[amol4184]

6 months are up and bike has clocked slightly over 2500 kms. This being my first build it holds a special place and as lot of other bikes came and went in this period, this one stayed and I don't see parting ways with it any time soon.

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No major issues to note except the C ring that compresses headset into place was replaced with a new design.
The old C ring caused a slight play in the handlebar when rocking the bike back and forth. I did mitigate it with thin shims inserted between headset spacers but wasn't too happy with the "jugaad".

To my luck, the company who made the frame knew of this problem and improved the design of the C ring. They sent the new C ring to whoever was having the problem (for free). So I am happy to report there is some level of support for Chinese frames and you aren't entirely on your own to fix issues if anyone is venturing onto this route.

My other worry was pressfit bottom bracket developing creaks under heavy load. Fortunately that didn't happen either. ***touches wood***

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Parts changed/swapped -

1. Brake pads changed from semi-metallic to resin.

2. Brake rotors changed from ZRACE to Shimano RT30. The ZRACE rotors while cheap never stopped howling. In the wet they made even louder sound. In my experience even the cheapest of Shimano rotors are better than any Chinese rotor.

3. Top tube bag - I hacked an existing bag that attaches to top tube with straps into a direct mount bag. It wasn't a tough job. I simply removed the straps and drilled holes into the bottom part of the bag to match screws on top tube of the bag.


4. Removed under seat bag. Much cleaner look and doesn't get dirty from the mud either. The freed up space meant I could install Garmin Varia radar on it.

5. Switched from road style clipless pedals to MTB style Crankbrothers Candy. I should have done this way earlier.

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Maintenance-

1. Regular cleaning, nothing crazy. I pretty much just use a small handhold garden sprayer and wipe off the frame. I use diluted dishwashing liquid. For chain and cassette and I use 409 degreaser, brush, dishwashing liquid and then wipe it off with a cloth.

2. For lubricant I switched from T9 Boeshield to Rock 'n Roll gold. Less messy, easy to clean and better on dusty trails.

3. Fake Shimano chain and Chinese 11-34 ultralight one piece cassette both are surprisingly holding strong. From what I am seeing, the cassette is good to go for another 5-7k kms. The chain might go off soon.

4. I noticed the loss off air every 3-4 rides so refilled tubeless sealant once. No punctures yet on Panaracer Gravelking SS tires and I am pleasantly surprised how well they roll on smooth tarmac. I am almost as fast as my aero road bike (25c tires) on this gravel bike with 32c tires.

5. Front derailleur adjustment a few times. Not sure why but I have to keep adjusting limit screws on the FD almost every month.

6. Greased the hubs. I noticed the water makes it way into the hub and then bearings start making a rough sounds. The bearings are not serviceable so I am keeping my fingers crossed. If the hubs go kaput, I will go with DT-Swiss hub'd wheels for their simplicity.

7. Got the wheels trued. The rear wheel was slightly off center. No issues with the front.

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All in all, build has proven solid and I would be down for another Chinese frame in near future. Latest picture of the bike below as it stands today.

That's it for now. Keep riding bois.

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[amol4184]

Bike completes 1 year! Sits at 5k kms and is going stronger than ever. To mark the occasion I did some upgrades.

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The semi-hydraulic cable pull brakes were first to go. That meant also replacing the shifters AND doing the whole internal cable routing again. That cable routing has me on the boil so I have been avoiding this upgrade even though I got all the necessary parts a few months ago.

Anyhoo, one fine day I decided to bite that bullet but before that I ordered a routing tool from Amazon. My hopes were to not go through hours of pain and to that effect it works. Instead of 3-4 hours it took an hour - still not optimal but manageable.

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Parts swapped:


1. Onirii semi-hydro calipers -> Ultegra R8020 full hydraulic calipers.
2. Ultegra R6800 rim brake shifters -> Ultegra R8020 hydraulic shifters.
3. Rim brake 5mm housing -> Shimano BH90 hoses.
4. No name shifter cables -> Jagwire shifter cable kit
5. FSA chainrings -> Pass Quest aero chainrings

After the upgrade, braking performance isn't vastly better than mechanical disc brakes as some people claim. In my opinion the biggest change is in how they feel when you brake. The slight vibration from cables is gone and initial bite is stronger.

Apart from that, there is not much benefit to going full hydraulic when you consider the cost and efforts involved. And don't forget potentially messy bleeding jobs and specific tools required to set these things up.

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Other notes:
1. The Panaracer GK SS are still holding well and I am yet to have a flat. The rear is balding but front is in good shape. I am planning to switch front tire to back in about 2k kms more and entirely replace front with a new one. The 32c tires seem to do the trick for me.

2. The hydraulic shifters are humongous. They feel good in hand but not necessarily better or worse than smaller rim brake shifters.

3. The rear wheel started sounding gruff. I did some research on how to change the bearings and replaced the bearings on it. Its like new and new bearings are incredibly silent. So silent that my kittens don't mind it. I used a bearing press tool for this job.

4. The chainrings had worn out. I could sense increased noise while on the big chainring. Instead of replacing them with FSA, I got a Chinese chainset by a company called Pass Quest. These seem well made but not any cheaper than FSA. The crankarms have lost their color from shoe rub but I am holding out from changing them. I love how stiff this crankset feels.

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That's it for now. I think the bike is finally complete and unless something breaks, it will probably stay like this.

[ostrish]

Very cool build. The Panaracers are great tyres, I run the 32c SK (small knobs? semi knobs?) instead of the SS (certainly semi slicks). I love how soft they feel on tarmac, probably because they are 120 tpi and 32c.

Pass Quest is great – I have have a PQ 35mm stem on my enduro hardtail. It is quite beefy and takes abuse. Agree it's not cheaper but definitely more VFM.

I find hydraulic brake brifters to be significantly more comfier than cable actuated ones. Have them on my spouse's Kona JtS. Unfortunately my Surly Straggler has cable ones. Find the bigger brifters give way more control while riding trails and makes it easier to pull the front up.

Been on hydraulic discs for more than a decade now and no way would I go back to cables. Yes on the road the difference is small but on dirt it is a massive difference.

[amol4184]

Originally Posted by ostrish

Very cool build. The Panaracers are great tyres, I run the 32c SK (small knobs? semi knobs?) instead of the SS (certainly semi slicks). I love how soft they feel on tarmac, probably because they are 120 tpi and 32c.

Pass Quest is great – I have have a PQ 35mm stem on my enduro hardtail. It is quite beefy and takes abuse. Agree it's not cheaper but definitely more VFM.

I find hydraulic brake brifters to be significantly more comfier than cable actuated ones. Have them on my spouse's Kona JtS. Unfortunately my Surly Straggler has cable ones. Find the bigger brifters give way more control while riding trails and makes it easier to pull the front up.

Been on hydraulic discs for more than a decade now and no way would I go back to cables. Yes on the road the difference is small but on dirt it is a massive difference.

Yes SK for semi knobby those are great too, I have them on a Salsa Journeyer that I sometimes use on a rough gravel trail. Overall my riding is 80% tarmac though so on this bike SS work for me. Plenty fast on the road, good enough for light gravel.

The hydros are definitely nicer feeling though I feel good hydro-mech calipers like JuinTech GT or TRP HY/RD are very close to full hydros. These Onirii ones were as good as JuinTechs at 1/3rd the price however those are also creeping up in price.
My biggest complain about full hydros is how little they offer in ways of gap adjustment or fixing something quickly. I had the first generation GRX calipers on a build and boy those were some of the hardest calipers to adjust. I hear Shimano listened to complaints and newer (post 2021 I think) calipers have larger gap between pads once fully bled.

On the other hand XT/Deore post mount MTB calipers are easier to setup. Easier than Ultegra flat mounts anyway. It took quite a while to fully get all the air out of the system.

With that said full hydros are not a deal breaker to me. If a bike that I really like comes with full hydro I would jump on it.

[amol4184]

L-Twoo GR7 1x10 Gravel groupset review

Since this thread has plenty of Chinesium components I didn't feel like starting a new thread for a mini review of a Chinese groupset that I recently acquired.

Note, this groupset went on a different bike (Salsa Journeyer) than the one being talked in this thread. This particular bike is my "test" platform and has gone through various groupsets over time.

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This is my first time going for entire Chinese drive train. Something that I have not done before. In my opinion Chinese frame and wheels + Shimano/SRAM drivetrain is the best middle ground but during recent sale these groupsets were being sold at really (really) good prices and I couldn't resist. The other option was more established Sensah GRA but the Campy style shifting swayed me towards L-Twoo.

Pulled trigger on 1x10 speed groupset made by L-Twoo which has been making foray into hydraulic and electronic groupset area and getting good reviews. I am not yet brave enough to drop a sizeable dough on Chinese electronic group but fully mechanical 10 speed sounded pretty simple and cheap. Another reason for this exact groupset was also the different, Campagnolo style gear shifting which turned out to be a mixed bag but more on that later.

What can go wrong? It can't be that bad - I said to myself as I clicked the buy button.

Other components on this test bike - Sunshine 10 speed 11-46 cassette, YBN 10 speed chain, 1x 38t crankset by Racework, Onirii hydro-mech brakes, Satori gravel handlebar. As you can notice, entire drivetrain and more is all ..Chinese componentry.

The 10 speed group goes by the name GR7 not sure why while the 11 speed is called GR9. My thought process going for 10 speed was simple. Cheap cassettes, cheap chains, cheap chainrings..just sweet cheapness all round

Anyhoo, contrary to my assumptions the groupset has some surprisingly good qualities to it, for the price.

The good:

1. Crisp shifting action and smooth transition between gears. This is one smooth shifting groupset, second to none. Indexing was as easy as any other group and poses no surprises.
   
2. Price. Shimano still makes 10 speed Tiagra but costs about 5 times the GR7.
   
3. Support for large range cassettes (11-50 max)
   
4. Simple mechanical cable pull brake (not hydraulic)
   
5. Easy cable routing. The shift cable routing is easier than Shimano shifters.

The average:

1. Rear derailleur has some slop in it. After mounting it, there is bit of a lateral movement around derailleur hangar. Once cable tension sets in, it tightens and doesn't move but none of my Shimano/SRAM derailleurs do that.
   
2. The shifter shape is too narrow for my liking. It is the same problem as I have with SRAM Red 22 shifters.
   
3. Weight. But I don't think anyone is trying to save grams at this price. Pretty chunky these bois.
   

The bad:

1. Downshift lever is wobbly. It functions well when it needs to be, but I can't ignore how it does not rest in its supposed place. The fit and finish are certainly not Shimano level. When you press the brake lever this little gear lever is expected to nest inside the brake lever but instead it tries to go over the brake lever. Note, it *tries* but never actually goes over the brake. Its awkward.
   
2. The upshift button is impossible to reach from the drop of the handlebar. Even without wearing gloves and having large-ish hands I can't press that button. The only way to upshift is from the hoods. Extremely wide flared gravel bars make the matter worse too.
   These shifters will be well suited on a road handlebar with no flare but weirdly enough these are specifically for gravel where flared bars are very popular.
   
3. Another mind boggling design decision - the shifter clamp band tightening screw is at such an extreme angle its nearly impossible to tighten it without a ball head hex key. And even with ball head key there will always be a danger of stripping out the head of that screw because the key just can't get deep enough because of the angle.

Verdict:

• Good for a budget build. Or on a rough use slash bike-packing bike that you are not afraid to drop. I will also gladly put this on a commuter bike. The build quality is not top notch but it is not delicate either. Shifts are as good as Shimano or SRAM. So far I have not noticed any missed or phantom shifts because of the wobbly lever or sloppy derailleur. The upshift button as inaccessible it may be is pretty nice and clicking it repeatedly to drop multiple gears rapidly is such a joy.
  
• The groupset is gravel specific 1x which are all the rage now a days and yet operating shifters when mounted on flared bars is not an ideal experience. Or just stick to normal bars without flare. The Redshift bar installed on my bike is an extreme example of flare.
  
• 10 speeds is enough especially if you get one of those humongous dinner plate cassettes. The rear derailleur supports that from factory and shifts without any hiccups.

[maranellored]

Great post! Just noticed this post. Thanks for sharing.
I’ve had to rebuild my gravel bike this month and I ended up replacing pretty much everything except for the frame :-) Only wish I’d seen this post before and I could’ve incorporated some of the learnings!

Built out a 1x mullet with SRAM AXS Eagle and Force AXS shifters.
Had a lot of trouble getting the tire inflated. Had one tire explode on me too while I was trying to seat it. Guess I learnt it the hard way that I need an air compressor to get this fixed, lol. It is not fun to get sealant all over you when the tire explodes.

[amol4184]

Originally Posted by maranellored

Built out a 1x mullet with SRAM AXS Eagle and Force AXS shifters.
Had a lot of trouble getting the tire inflated. Had one tire explode on me too while I was trying to seat it. Guess I learnt it the hard way that I need an air compressor to get this fixed, lol. It is not fun to get sealant all over you when the tire explodes.

Many thanks.

SRAM AXS systems are great! definitely way less work than Shimano Di2. I had a tire burst after seating it. Thankfully it exploded towards a glass door right next to bike and sealant was all over it, had it exploded from other side I was doomed - the other side was thick carpet

I don't have compressor so what I do is use inner tube for first time setup. Get the tire seated with tube in it and then deflate, unseat just one side of the tire, put some sealant it, start inflating with regular foot pump. With little trial and error the sealant eventually gets into the bead and seals the bead. Then fill up rest of the sealant. Some tires are just harder to seat than others so this method may not work. Conti GP5000 STR are extremely hard to fit, Panaracer GKs are easier IMO.

[maranellored]

Originally Posted by amol4184

I don't have compressor so what I do is use inner tube for first time setup. Get the tire seated with tube in it and then deflate, unseat just one side of the tire, put some sealant it, start inflating with regular foot pump. With little trial and error the sealant eventually gets into the bead and seals the bead. Then fill up rest of the sealant. Some tires are just harder to seat than others so this method may not work. Conti GP5000 STR are extremely hard to fit, Panaracer GKs are easier IMO.

That's good to know. I'd been using Donelly xplor's in the past and really liked them but just switched to the Pirelli Cinturatos and they are hard to seat for sure. Hopefully, I won't have to do this often :-D

I really like the SRAM stuff except for the fact that their hydraulic systems use a DOT fluid which is kind of a pain to deal with. Shimano uses regular mineral oil which is easier to handle.

[amol4184]

Originally Posted by maranellored

I really like the SRAM stuff except for the fact that their hydraulic systems use a DOT fluid which is kind of a pain to deal with. Shimano uses regular mineral oil which is easier to handle.

Use of mineral oil is big plus in my books. You spill mineral oil on the frame or elsewhere and nothing will happen, but with DOT you have to be extremely careful. It will corrode thru pretty much anything. SRAM did launch a mineral oil brakeset last year for MTBs but I don't think that tech ever made it to road style groupsets.