[RahulNagaraj]

American Airlines has announced that they have agreed to purchase 20 supersonic jets, with the option of an additional 40 jets from Boom Supersonic - a Colorado-based startup.



While financial details of the agreement haven't been disclosed, American Airlines did state that the deposit on the initial 20 supersonic aircraft is non-refundable. However, the agreement is subject to change based on Boom Supersonic's ability to meet industry standards for operation, performance & safety and any other customary conditions before delivery of the Overtures.

According to Boom Supersonic, their Overture jets are expected to be rolled out in 2025 and enter commercial service sometime by the end of the decade. The Overture supersonic jet will be able to carry 65 to 80 passengers at speeds of up to Mach 1.7 - twice that of the current fastest commercial aircraft. The supersonic jet, once in operation, will have a cruising altitude of 60,000 feet and a range of 4,250 nautical miles.

Apart from American Airlines, Boom Supersonic also has an order for 15 Overtures from United Airlines. The company recently raised US$270 million in funding and fielded pre-orders from Virgin Group and Japan Airlines. The startup also claims the supersonic jets will be "net zero carbon" and run on 100% sustainable aviation fuel.

Link to Team-BHP news

[Reinhard]

I wonder if all these orders (they've got quite a few on the book now) are for real, or is this some novel hand-in-glove way to turn a start-up into a unicorn quickly and raise the valuation for the promoters overnight.

Afterall this is a plane in development for which as of now even the engine specification isn't finalized (at least thats what I had last read about it a while ago).

[Durango Dude]

Guess the environment doesn't matter for these high flying jets or what they may do to the ozone as long as it is from the 'State' side of the Atlantic. What tantrums the US threw during those Concorde days not allowing it to fly to many cities citing the hole in ozone and the whole world followed cue and signed the 'death warrant' of the Concorde just because it was from the 'wrong' side of the Atlantic...

[anshumandun]

Here I am confused if I should go ahead and buy a half baked electric scooter from a startup and this "Startup" is getting orders for supersonic jets from mainstream US airlines!

But I do hope that Boom becomes the Tesla of aircrafts and give us an opportunity to fly supersonic.

[ajayc123]

Just curious, would these planes require special runways? Or are our current runways in India ready to land these planes?

[ads11]

Originally Posted by Reinhard

Afterall this is a plane in development for which as of now even the engine specification isn't finalized (at least thats what I had last read about it a while ago).

Was about to say the same thing - normally when a new commercial airliner is announced, there's usually at least one engine option that goes with it. I don't think Boom have even listed any engine supplier, let alone an actual engine. For the numbers this would do even at the top end projection, surely there's no economic incentive for any OEM to make a clean sheet engine - so you're stuck looking at adapting an off the shelf military unit (the costs for adapting that will be pretty steep too I imagine).

While it's cool, I just can't see how commercial supersonic aviation has a future - margins are ever tighter in the commercial aviation sector and the big driver more than anything is efficiency. We all know supersonic is the opposite of efficient as fuel is burned at an incredible rate to achieve those speeds (afterburners notwithstanding, even with supercruise you're still burning a prodigious amount of fuel).

Where I think this Does make sense is if they did a supersonic private jet (I can't remember what the name was but there's another start up that I think is pursuing this as their end goal). There you have the deep pocketed customer base who'd be willing to fund this niche capability because they'd truly appreciate the ability to save time getting from A to B. Forgetting the environmental aspect for a second, working on the supposition that business travellers would welcome the ability to go to London/NY and back within their working day, COVID has pretty much blown that requirement out of the water. If anything teleconferencing, and remote working have shown that for a lot of these transcontinental meetings, you needn't have to be there in person. In the time of Concorde, sure there was value to the high rolling execs who needed to shuttle between the two major business cities but going forward, other advances have surely obviated that need.

I'm not saying I don't find the prospect of a new civilian supersonic airliner cool, I just feel that targeting the business market even might be a tall order in all fairness.

Another key speedbump for Boom is reliant on NASA's QueSST (Quiet Super Sonic Transport) demonstrator finally cracking the key to minimising the sonic boom as much as possible (and make no mistake, that's a big if). Once you can start minimising the impact of sonic booms over developed areas, and thus removing that objection from the public, you start opening up way more routes than simply transoceanic ones, and then, I can see it making sense for civil airline operators.

[MaheshY1]

Originally Posted by anshumandun

Here I am confused if I should go ahead and buy a half baked electric scooter from a startup and this "Startup" is getting orders for supersonic jets from mainstream US airlines!

But I do hope that Boom becomes the Tesla of aircrafts and give us an opportunity to fly supersonic.

Nothing is carved in stone. They have their terms and conditions, based on which, they can back out if these aren't met. Also, they must have only handed over the booking amount.

My heart wants this news to be true and I hope that both parties are motivated to bring supersonic aviation back. The Concorde is a legend.
I, personally, would never travel supersonic even for free. I'm just too scared of the delta wing for its poor glide ratio. These planes look like Mig 21s - like small wings and a canopy welded to a Brahmos. I guess that's exactly what excites us about supersonic travel.
I'm, however, interested in flying a glider, which has a lot of room for error.

[BoneCollector]

The airliner(plane) is named Overture. Boom Supersonic share regular updates on their Twitter page. For more details, do go through this.

[TechnoBloop]

United Airlines had already placed an order for 15 Boom Overtures last year and Virgin Atlantic had signed the deal for 10 aircrafts way back in 2016. So, AA ordering some supersonics for themselves was kinda expected.
It's amazing to see how much trust the airline companies are putting on start-ups, I hope Boom won't let them down!

Originally Posted by anshumandun

Here I am confused if I should go ahead and buy a half baked electric scooter from a startup and this "Startup" is getting orders for supersonic jets from mainstream US airlines!

LOL, then you'd be surprised to know that Virgin Atlantic had signed a deal with Boom for 10 aircrafts way back in 2016!!

Originally Posted by Reinhard

Afterall this is a plane in development for which as of now even the engine specification isn't finalized (at least thats what I had last read about it a while ago).

Originally Posted by ads11

Was about to say the same thing - normally when a new commercial airliner is announced, there's usually at least one engine option that goes with it. I don't think Boom have even listed any engine supplier, let alone an actual engine.

It's not confirmed but I am 90% sure that it would be Rolls-Royce.

Originally Posted by ads11

(afterburners notwithstanding, even with supercruise you're still burning a prodigious amount of fuel).

Boom Overture won't have any afterburners

Originally Posted by Durango Dude

Guess the environment doesn't matter for these high flying jets or what they may do to the ozone as long as it is from the 'State' side of the Atlantic. What tantrums the US threw during those Concorde days not allowing it to fly to many cities citing the hole in ozone and the whole world followed cue and signed the 'death warrant' of the Concorde just because it was from the 'wrong' side of the Atlantic...

That's the reason why they claim that their supersonic jets would run on 100% Sustainable Aviation Fuel, to reduce Carbon Footprint as much as possible.

[Durango Dude]

Originally Posted by anshumandun

Here I am confused if I should go ahead and buy a half baked electric scooter from a startup and this "Startup" is getting orders for supersonic jets from mainstream US airlines!

But I do hope that Boom becomes the Tesla of aircrafts and give us an opportunity to fly supersonic.

Just imagine how suave and smooth the marketing team/head must be to get these orders and advances for a Start Up product that's still on the boards or may be they must have a Godfather with deep pockets funding them.

[ads11]

I remember now, the company that was proposing the supersonic business jet was another US based start up, Aerion. Lo and behold, they recently abruptly folded due to a lack of cash.

Originally Posted by TechnoBloop

LOL, then you'd be surprised to know that Virgin Atlantic had signed a deal with Boom for 10 aircrafts way back in 2016!!

I wouldn't read too much into a lot of these piece meal orders, I imagine they're hardly firm deals and more likely placeholder orders taken as a punt on a platform - if it works out, management gets to tell investors they were far sighted enough and their order gives them plum early slots, if it doesn't then they can easily limit the sunk cost as a speculative investment. Besides Virgin Group are always taking punts on radical tech, it's almost always a passion project linked to Branson.

Imagine folks like V.Narayan or Jeroen who are more familiar with the civil air sector would be able to shed light on what these 'orders' are in real terms.

It's not confirmed but I am 90% sure that it would be Rolls-Royce.

Yeah iirc GE had an engine design in development for Aerion but they cancelled it a few years ago. If GE pulled out of developing it, I'm highly skeptical of RR making good of it given they have much more pressing issues with the bread and butter of their business. They need to get around to sorting the issues with the Trent series (pretty sure they've been getting hammered by customers and losing market share to Pratt & Whitney and GE). But, granted RR are the only company that had a supersonic civil airplane engine.

Boom Overture won't have any afterburners

I mean this would Have to be a requirement for any customers/investors. With volatile and high fuel prices, instead of an afterburner you might as well cut out the middle man and just burn the cash instead.

That's the reason why they claim that their supersonic jets would run on 100% Sustainable Aviation Fuel, to reduce Carbon Footprint as much as possible.

Even with entirely sustainable aviation fuel, there's no putting lipstick on the pig that will be the carbon footprint of this aircraft. People have to simply admit that supersonic passenger travel is driven by nostalgia more than anything. You have to remember that the vision of an all supersonic civil air transport was envisioned prior to the OPEC oil crisis and fuel shocks. Boeing for eg was all in before the they along with the rest of the industry recognised that the ability to transport large numbers of passengers in one go, as represented by the 747, was the future. Concorde only came to fruition you have to remember because it was a prestige project and hence a matter of pride for the British and French govt's to showcase the fact that their aerospace sectors could produce workable aircraft at the very bleeding edge. As such it had access to comparatively much more public sector funding and I worry that in the case of Boom and suchlike, especially now that at least in the US, you're entering an inflationary period with higher interest rates etc, investor sentiment is going to veer away from taking a punt on pie in the sky propositions like a modern supersonic airliner. The cautionary tale of Aerion simply tells me that it's highly likely the finances of start ups such as Boom are highly precarious and they'll need a steady influx of cash if they want to not only scale up their demonstrator but clear the long regulatory process and all the hurdles that will entail.

Sorry to be all morose about it but I think it would be good to temper expectations. I think if anything, the post COVID civil air transport landscape has taught us that the future lies with incredibly efficient products like the A220 that enable operators much more flexibility with their route planning and managing capacity factors. I guess all we can do is wait and see how Boom fares, they're certainly making the most noise in this niche sector (guess they have to in order to generate interest and hopefully money in investment rounds).

I don't want to dampen enthusiasm but for those who would like to have a supersonic air travel future again, so for you I say, look to NASA's QueSST programme. That's going to be the key I strongly feel. If they're successful, and overland routes become legally feasible, it's all fair game then if the bean counters at the airlines can make it work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRdKx4X0-ak

Want to leave readers with some excellent videos that give a good primer on the issues I've discussed above:

A primer on where things stand currently

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4p0fRlCHYyg

Concorde, the one we all know and love despite its flaws

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFBvPue70l8&t=299s

Concordski - the Tu-144, technically the first supersonic passenger aircraft

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFWbuKr5-I8

& finally, Boeing's aborted effort at a Concorde competitor and it's story

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y91Zr480Tn4

[thehighwayman]

I am not a pessimist and really want Boom Supersonic to succeed but this is a brave decision by American Airlines given that they don't even have a flying prototype yet. Many companies have floated such designs in the past but none have taken off (pun intended) sadly. Even when the plane materializes, they still cannot overcome one of biggest problem of supersonic planes - the sonic boom.

To that effect, NASA is working on a design that will eliminate this problem (link).

Do think that the world of aviation took a step backwards when the Concorde's were retired from service. Hoping this will revolutionize the way we fly forever.

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by ajayc123

Just curious, would these planes require special runways? Or are our current runways in India ready to land these planes?

No, that would defeat the whole purpose. These planes will require the usual airport infrastructure. They are going for a different fuel type, but by the time this plane will fly commercially, end of the decades at the earliest, that is likely to be applicable to many other aircraft types too.

These planes fly much higher than regular commercial planes, which is also handy from an air traffic control and traffic separation point of view.

Contrary to what many people think, it is not unusual at all for airlines to sign up to a new type of plane, without having a single prototype available. The sort of contracts they enter into have detailed specification on what the ultimate plane needs to be capable off. E.g. speed, pay load, range, fuel efficiency and hundreds of other details.

It is encouraging to see this being backed by major carriers. Although, I would expect their financial risk is probably relative low, if the plane is not delivered. If you read carefully you will see they expect commercial type rated version to be available by the end of the decade. Those sort of prediction tend to be on the optimistic side. We will see, I wonder if the contracts have penalties for late delivery?

Jeroen

[ToThePoint]

I think these 'orders' are nothing but kind of funding for the start up. Start ups can move quickly being lean and if they come up with a viable concept, that's when they get absorbed by the big fish.

The noise helps them stay in news and gather more interest and inturn funding so the R&D can progress for longer without shutting shop. IMO, 25-26 will be POC stage at best and if this materializes, we might be able to see actual planes in beginning of next decade.

[V.Narayan]

In my opinion completely impractical in terms of sonic booms over land routes, fuel burn, and the sheer maintenance required by any supersonic aircraft in comparison to subsonic ones. The technology to design a supersonic passenger liner or business jet have existed for 50 years and there is a reason it has not been attempted after the Concorde and Tupolev Tu-144. Travel time is not just the time from take-off to landing it also includes the significant time spent in check-in/baggage collection, security, immigration at both ends and the time in advance you need to reach airports etc. Keeping all that in mind a London-New York trip is a a minimum 2.5 hours + 8 hours + 1 hour = 11.5 hours. the Concorde reduced that by about 4.5 hours to 7 hours.

The effort and cost of maintenance of a supersonic is degrees ahead of that of a commercial subsonic. It is like maintaining a Formula F1 being driven every morning on normal roads versus a rugged Tata 407.

Affordable, sustainable, easily maintainable, commercially viable air travel speed at 500 to 525 knots (~926 to 972 kmph) in my view has reached its apogee for the time being till some dramatic change in technology comes about that does not burn fossil fuels (hydrogen with its many problems?).

Fuel burn of a Boeing 777 carrying 301 pax over a 5000 kms route = 2.9 litres / 100 kms or ~34 kms/litre

Fuel burn of the Concorde carrying 100 px over a 5000 kms route = 16.7 litres/100 kms or ~ 6 kms/litre