Is Amplifier Needed ?

Kannan · 24th October 2009, 07:33

Hi I am currently having the following setup.

Car: Maruti Suzuki Ritz VDI
HU: Pioneer DEH-P5190UB
Front Speakers: JBL GT5-S265
Rear Components: GTO608C

Currently all the speakers and Components are directly driven by the HU.
Now I am planning to add a 12" Sub-Woofer to the current setup.

For Subwoofer I know that an amplifier is needed.

So can I go ahead and put a mono amplifer, Sub-Woofer and leave the speakers and components directly driven by HU or do I need to have 5 channel amplifier and connect all the speakers, components and sub-woofer to the 5-Channel amplifier ?

Also can you suggest me a good amplifier and JBL sub-woofer ?

Thanks,
Kannan Balasubramanian

Mi10 · 24th October 2009, 08:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kannan

Hi I am currently having the following setup.

Car: Maruti Suzuki Ritz VDI
HU: Pioneer DEH-P5190UB
Front Speakers: JBL GT5-S265
Rear Components: GTO608C

Currently all the speakers and Components are directly driven by the HU.
Now I am planning to add a 12" Sub-Woofer to the current setup.

For Subwoofer I know that an amplifier is needed.

So can I go ahead and put a mono amplifer, Sub-Woofer and leave the speakers and components directly driven by HU or do I need to have 5 channel amplifier and connect all the speakers, components and sub-woofer to the 5-Channel amplifier ?

Also can you suggest me a good amplifier and JBL sub-woofer ?

Thanks,
Kannan Balasubramanian

Powering all your Components (Front, rear speakers & Sub) will give you Unmatched Quality - even at higher volumes over those run from HU.

If you have the budget and passion for hearing good quality music, go for Amps for Speakers too.
There are only few good 5-ch Amps available. and they are pretty pricey too.
I'd Suggest you a 4 Ch Amp (would cost you above 8K) for the Speakers and mono (cost you above 10K) for Sub

JBL GT5-S12 is good; Grey Price maybe 2.6K

pranava999 · 24th October 2009, 08:31

Is an amp needed? Well depends on whether you are happy running your speakers off the HU. However you will definitely need an amp to power a subwoofer.

Option 1
Get a 4 channel amp with decent RMS output. You can choose from JBL, Blaupunkt, Kenwood, etc. Run the front components using 2 channels, bridge the other 2 channels and power a 10" / 12" subwoofer, and run the rear coaxial speakers off the head unit.

Option 2
If you are happy running your speakers from your HU then get a 2 channel amp and bridge it and use that to power a subwoofer.

Option 3
Get yourself a powered bass tube. I think JBL has it.

Do try and audition as much as possible. That will definitely help you in deciding. Cheers!

Kannan · 24th October 2009, 11:17

Hi Pranav,

Is it ok to go with JBL non powered Tube Woofers. Are they good ?

How is Pioneer 3300 bi-amp. Is it good to ?

DerAlte · 24th October 2009, 11:20

Kanna, this is strange. Why would you mount the S265 coax in the front and the 608c components in the rear? Is your Ritz driven by a driver and you sit in the back? Otherwise, one would expect the S265 in the rear doors and the 608c in front.

JBL GT5-S644 / Blaupunkt GT4 Spl Mk2 / Kenwood 8404 would be good choices, whether you power front+sub(bridged), or front+rear.

If you are the boom-tizz types, buy a mono separately for the sub - say a JBL GTO 3501.

If you are not in the mood to buy a sub and get it mounted in a box, there are some good pre-boxed subs from JBL, Infinity, Polk, Blaupunkt, etc.

@pranavaa, are you sure there are powered sub tubes from JBL?

Kannan · 24th October 2009, 11:54

Hi DerAlte, My is Ritz driven by a driver. I don't want the Sub-woofer to take entire Boot space.

I have the following options

Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + Prepacked Subwoofer with closure - JBL GTS-1204 - Rs. 9900

Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + JBL GT5-S12 Subwoofer Rs. 4600 + Custom Subwoofer enclosure Rs. 1700

Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + JBL CS-1205T Bass tube Rs. 6500.

Please suggest me from above option which is good.

What I need is good bass and need usable boot space.

24th October 2009, 13:01

to decide whether to amp your high frequency speakers you have to consider this, the average head unit will be stating that it is 50 watts of power per channel, but thats at peak levels. The nominal power output would be between 10 and 18 watts RMS, and this will be feeding speakers that require generally a bit more power to run them

this underpowering would not be too serious if you were in a stable and quite environment, but in a car you have to contend with the following noises

1) road rumble and tyre noise
2) exhaust noise
3) wind noise
4) rattling plastic (as soon as the average car is more than 6 months old)
5) engine noise from the front through the firewall
6) possibly even conversation from the passenger

all of these noises could give you an ambient noise level of up to around 80db already, so to overcome this i thnk that all the speakers in a car really need to be amplified

UNLESS

you only play the system while the car is switched off and standing still, in which case the head unit power should be adequate.

BUT

the instant you turn the key and start the car you will need more power to the speakers for these to be heard cleanly above the noises that the vehicle makes in its duties as a mode of transportation

So, for your circumstances amplify the speakers you listen to and use the headunit power for the speakers that the driver listens to because obviously he does not pay for the equipment, and hence you are the person deserving to have the best audio experience

phamilyman · 24th October 2009, 13:55

Sir,

two things:
a. Blaupunkt GTA4MKII is an awesome amp. Amp basically makes life REALLY fun - esp if you like it (reasonably) LOUD!
b. GTO 608c is a FRONT component. Are you sure of your installer?

lastly, i got the CS1205 JBL sub for 3200 incl bill. It is quite awesome and really makes music fun. Put an amp and sub for trials and you won't regret.

PS: Then you can even ditch the rear fills, unless your car is fully occupied normally!

pranava999 · 24th October 2009, 14:58

@DA - Not really sure if they are officially available now but have noticed a few in swifts. So am assuming they should be available. Nothing on their site though. SO there's quite a good possibility that I mistook plain simple tube sub enclosures for powered ones. My bad !!

@Kannan - I'm not one of those technical experts or gurus here but its just my opinion that its better to go in for a 2 channel amp from the JBL (GT5 - s422 )or listen to the ones in Blaupunkt and not go in for the pioneers.
I don't see any problems in going in for JBL subs, they are pretty popular brand and have been around for years. The best advice I can give you is to trust your ears. Audition, Audition!

DerAlte · 24th October 2009, 16:04

@kannan, I would say go for the pre-built sealed box rather than the tube. The tube will make you hate mridangam.

An alternative, if you have access to anyone who does fiber glass work, is to custom build an FG enclosure on the right wall of the boot, and mount the sub there. This will allow you to retain 90% of the boot and not have to take out the sub box everytime. There are many such instances on the forum.

24th October 2009, 07:33	#1
Kannan BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: MAA/CJB/LHR Posts: 189 Thanked: 192 Times	Is Amplifier Needed ? Hi I am currently having the following setup. Car: Maruti Suzuki Ritz VDI HU: Pioneer DEH-P5190UB Front Speakers: JBL GT5-S265 Rear Components: GTO608C Currently all the speakers and Components are directly driven by the HU. Now I am planning to add a 12" Sub-Woofer to the current setup. For Subwoofer I know that an amplifier is needed. So can I go ahead and put a mono amplifer, Sub-Woofer and leave the speakers and components directly driven by HU or do I need to have 5 channel amplifier and connect all the speakers, components and sub-woofer to the 5-Channel amplifier ? Also can you suggest me a good amplifier and JBL sub-woofer ? Thanks, Kannan Balasubramanian
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 08:31	#3
pranava999 BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: BANGALORE Posts: 845 Thanked: 23 Times View My Garage	Is an amp needed? Well depends on whether you are happy running your speakers off the HU. However you will definitely need an amp to power a subwoofer. Option 1 Get a 4 channel amp with decent RMS output. You can choose from JBL, Blaupunkt, Kenwood, etc. Run the front components using 2 channels, bridge the other 2 channels and power a 10" / 12" subwoofer, and run the rear coaxial speakers off the head unit. Option 2 If you are happy running your speakers from your HU then get a 2 channel amp and bridge it and use that to power a subwoofer. Option 3 Get yourself a powered bass tube. I think JBL has it. Do try and audition as much as possible. That will definitely help you in deciding. Cheers! Last edited by pranava999 : 24th October 2009 at 08:39.
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 11:17	#4
Kannan BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: MAA/CJB/LHR Posts: 189 Thanked: 192 Times	Hi Pranav, Is it ok to go with JBL non powered Tube Woofers. Are they good ? How is Pioneer 3300 bi-amp. Is it good to ?
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 11:20	#5
DerAlte Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 8,069 Thanked: 2,919 Times	Kanna, this is strange. Why would you mount the S265 coax in the front and the 608c components in the rear? Is your Ritz driven by a driver and you sit in the back? Otherwise, one would expect the S265 in the rear doors and the 608c in front. JBL GT5-S644 / Blaupunkt GT4 Spl Mk2 / Kenwood 8404 would be good choices, whether you power front+sub(bridged), or front+rear. If you are the boom-tizz types, buy a mono separately for the sub - say a JBL GTO 3501. If you are not in the mood to buy a sub and get it mounted in a box, there are some good pre-boxed subs from JBL, Infinity, Polk, Blaupunkt, etc. @pranavaa, are you sure there are powered sub tubes from JBL?
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 11:54	#6
Kannan BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: MAA/CJB/LHR Posts: 189 Thanked: 192 Times	Hi DerAlte, My is Ritz driven by a driver. I don't want the Sub-woofer to take entire Boot space. I have the following options Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + Prepacked Subwoofer with closure - JBL GTS-1204 - Rs. 9900 Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + JBL GT5-S12 Subwoofer Rs. 4600 + Custom Subwoofer enclosure Rs. 1700 Pioneer 3300 Bi-AMP Rs. 5700 + JBL CS-1205T Bass tube Rs. 6500. Please suggest me from above option which is good. What I need is good bass and need usable boot space.
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 13:01	#7
naughty001 Posts: n/a	to decide whether to amp your high frequency speakers you have to consider this, the average head unit will be stating that it is 50 watts of power per channel, but thats at peak levels. The nominal power output would be between 10 and 18 watts RMS, and this will be feeding speakers that require generally a bit more power to run them this underpowering would not be too serious if you were in a stable and quite environment, but in a car you have to contend with the following noises 1) road rumble and tyre noise 2) exhaust noise 3) wind noise 4) rattling plastic (as soon as the average car is more than 6 months old) 5) engine noise from the front through the firewall 6) possibly even conversation from the passenger all of these noises could give you an ambient noise level of up to around 80db already, so to overcome this i thnk that all the speakers in a car really need to be amplified UNLESS you only play the system while the car is switched off and standing still, in which case the head unit power should be adequate. BUT the instant you turn the key and start the car you will need more power to the speakers for these to be heard cleanly above the noises that the vehicle makes in its duties as a mode of transportation So, for your circumstances amplify the speakers you listen to and use the headunit power for the speakers that the driver listens to because obviously he does not pay for the equipment, and hence you are the person deserving to have the best audio experience
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 13:55	#8
phamilyman Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 5,968 Thanked: 4,642 Times	Sir, two things: a. Blaupunkt GTA4MKII is an awesome amp. Amp basically makes life REALLY fun - esp if you like it (reasonably) LOUD! b. GTO 608c is a FRONT component. Are you sure of your installer? lastly, i got the CS1205 JBL sub for 3200 incl bill. It is quite awesome and really makes music fun. Put an amp and sub for trials and you won't regret. PS: Then you can even ditch the rear fills, unless your car is fully occupied normally!
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 14:58	#9
pranava999 BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: BANGALORE Posts: 845 Thanked: 23 Times View My Garage	@DA - Not really sure if they are officially available now but have noticed a few in swifts. So am assuming they should be available. Nothing on their site though. SO there's quite a good possibility that I mistook plain simple tube sub enclosures for powered ones. My bad !! @Kannan - I'm not one of those technical experts or gurus here but its just my opinion that its better to go in for a 2 channel amp from the JBL (GT5 - s422 )or listen to the ones in Blaupunkt and not go in for the pioneers. I don't see any problems in going in for JBL subs, they are pretty popular brand and have been around for years. The best advice I can give you is to trust your ears. Audition, Audition! Last edited by pranava999 : 24th October 2009 at 15:10.
	() Thanks

24th October 2009, 16:04	#10
DerAlte Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 8,069 Thanked: 2,919 Times	@kannan, I would say go for the pre-built sealed box rather than the tube. The tube will make you hate mridangam. An alternative, if you have access to anyone who does fiber glass work, is to custom build an FG enclosure on the right wall of the boot, and mount the sub there. This will allow you to retain 90% of the boot and not have to take out the sub box everytime. There are many such instances on the forum.
	() Thanks