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Old 17th December 2014, 08:45   #16
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

We have to decide whether we need schemes like MNREGA which spends equal amount of money in a year in jobs like cutting grass on road side, digging wells with out water, building roads which remain only in paper or at least dream of building something concrete, sort of engineering marvel, which many generations can use and benefit. If you say that first we have to bring everyone this country above poverty line and then only we can take up any infrastructure project, then that is the very reason these many people are below the poverty line even after 67 years of independence. Infrastructure projects are never a burden on state exchequer. The jobs they create and boost to economy itself will take care of the negativity.

Even I am not sure this project is going to take off. But nice to see some one is ready to atleast dream of such world class projects in India.

Last edited by poloman : 17th December 2014 at 08:48.
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Old 17th December 2014, 09:22   #17
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

Half of that allocated for a much more spread out and planned metro rail system will work wonders.
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Old 17th December 2014, 09:34   #18
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by condor View Post
You are completely off the mark - that much !!

Please do your research on that particular news rather than trying to show calculations. Of course, I could give the details too, but I suggest you dont depend on me
Condor,

Even I am confused because http://www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/ene...cle6111239.ece

The Honorable Minister for Road Transport and Highways did say and I quote:

Quote:
“The length of National Highways in the country is one lakh kilometre. I have asked officials to come out with a plan to plant 200 crore trees along these stretches which in turn would create jobs for the unemployed on the one hand and protect the environment on the other,” Road Transport, Highways, Shipping and Rural Development Minister Nitin Jairam Gadkari said in New Delhi on Friday.
Road length: 200000 kms (both sides)
Number of trees: 2000000000

2000000000 / 200000 = 10000 trees per km.

I don't think we can fit so many trees in one kms.
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Old 17th December 2014, 11:02   #19
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by bblost View Post
Condor,

Even I am confused because... The Honorable Minister for Road Transport and Highways did say and I quote: " ... "

Road length: 200000 kms (both sides)
Number of trees: 2000000000

2000000000 / 200000 = 10000 trees per km.

I don't think we can fit so many trees in one kms.
True, even I was confused, hence calculated :
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
...
1 lakh km of India's highways is being proposed to be lined with 200 crore trees.

Even if I were to assume 3 rows of trees on left & 1 on the right (median), the calculation would come to 1 tree every 20cms.

*1 Lakh km (distance as reported by The Hindu newspaper) is assuming you consider one side of the highway, totally 1 lakh running kms. Even if you assume its ~2L kms (as per 2006), and assuming somehow an additional 1 lakh by now, totalling 3L kms. They'd be planting 1 tree every 60cms, which still does NOT make much sense. lol Unless they plan to plant forests enroute.
Quote:
Originally Posted by condor View Post
You are completely off the mark - that much !!

Please do your research on that particular news rather than trying to show calculations. Of course, I could give the details too, but I suggest you dont depend on me
I've referred to a news article with a link and set forth what appears as truth to me. If you have more info than the newspaper provided, please share the same.


Last edited by GrammarNazi : 17th December 2014 at 11:24.
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Old 21st December 2014, 01:19   #20
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Question Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by poloman View Post
We have to decide whether we need schemes like MNREGA which spends equal amount of money in a year in jobs like cutting grass on road side, digging wells with out water, building roads which remain only in paper or at least dream of building something concrete, sort of engineering marvel, which many generations can use and benefit. If you say that first we have to bring everyone this country above poverty line and then only we can take up any infrastructure project, then that is the very reason these many people are below the poverty line even after 67 years of independence.
But nice to see some one is ready to atleast dream of such world class projects in India.
I do agree with you, but underground ring road would bring some respite from the maddening crowd on Mumbai roads but I can't imagine what would happen to such a ring roadrather an extensive metro rail project and promoting use of public transport would have been be a better solution to the problem of congestion

Such futuristic projects are demand of the time, but I don't think this would be a long term solution to the ever expanding problem of traffic. Soon traffic would outgrow this road.
One more thing, can anyone assure me that this ring road will be free of flooding during Mumbai rains.

I think extensive metro network and world class public transport would be a better solution to the problem of traffic as compared to ring road.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 21st December 2014 at 07:34. Reason: post merged
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Old 21st December 2014, 08:18   #21
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

Quote:
Originally Posted by poloman View Post
We have to decide whether we need schemes like MNREGA which spends equal amount of money in a year in jobs like cutting grass on road side, digging wells with out water, building roads which remain only in paper or at least dream of building something concrete, sort of engineering marvel, which many generations can use and benefit. If you say that first we have to bring everyone this country above poverty line and then only we can take up any infrastructure project, then that is the very reason these many people are below the poverty line even after 67 years of independence. Infrastructure projects are never a burden on state exchequer. The jobs they create and boost to economy itself will take care of the negativity.

Even I am not sure this project is going to take off. But nice to see some one is ready to atleast dream of such world class projects in India.
Good thought but the budget seems very little.

Here's an example from USA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Dig
14.6 billion for 5.6km.

http://www.king5.com/story/news/2014/08/02/13065108/

This is planned to be some 30-60km or so? (Nariman point to BWSL, Sewri to Nhava Sheva to bhayander).

Pipe dream I say!

PS: Here's another project in Seattle. ~$3 bn for 3.2km Read their current travails here - http://usa.streetsblog.org/2014/09/2...y-boondoggles/

I'd hate to imagine the kind of mess that can happen in Mumbai.

Last edited by phamilyman : 21st December 2014 at 08:25.
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Old 21st December 2014, 11:15   #22
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Good thought but the budget seems very little.

14.6 billion for 5.6km.


PS: Here's another project in Seattle. ~$3 bn for 3.2km
Given that most of the expenses will be local (E.g.: manpower, raw material), cost of these might not be comparable.

Also manpower cost would be order of magnitude cheaper (Minimum wage for skilled worker is INR 1.6 lakh per year in Mumbai compared to 15k USD in US)

http://m.paycheck.in/main/salary/min...cember-31-2014
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Old 21st December 2014, 13:45   #23
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay View Post
Given that most of the expenses will be local (E.g.: manpower, raw material), cost of these might not be comparable.

Also manpower cost would be order of magnitude cheaper (Minimum wage for skilled worker is INR 1.6 lakh per year in Mumbai compared to 15k USD in US)

http://m.paycheck.in/main/salary/min...cember-31-2014
Agree only partially.

The right example is to consider the cost of metro tunnels in India vs anywhere else. Hence, we would definitely be quite cheap, but not so cheap so as to make these current estimates work.
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Old 21st December 2014, 13:52   #24
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

They should spend that money on bettering the current infrastructure and creating new areas like a satellite city which will keep away the traffic anyway.
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Old 21st December 2014, 14:10   #25
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

Wow! I won't comment anything on the project's budget. Cuz I am sure by the end of the project several 'babus' and officials will become billionaires and the cost of the project will become atleast 5-6 times the planned cost.

The only thing I am concerned about is the time it will take to complete such an ambitious project. If we go by the time it took them to build Sea-Link (around 10 years?) I can easily assume I will be well into my retirement when the project will get complete :P

-Bhargav
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Old 21st December 2014, 14:37   #26
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
The right example is to consider the cost of metro tunnels in India vs anywhere else. Hence, we would definitely be quite cheap, but not so cheap so as to make these current estimates work.
Another example is the two tunnels (1km each) being drilled through Kuthiran hills in the Palakkad-Thrissur stretch of the national highway. The work is schedules to start soon. The total cost of the project is estimated to be Rs. 300 crores.
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Old 21st December 2014, 18:47   #27
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This idea is completely wonky and reflects a lack of priorities. You tunnel only where you need to. In Bombay, tunnels make sense for cross town links, which are non existent. The North South link to the Ahmedabad highway (via the West Coast Freeway) should be built by reclaiming land along the West Coast of the city, with attractively designed bridges where that would be in appropriate (for example near Juhu beach). There should be an adequate number of exits - not just something that connects Nariman Point (a dying business district which should be redeveloped in residential housing) to the outskirts of the city. On the Eastern Side, the Eastern Freeway is a good step, but they should have had at least one other exit (near Sewri / Cotton Green) to enable traffic to enter and exit from midtown Bombay. And there could be underground links from such exit points to link to the Western Freeway - with intermediate exits in arterial roads like Dr. Ambedkar Road, Tulsi Pipe Road and Annie Besant Road.

On the other hand, there is a need for a comprehensive underground metro system in Bombay, including S shaped lines that link the central and western railways in multiple locations.
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Old 26th December 2014, 12:34   #28
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

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On the other hand, there is a need for a comprehensive underground metro system in Bombay, including S shaped lines that link the central and western railways in multiple locations.
Absolutely. There seems to be no comprehensive planning only plentiful of absurd ideas. The trains/metro should be underground. Escalators/lifts bring people to the road surface. Why take people to the skywalks, even if connecting to the ROBs. Instead all main roads should be elevated (like the JJ flyover/eastern freeway) with appropriate entry/exit points.
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Old 26th December 2014, 12:48   #29
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

Too many questions on this one the first one is,

How do I get a Job in one of the departments that will finance this project? I mean, we have scams where the amount involved is less than 1% of the total cost for this project, so a lot of people are going to get rich.

Seriously,
my wife is from Mumbai and I visit frequently. When it rains, it resembles a Venice, though a VERY dirty one at that with water everywhere. How on earth will they manage a underground road? Instead of this, they should spend on improving the horrible roads, build expressways and even better, improve the public transport system so that people are not required to take their vehicles out.
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Old 26th December 2014, 15:29   #30
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Default Re: Rs.90,000 Crore for Underground Ring Road in Mumbai

Underground In Mumbai ?? And then I think of Mumbai rains.. God bless !!
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