[bhp1]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Innova is the best bet for you. this is the vehicle which will keep you the happiest. If I was not in for a 4x4, I would have bought the innova

I suppose so but Safari's immense comfort & cushioned ride are attractive for me. Sometimes I think that I have other reliable Japanese cars & can afford to play with the Safari. So, what if it gives some troubles, at least I won't be stranded!
I asked a local garage owner about Safari & he told me of injector issues, niggles, etc. & this was much before any of the threads appeared on T-Bhp. He also mentioned that huge costs are involved in fixing such issues.
Apart from this I went to the local Tata showroom for TD & checking out Safari. One of service advisor's there was known to me & he said it would be wise to stay away from the Safari.
After listening to all this & more, still when I see so many Safaris on road & many people buying new ones, I do not want to miss the drawing room sofa like feel!

Originally Posted by akshay1234

bhp1 - which models of the innova, safari and scorpio are you looking at?

I am of the view that as Safari/Scorpio do not score very high on reliability factor, its best to stick with base versions which have lesser electricals/features & so lesser chances of things going kaput. So, it would be Safari LX, Scorpio LX & Innova G.

Originally Posted by raj_5004

12 complaints have been registered for the innova whereas the numbers are much higher for scorpio (31) & safari (48) :-
Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | toyota innova
Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | mahindra scorpio
Indian Consumer Complaints Forum | tata safari

Thanks Raj, I'm already registered on that site!
Its a no brainer that Innova is way ahead in terms of reliability. Also, Scorpio is relatively reliable, only Safari needs confirmation.
I trust the reviews by fellow BHPians on their vehicles, but there is a sizable chunk of owners who swear by the Safari. Did they not have any issues or have they not used other contemporary cars in order to differentiate or they like the vehicle so much that overlook its shortcomings! These thoughts baffle me, its a diff. matter with Skoda, earlier Octy/Laura/Fabia were in the list of things but after reading the horror stories, they were striked out. Its not same with the Safari & that's because of the good reviews that are abundant on T-bhp.

[raj_5004]

Originally Posted by bhp1

I am of the view that as Safari/Scorpio do not score very high on reliability factor, its best to stick with base versions which have lesser electricals/features & so lesser chances of things going kaput. So, it would be Safari LX, Scorpio LX & Innova G.



Thanks Raj, I'm already registered on that site!
Its a no brainer that Innova is way ahead in terms of reliability. Also, Scorpio is relatively reliable, only Safari needs confirmation.
I trust the reviews by fellow BHPians on their vehicles, but there is a sizable chunk of owners who swear by the Safari. Did they not have any issues or have they not used other contemporary cars in order to differentiate or they like the vehicle so much that overlook its shortcomings! These thoughts baffle me, its a diff. matter with Skoda, earlier Octy/Laura/Fabia were in the list of things but after reading the horror stories, they were striked out. Its not same with the Safari & that's because of the good reviews that are abundant on T-bhp.

buddy, if at all you go for these vehicles, ABS is a must in these vehicles. so it should be the safari GX or scorpio SLE or innova VX. i would suggest, you avoid the variants without the ABS.

T-BHP is one unique site where i have seen so many safari fans. there are many who complain about the lack of quality & consistent issues & there are many who go completely ga-ga over the vehicle. i think the reason is, as you mentioned, they love their vehicles so much that they tend to overlook this fact. havent you seen safari owners bash me for criticizing their beloved car?!!!

[bhp1]

Yes Raj I agree with you, ABS is a must for these vehicles.
The thing though is that this would take the budget up & which would compound the confusion because then other vehicles come into consideration.
I'm going to keep these vehicles to bare minimum, so the base variants.
If I end up buying a Safari or a Scorpio, I shall buy them keeping in mind that these are not as safe as the modern breed of vehicles are. In a way, I would be compromising safety & going in for something which appeals to my heart!

Well, regarding your bashing up by Safari fans, I think its a free forum where people can express their thoughts, pointing out negatives of a vehicle, ideally should not provoke feelings!
I live in Punjab & can site a reason why Safari is so popular here, apart from the obvious reasons. People residing in the villages/rural folk are the main Safari audience, now its a fact that the exposure in the villages is lower than that in the Cities & vehicles are often bought on heresy. The word of mouth works in such a way that these people do not weigh the market & just go to check out the vehicle they have heard off & end up buying it. Further Safari has an air of premiums around it, which is another huge factor.
Safari has been kind of made a status symbol of sorts with local pop singers incorporating it in their songs. Also, in the hinterland of Punjab, its common to hear "Jat di savari - Safari"!

[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by bhp1

He also mentioned that huge costs are involved in fixing such issues.

About that he is wrong. 1st four years forget about costs. Tata will replace everything under warranty.
IF you already have reliable japanese sedans, then indulge yourself and get the safari

[bhp1]

That means a 4 yrs warranty package is a must/mandatory!

Lets suppose, if you were in the market for a vehicle in similar category, which one would you pick up now(after Safari saga)??

Yes the Japo sedans are super reliable but the problem is that I have to go certain places on a routine basis whose approach is less than perfect & almost every bone in my body gets rattled! Its so bad at times, that I try hard to skip my visit only!
I've heard Safari offers a magic carpet ride, this is what attracts me towards it.

I don't know how would a Scorpio fare on broken roads, if it rattles the passengers in the front seats, my purpose gets defeated!

[Akshay1234]

since they new safari should be out soon, sometime this year i dont think there is any point in even considering it. ive been traveling in my friends safari for the past few days and the engine is good (not as refined as my innovas) but i find the fit and quality of materials pathetic. squeeks and rattles from everywhere.

id say its in between the scorpio and the innova. again if you want reliability and space its the innova. nothing else will do. are you looking at the gx with dual row ac? if not i suggest you do so it makes a huge difference.

the only reason i would choose a scorpio over the innova is for having a more powerful 'stock' engine and for the looks (which btw are subjective).

[tsk1979]

I would buy a gypsy I guess, because everything except the safari and gypsy is out of my budget.
As for scorpio's ride, its not as good as safari, but I will not call it bone jarring. But its best to TD it yourself on bad roads and decide.
I found the front passenger seat to be pretty uncomfortable in the scorpio with my knees touching the dash.

[bhp1]

Thanks Akshay, the new Safari you are talking about is the "Xover" or something else? Or is it going to be the same Safari with a facelift?
Any which ways, if a new Safari is round the corner this year, there's no point in going for a new one now.
You are right about the squeaks/rattles & below part materials.

Actually I'm not looking in for outright space as only 1-2 people shall be using it most of the time. Even a rear A.C. is not a requirement because rear seats are going to be used infrequently.

I do like the Scorpio's SUVish stance & rugged looks, for all the rest of things, Innova wins. In other words, if I follow my heart, it would be the Scorpio & mind says Innova!

Thanks Tanvir, I meant would you buy a Safari again!
You are so right about the "knee touching" problem in the Scorpio, I experienced it too.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by raj_5004

scorpio's drivability is much better than the innova.
i mentioned fun to drive in terms of engine performance. compare an innova's roll-on timings to the scorpio/safari. compared to these two SUVs, the innova takes ages to gain momentum. be it any rpm or any gear- the scorpio instantly lurges forward with a prod on the accelerator. this quality is missing in the innova.

I would disagree with this completely. Innova is one of the most driveable vehicles around, heck it climbs up delhi flyovers, fully loaded with A/C running in 5th gear even at 50 kmph! Try that is a scorp or a safari and tell me.
Personally speaking, I would buy a Safari if I wanted a comfortable 4X4, completely avoid Scorpio primarily because it doesnt come with a 4X4 with mHawk.
Innova is you best bet when it comes to comfortable, peace of mind touring.

[bhp1]

That was informative Extreme Torque!
BTW, how would Innova fare on Lahaul-Spiti, Leh-Ladakh treks?
Is there a need for a 4x4 vehicle there?

Also, if it comes to choosing between 4x2 Scorpio or Safari, which one would be your pick?

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

... completely avoid Scorpio primarily because it doesnt come with a 4X4 with mHawk.

Heck, that makes my 2.6 4X4 feel so completely antiquated!
However, I console myself saying, "There's no replacement for displacement"!

And it has done all that I was hoping for! Must I feel sorry it is not an mHawk?!

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by anupmathur

Heck, that makes my 2.6 4X4 feel so completely antiquated!
However, I console myself saying, "There's no replacement for displacement"!

And it has done all that I was hoping for! Must I feel sorry it is not an mHawk?!

mathur saab, i am talking abt the current scenario. Now that scorpio comes only with mhawk.... 4x4 isnt available.
Even I am from the old school of thought... no replcement for displacement.
There is no objective reason of buying a Safari or Scorpio over Innova but only if one wants to buy a comfortable 4x4.

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

There is no objective reason of buying a Safari or Scorpio over Innova but only if one wants to buy a comfortable 4x4.

Ah so! Got it!
And yes I fully agree with what you've said above.

[nvldvr]

4 years warranty for the safari is fine. But then from all the posts from various forums in tbhp, what one makes out is that for most problems, Tata guys just tend to go about changing parts. Not sure how much of fault diagnosis goes into handling various issues. It wont hurt at all as long as the warranty is there, you get all spare parts for free and keep feeling good about new parts in your car. But what about after the warranty. If instead of trying to find the actual defects, tata guys just go on changing parts and charging you a hefty fee, would that be fine?
I havent owned a safari or a tata vehicle. So may be there's some point that i am missing here. Some safari owner with more than 4 years of ownership can clear the issue.

[raj_5004]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

I would disagree with this completely. Innova is one of the most driveable vehicles around, heck it climbs up delhi flyovers, fully loaded with A/C running in 5th gear even at 50 kmph! Try that is a scorp or a safari and tell me.

Sir, i am saying this only after trying it in all the 3 vehicles & then comparing the trio!
innova's drivability is good, but not as good as the scorpio. quick acceleration in any gear is not innova's forte.

heck, where the innova climbs a flyover in 5th gear, the scorpio gains momentum & overtakes in the same gear! extra 20 bhp power & 10 kgm torque in the scorpio is not a waste!

professional testers say the innova's roll-on timing (40-100 kmph in 5th gear) is 19.5 seconds whereas the scorpio does it in 14.61 seconds & the safari does it in 15.96 seconds. who's drivability is better?

also, i have read the scorpio 4x4 is still available with the CRDe engine.

bhp, since you have rough roads to travel, innova is not the ideal choice. the innova suspension bottoms when loaded to more than 5 passengers and i have even scraped my innova's underbody when it was loaded on a moderately bad road.

look at the SUVs if you want to travel on such roads, whatever be the case!