakhs, with the possible exception of the Toyotas, the Ford Endeavour is one of the lesser depreciating cars. (Look at how Germans depreciate).
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Old 25th July 2021, 12:16   #5
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Greetings From a Youtuber from Chandigarh!

Fortuner is a great choice. Perhaps I'd be happy to inform you that the latest generation fortuners don't ride half as bad as they used to. It's a lot better now and high-speed bump absorption is first-rate. Plus the seats of the Fortuner are also very well cushioned and that certainly helps.


Rusted door frames have somewhat been sorted out in tata s and mahindras but electrics are still temperamental. And while Mahindra has good mechanical reliability, Tata Still has a lot to catch up in terms of reliability for sure


Endeavour is certainly a risk given the rumours at present. But assuming Ford is here to stay, it's far cheaper to maintain than the fortuner and since Ford has drastically improved the maintenance costs, if you look up now, the SUV line-up of Ford commands a healthy resale. In fact in Chandigarh itself, you'll see that the difference between the resale of Endy And Toyota isn't much now, as it used to be for previous generations. Plus the 3.2 is a capable and reliable engine. Same for the 6 Speed Torque converter gearbox. As for spares, given that 90% chances are that Ford isn't leaving, they'll be easily available at the service centres of perhaps Burail, Sector 45

In my opinion, the latest generation Fortuners or Endeavours should be the best and most reliable choices for you. Otherwise, a Pre-owned last generation Volvo will certainly be a premium and long-lasting, durable choice.
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Old 26th July 2021, 05:20   #6
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t2k4 View Post
- fall-from-the-cliff depreciation of Ford cars as they age
So this works well for you if you buy an endeavour and keep it almost to FC like you did your city.

Donít worry about Ford part availability. Endeavour is a global model so parts wonít be in short supply.

I got myself a 2018 Endeavour Titanium variant instead of an A6, a lot of the bells and whistles Audi VMW have like multi zone climate control, 7 airbags, panoramic sunroof etc are available, the engine is a gem, the car has surprisingly light and responsive steering etc. Just finding clean examples that havenít been abused or messed up with additional installations such as locally installed aux lights, snorkels etc will take a bit of work.
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Old 26th July 2021, 18:30   #7
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

You can’t go wrong at all with the Fortuner, but have a look at the Endeavour 3.2s as well.

For the Endeavour 3.2, in the used market demand is very high and supply is low so be careful while treading down this path because a few people have come across abused cars with odometer tampering in the 3.2L Endeavours.

This is one such case I came across:
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Old 26th July 2021, 19:14   #8
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Considering your penchant for SUV/crossover and the mentioned budget, a pre worshipped Kodiaq TDI would fit the bill. Try and find one with extended warranty intact and you would not be disappointed. It's a great car.
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Old 26th July 2021, 21:18   #9
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Given your budget and open mind for used cars, I would recommend you to go for a used one.

1. The most underlining point here is that you are lucky enough to get your hands on a PRE-WORSHIPPED car, free from all abuses and mods.
2. The depreciation is a no worry as the first owner has observed most of it.
3. Endy 3.2 is an excellent choice, better than every Fortuner.
4. Endy is a global model and so getting spares (or) getting it serviced is not a challenge at all.
5. The other good choice is the BMW X1 - which is an excellent super appealing car but a bit of budget stretch (which is definitely worth it). The sedans from the german stable of all 3 need definitely a significant budget stretch. However, I am not sure about the maintenance as I do not own one.
6. Since you have enough Creta experience, the Safari is almost in the same segment. Compass definitely feels (and is) a segment above and more premium. You did not clearly mention the reason for not considering it. In fact, Compass (Diesel Manual) should be one of the top choices on your list.
7. Definitely not the upcoming XUV700 'coz of the same reason you've mentioned - wait till it is tried and tested.
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Old 27th July 2021, 00:21   #10
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Quote:
Originally Posted by t2k4 View Post
Dear friends:

This is t2k4, from Chandigarh.

I am wondering if you'd be amenable to providing your $0.02 for my car selection thought process.

If yes, here goes:

I drive a (2016) Hyundai Creta 1.6 SX+ Diesel AT [and love it] and wifey drives a (2008) Honda City 1.5 i-VTEC Petrol MT.

The Honda City is coming up for the road tax renewal (15 years) in a couple of years. We're considering replacing it. It has about 85K, city kms (no pun), on the ODO.

Based on what we end up buying, my wife's okay with driving our Creta and me driving the new/pre-worshipped entrant.

I've always wanted a Toyota Fortuner (even since it costed INR 18-odd lacs many years ago):

- street creds
- high stance / ground clearance for long trips
- 7-seats, in that off chance we need them (not a huge thing for me personally, but it also means better boot capacity with seats folded)
- fuss-free ownership

Toyota, however, continues to make Fortuner ownership unaffordable with each passing year, and the ride quality continues to give pause.

The budget we have for the exercise is INR 20-25L. If something is super appealing, we can consider stretching a bit.

With XUV 700 launch around the corner, it would be a good option. Dunking 20-25 on a Mahindra though, not sure. And, quality control issues with Mahindra and Tata cars (rusted door frames, electronic failures, etc.), really not sure. I would love Mahindra to turn it around with XUV 700 but don't want to be the guinea pig on the first batch to find out if they have or haven't.

I'd go with a pre-worshipped German if I believed I'd be happy with the maintenance costs every year. I know I wouldn't.

Because we have a Creta, several similar cars such as Seltos, Compass (arguable), etc. are automatically disqualified.

I won't be seen driving an MPV, so that excludes Innova and Carnival.

I'd consider a used Endeavour 3.2 4x4 AT but the following give me pause:

- spare parts availability down the line, given that the 3.2-spec engine has been discontinued
- American brand longevity in India, Ford almost has the tail out of the door (per rumors, precedents and reconstruction of facts)
- fall-from-the-cliff depreciation of Ford cars as they age

I'd happily wait for next year's Fortuner & Everest/Endeavour refreshes, but my patience is not going to be rewarded with the additional monies I'd need to park either of them in my garage.

I looked at some 2015-year pre-worshipped Fortuner models as well, but the dated dashboard technology and bumpy ride quality continue to work against this line of thought.

Test drove the new Safari. The engine response is not too bad but cramped interiors, a heavy low-speed steering wheel and pedestrian interior quality/plastics work against it.

I can understand if you're wondering what does this guy want but I'd appreciate your suggestions and input.

Many thanks.
Given your inclination towards SUVs & the budget flexibility following options come to my mind, sharing my take on these cars

New Car options

- Mahindra XUV 700 : Seems promising segment leading product, but spending 25L on M&M that too on the first lot is a bit risky

- Safari/Harrier : You have already driven and made up you mind

- Jeep Compass : If you feel cramped in Safari then Compass will not work

- Tucson (Diesel) : This would be my pick, you already have Hyundai ownership experience, Tucson is superupgrade from Creta. Great combination of comfort, feature, and road presence. I think Tucson perfectly suits your requirement.

Now if you have appetite for something larger then you can explore pre owned space

- Fortuner : Would not recommend this, Fortuner have high resale value, the mileage / ageing you get on a preowned fortuner at 25L will not justify this price tag

- Endeavour : Better VFM package than fortuner in preowned space. I think you have already evaluated Endeavour.

- VAG (Tiguan/ Kodiaq) : Best VFM in the preowned space. Both these cars have low resale compared to above two, so you will get a good deal in preowned space.

- Q3 / X1 / GLA : I would avoid these cars in preowned space unless getting from a trusted / personally known source

To sum-up my picks would be Tucson as new car or Kodiaq as preowned
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Old 27th July 2021, 10:03   #11
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Excellent query and something similar to what we faced a while back. We had an old 2006 Corolla and a 2013/4 Honda City automatic. The Corolla needed to be replaced and anything new that was remotely desirable was upwards of INR 40 lakhs. Unfortunately these were all utilitarian cars and nothing that appeased the heart and allowed me to enjoy my early forties.

We have 2 kids so a 7 seater SUV was always desirable, but had to be balanced with practicality of my wife wanting to drive her (she prefers something a tad more compact). Considered the Fortuner and the Endeavour but felt that they were too big for our everyday.

Cut a long story short, went for a pre-owned GLC 220d (1.5 years old) and the heart hasn't stopped smiling since. I still look back at her each time i park her and whenever i drive her, she never fails to make me smile.

On costs, you can go for a service pack (depends on age and kilometers but you can bring it within 60-80k per year practically). You can also get the extended warranty (years 4 to 6) for another few lakhs.

Even i had a fluid budget of 25-30 lakhs but when i drove her (the GLC), i was happy to shell out 45 big ones to ensure that my drive for the next 5-7 years minimum will be fun. She gave the comfort with a small footprint that fit my needs.

Good luck finding what works for you. Its a fun decision.
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Old 27th July 2021, 11:11   #12
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Thank you, everyone, who has chimed-in so far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
1 - 1.5 lakhs a year average. If you are fine with that, I would strongly recommend a pre-owned C-Class or 3-Series to you. Think of that 1 - 1 .5 lakhs maintenance a year as "satisfy the petrolhead in me" money.
In our extended family, there is an Audi A4 2.0T Petrol, from 2010 if memory serves right. It is, by far, the most fun car I have ever driven. Triple digits on the speedometer come up before one bothers to sneak a peak at the console. Sadly, only the Germans can bring such a gem of an engine to our shores. And, the relation who owns it also talks about ownership costs often, which over a period of time has given shape to my opinion (and fostered fear of a German car ownership).

I wish Honda had continued investing in the Accord in India, their V6 was another masterclass. Accord is an almost a full-size luxury saloon with the capability to generate driver delight - the CBU route killed it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
More options = used Kodiaq / Octavia / Superb / Passat. Get a 2 - 3 year old car, extend the warranty to 6 years and its almost zero risk.
Kodiaq is a lovely car - the high ground clearance, monocoque setup, European aesthetics & mannerism - there's much to like. I haven't seen a pre-worshipped one on sale in Chandigarh yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Donít worry about Ford part availability. Endeavour is a global model so parts wonít be in short supply.

I got myself a 2018 Endeavour Titanium variant instead of an A6.

Just finding clean examples that havenít been abused or messed up with additional installations such as locally installed aux lights, snorkels etc will take a bit of work.
Congratulations! Sorry, I don't know when you got the Endeavour but wishing you happy miles with your purchase.

One thing I have discovered so far (given this will be, if it happens, our first-ever pre-worshipped purchase) is that there is no standardization of kms-driven vs price asked. It's all over the place. 3.2-spec is in short supply and people are asking almost Fortuner-level value for it. Endeavours are also more likely to have been modified significantly. Finding it hard, at the moment, to identify direct contact with sellers - it's all through dealers, which compounds matters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CEF_Beasts View Post
This is one such case I came across:
https://Youtu.be/gfBA1HjG9aY
Wow! Thank you for sharing. This is very jarring. It's not that the cars were repaired or heavily driven - they are cars, they will accrue damage and are meant to ignite the tar. It's the blatant lies and deceptive behavior to take an unsuspecting buyer for a ride, that's what makes one wonder if it's worth going the pre-worshipped purchase route. As the vlogger said - if it's too good to be true, it probably is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bibendum90949 View Post
Considering your penchant for SUV/crossover and the mentioned budget, a pre worshipped Kodiaq TDI would fit the bill. Try and find one with extended warranty intact and you would not be disappointed. It's a great car.
Fingers crossed! We haven't seen one listed so far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asoon View Post
Given your inclination towards SUVs & the budget flexibility following options come to my mind, sharing my take on these cars

- Tucson (Diesel) : This would be my pick, you already have Hyundai ownership experience, Tucson is superupgrade from Creta. Great combination of comfort, feature, and road presence. I think Tucson perfectly suits your requirement.
We love Tucson. My Dad drives one. Whenever I've planted my bums on the comfy driver's seat of Tucson and pressed the smallest foot pedal of the lineup, it generates a positive vibe. The 2.0 diesel is a very capable engine and well mated to Hyundai's torque-converting AT.

I'd buy a Tucson in a second if we didn't have one in the family already. Not that I drive it / own it, but still, repeating a car that we often get to see in the family is not the first preference. Price-wise, it's approachable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fourwheels View Post
Cut a long story short, went for a pre-owned GLC 220d (1.5 years old) and the heart hasn't stopped smiling since. I still look back at her each time i park her and whenever i drive her, she never fails to make me smile.
.
.
.
Good luck finding what works for you. Its a fun decision.
Thank you and congratulations on the purchase. If you'd like to, please share a bit more about this engine and the car's characteristics.
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Old 27th July 2021, 11:23   #13
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

I got it just earlier this month, 2018 model.

If you live in Chennai you can get ex Ford corporate lease vehicles that come on the used car market at the end of three years.

I got just that sort of vehicle ++ had to change tyres because the dealer replaced the existing tyres with junk ones, and had to get insurance because Ford owns their dealerships / gets service and repair for free, so that their cars all have only third party insurance.

Checked service history + had it inspected on a ramp at a Ford dealer before buying it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by t2k4 View Post
Congratulations! Sorry, I don't know when you got the Endeavour but wishing you happy miles with your purchase.

One thing I have discovered so far (given this will be, if it happens, our first-ever pre-worshipped purchase) is that there is no standardization of kms-driven vs price asked. It's all over the place. 3.2-spec is in short supply.
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Old 27th July 2021, 12:42   #14
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Hi,
I am in a similar dilemma.
Buying a used C class or 3 series really sounds exciting.
As GTO mentioned,
1 - 1.5 lakhs a year average. If you are fine with that, I would strongly recommend a pre-owned C-Class or 3-Series to you. Think of that 1 - 1 .5 lakhs maintenance a year as "satisfy the petrolhead in me" money.

Does this 1.5 covers only the maintenance or you factored in insurance cost too?


Do you think a 2016 c200 with around 50k on the odo is a good choice to keep for another say 4 years?
How would a car like that depreciate further, given itís a petrol motor?
Is the mileage really low on that car. I have been told it gives around 12kmpl in city, which seems unbelievable to me.

Please suggest.
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Old 27th July 2021, 13:28   #15
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Default Re: New or used car for 25 lakhs | Which one should I buy?

Hello t2k4,
I have seen many people have suggested some very good cars. I would like to stick my neck out and add 2 cars to your list which would fit your budget and may come at a steal price too as they depreciate higher than Tfort and Endy.
You can consider the Skoda Kodiaq and VW Tigaun Allspace. Both very comfort oriented cars and the TDI engines are enjoyable too.

Thanks,
Shreyas
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