[sauravpat]

Are sophisticated soft roaders capable enough to handle large inclines and obstacles?



That is what I went to find out at the Quattro drive at Audi Pune. It was just a short 10 minute drive over a few metal obstacles like ramps after a short briefing about the instructions.

The event was organised by Audi Pune in collaboration with instructors from a third party organisation. They were knowledgeable with offloading driving techniques but not with the exact specifications of the cars themselves.



This was followed by some refreshments and a short video of visitors talking about their experience. A Q8 and ETron were kept as display vehicles.


We drove the Q7 as the Q5 was being used by other visitors. All in all it was a fun free open for all marketing event with quite a few visitors coming there on a Sunday afternoon even with temperatures above 37° C. Well organised and smoothly executed. I am sure these obstacles are not a real reflection of actual offroading and look much more sensational than they actually are but it showcases the Quattro system really nicely compared to 2WD



Impressions:

What it looks from the outside is very different to what it feels from the inside. When we were observing other drivers on the course, the cars looked like they were at their limit.

2 wheels in the air and the other two wheels struggling to get traction, 30 degree steep inclines where the car looked like it would topple over at any moment.



But once we sat on the driver's seat, it was just a case of making small steering wheel adjustments while maintaining a constant 1400 rpm. Once the wheel in the air or on the gravel spins and does not get enough traction, the sensors kick in and divert power to the wheels with more traction and the car easily chugs along over the ramps.

Add to that, the steering remains light as ever and from the inside you hardly notice all the extreme angles you are doing. Hardly felt any hard bumps and crashes inside even when we were literally tipping the car over on two wheels and landing back down on all 4.



The highlight was a 30 degree steep ramp where the driver was a couple of feet higher than you when you sat in the front passenger seat and if you rolled down the window you could easily touch the ground with your hand.



That one was genuinely scary

Biggest Takeaway:

If a small Q5 and even Q3 can do all of this without breaking a sweat, what are Defenders, Gurkhas, Thars capable of?


This has surely scratched my offroading itch now, one I did not know I had since our family has never owned an SUV.

But it made my belief that if I ever buy an SUV, it needs to drive all 4 wheels and have some offroading capabilities even stronger.

FWD pseudo SUVs that have flooded our market would never be able to do what these Quattro systems are doing...in other words, there is no place you can go in a Creta/Taigun that you won't be able to go in in a Verna/Vento.

Of course for older people ingress and egress may be a valid consideration in going for a crossover.

But I have a genuine question on what these FWD pseudo SUVs do with offroad modes. In the new Creta, there is a toggle to change offroad modes like snow, gravel, etc.

What changes does the car make if any when we change the modes? I seriously doubt changing these modes does anything at all. I may be wrong though. Would love inputs from all of you!

Cheers,

Saurav

[vishy76]

Originally Posted by sauravpat

But I have a genuine question on what these FWD pseudo SUVs do with offroad modes. In the new Creta, there is a toggle to change offroad modes like snow, gravel, etc.

What changes does the car make if any when we change the modes? I seriously doubt changing these modes does anything at all. I may be wrong though. Would love inputs from all of you!

Most of these FWD pseudo SUVs only alter the ECU maps at the flick of a button or turn of a knob. Typically, this alters throttle response only. Say you put it into sand mode, the car dulls down the throttle response so that there is a lesser chance of you spinning the wheels out. I believe the Seltos/Creta do this.

On the other hand, a few others like the Tata Harrier also make changes to how the ESP and traction control act. The TC might switch off entirely in some modes in order to aid an easier launch from slippery surfaces, while the ESP might assume a more aggressive nature and apply brakes proactively to a wheel that slips.

All said and done, this is the max a FWD "SUV" will do. There's nothing more that is possible anyway due to hardware limitations. AWD is the next best thing after these pseudo modes.

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by vishy76

On the other hand, a few others like the Tata Harrier also make changes to how the ESP and traction control act. The TC might switch off entirely in some modes in order to aid an easier launch from slippery surfaces, while the ESP might assume a more aggressive nature and apply brakes proactively to a wheel that slips.

True. It was fun feeliing the vehicle apply brakes ON and OFF aggressively in slushy surfaces and steep inclines.

Contrary to what Tata might have wanted, the sheer effectiveness of the Harrier's off road modes makes us feel angry at Tata for not offering AWD. Just imagine if the off road modes were paired with an AWD system.

[Kosfactor]

Originally Posted by sauravpat

FWD pseudo SUVs that have flooded our market would never be able to do what these Quattro systems are doing...in other words, there is no place you can go in a Creta/Taigun that you won't be able to go in in a Verna/Vento.

As far as I know Quattro nowadays is the standard AWD system as found in anything else.

Traction is not necessarily the big problem off road, its clearance for bits underneath, numbers are good to compare on the internet but just look underneath on a lift and you can see what`s the first thing you are going to damage. In case of european cars there is plenty of fragile bits hanging too low to the ground.

In other words these fancy vehicles can go off road as long as you carry a really big trashcan to collect all those fancy acoustic paneling underneath, and the bumper and the exhaust system etc when they fall off (the local crossovers like Creta will do much better here).

Cars made for India usually keep the fragile bits tucked away behind some cross member or some other steel structure.

A simple example - remove the bumper of a VW polo & an Alto , see which one is going to make ground contact with something important.

[saisree]

Happened to be part of a similar Quattro Event by Audi at Chennai last Sunday 11/12. Event happened at a private place at OMR generally frequented by all manufactures to show case their vehicles off road capabilities. It was a 5-car event, with three Q7's and two Q5's.

Being an amateur in OFF Roading, had a wonderful time with the Q7. We were able to drive through water, slush, mud and a 22-degree angle tilted drive. I would never drive on those type of surfaces in my car, but the Q7 came out without any drama

https://youtu.be/YPo-oyfdDFA

https://youtu.be/cLin4xoqKCQ

[ringoism]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

Traction is not necessarily the big problem off road, its clearance for bits underneath, numbers are good to compare on the internet but just look underneath on a lift and you can see what`s the first thing you are going to damage. In case of european cars there is plenty of fragile bits hanging too low to the ground.

Agreed that traction is often secondary to GC: Re: Euro cars maybe too broad a generalization; I know the Yeti design very carefully avoided having anything critical exposed underneath, all were tucked up in the driveshaft tunnel.

That said, like most of the genre it was pretty low-slung and even if one wouldn't damage anything critical, what's the fun in continual hard hits and very likely finally getting "high centered" or otherwise stuck/stranded? I did some terrible roads / barely roads on steep inclines in a Yeti and with careful driving didn't hit and plenty of grip... but it took skilled effort (and momentum).

There are times when traction is truly what's needed most, but driving across a wet field or a relatively flat forest road as depicted should be barely considered offroading. The AWD might get one out of a few tight spots in the "normal" lives of a few, but trying anything more serious in one of these would be a bit foolhardy, and it's probably true that potential damage bills could cover the cost of an old CJ.

Our Getaway has loads more GC than, say, a Bolero, and I've still scraped the bottom a few times "off-road" (cut roads yet unused, or used by huge trucks). And I once cracked the oil chamber on the Marshal on-road (big stone)!

-Eric

P.S. As an aside, Altos despite 2wd are quite capable, I guess for the same reasons that old CJ's are. Low gears, short WB/ overhangs, good GC, light weight. In snow they do show their limitations. That has a lot to do with why Audi Quattros were ever designed/ built in the first place. Snowy /slick roads - not offroad.