[RS_DEL]

Originally Posted by n:CorE

Environment related scams served on the platter for the Indian politicians now. Electric cars are useless IMO. You need to charge up every 500 yards for a minimum of 4 hours, there is no decently possible range let alone performance. Yes, there is a lot of torque generated but to what extent, how usable is that. The electric car is just not ready yet. As long as they are going to use batteries to power cars its just not going to work, the Fisker Karma is still usuable in the real world but as we know it. We drive, we run out of fuel, we fill it up and drive some more. We cannot have a car that runs for a little bit and then stay to charge it up for 6 hours.

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That is one broad generalisation without most probably the knowledge of how many diy enthusiasts have done ev converts and are using them as their daily drivers. A web search should prove quite educative , if you are willing to take the trouble that is.

[DReddy]

Originally Posted by RS_DEL

That is one broad generalisation without most probably the knowledge of how many diy enthusiasts have done ev converts and are using them as their daily drivers. A web search should prove quite educative , if you are willing to take the trouble that is.

Absolutely, I completely agree with you. The people at topgear tell us just what we want to listen to. People who take the pains to read through this thread and make their comments should brush up on some facts before writing off something. There are hundreds of happy REVA owners. The only reason why most people who were initially interested turned away was due to the initial cost and it being a twk seater for all practical purposes.
Electric cars are only as good as the battery technology is. The battery technology in our electronic devices like cell phones and laptops grew by leaps and bounds because we dint find an alternative to it. If a small 3 cc engine were powering the device we might have happily used it. Someone decided to use batteries on the very first one and it stuck on.
If one is really concerned about the improvement of a certain product, buy it, use it and give constructive criticism to the manufacturer. That is the ideal way to promote it. This is the kind of attitude shown by lovers of apple products, they dont mind shelling a premium price for it and the reason why the company churns out such high quality products.

[samarjitdhar]

Originally Posted by ra'ul M

Indian government is planning to implement a first world scheme with third world infrastructure!

A quote that I wanted to share:
'A developed country is not the one where the poor drive around in cars, but the one where the rich use public transport.'

I kind of agree. No doubt green technologies have a significant impact towards the betterment of the quality of air but in India a lot will be served if this Rs 14000 crores is diligently spent on public infrastructure and transportation. Given the track record of our government something as complex as these green technology infrastructures will have them in sixes and sevens in no time. Ergo they cannot even implement the conditional access system using digital television in just the four metros and have to postpone the deadline every time. There is little doubt that very soon a major part of this huge investment in case it even materializes will have to be written off as losses.

An efficient, comfortable and state of the art public transportation system in A and B tier cities will greatly reduce the need of using cars for daily commutes. Immediate upsides are swift reduction of pollution, usage of fossil fuels start coming down and the deficit starts getting addressed automatically. This is much easier to implement compared to say these kind of plans which won't even start producing any real results till at least 4/5 years have passed if not more. Investing in infrastructure and public transportation is a much better option. But then some of us tend to hate these forms of collectivism .

Of course the question remains when the government is supposedly running a hand to mouth balance sheet, where is the dough for any of these plans .

[chennai-indian]

Instead of spending all this money on electric vehicle infrastructure (whatever that means) spend the money on:

1. Providing safe and comfortable public transport

2. Road infrastructure

and promote electric and other "green" vehicles by reducing taxes on electric and hybrid cars.

If the aim is to reduce dependence on fossil fuels, just by improving public transport, more or less will be achieve the goal. Give me safe, clean and efficient public transport and I promise not to use my car for my office commute.

[RS_DEL]

Originally Posted by chennai-indian

Instead of spending all this money on electric vehicle infrastructure (whatever that means) spend the money on:
efficient public transport and I promise not to use my car for my office commute.

Exactly. That is the bane of of all urban/suburban dwellers in India. A pathetic state of affairs vis-a-vis public transport. Given the fuel prices prevailing today and the mind boggling levels of traffic in all the metros , most folks would immediately jump to public transport for their daily commutes, if a quality option was provided to them.

[dhuli]

Looks like "Roti Kapda Aur Makaan" (food, clothing, shelter) is being transformed to "Roti Kapda Aur Gaadi" to electrify voting franchisees with a new India Shining spin. Only this time the shine will be from headlights, I wonder! More seriously, without a plan to generate clean electricity first (over dependence on Coal based thermal power plants), how does one improve the scenario!

Also, I strongly agree with @RS_DEL about better battery tech like Lithium Polymer, and remove polluting, Lead Acid stuff, which are inefficient. There are to be so many surrounding policies and research investments to be done before this becomes the future of transport in India. When will we get there, I wonder again!

More likely private investments and private enterprise research will get us there. Apparently, a new launch from Reva is in the pipeline (in months), I hear!

[DReddy]

Originally Posted by dhuli

Looks like "Roti Kapda Aur Makaan" (food, clothing, shelter) is being transformed to "Roti Kapda Aur Gaadi" to electrify voting franchisees with a new India Shining spin. Only this time the shine will be from headlights, I wonder! More seriously, without a plan to generate clean electricity first (over dependence on Coal based thermal power plants), how does one improve the scenario!

Also, I strongly agree with @RS_DEL about better battery tech like Lithium Polymer, and remove polluting, Lead Acid stuff, which are inefficient. There are to be so many surrounding policies and research investments to be done before this becomes the future of transport in India. When will we get there, I wonder again!

More likely private investments and private enterprise research will get us there. Apparently, a new launch from Reva is in the pipeline (in months), I hear!

Scams are boun to happen in any goverment initiative, be it providing subsidies to electric vehicles or providing good quality public transport. We even managed to create a scam out of fodder! I guess they would lean more towards the latter if it were only about the money that could be laundered. Nevertheless, I strongly support the need for efficient public transport systems in all major cities.

Hand on heart how many of us would completely stop driving/buying personal transport if there indeed was an efficient public transport system. Maybe we will for daily commuting purposes, but I dont think that alone will suffice. Given our ever increasing urban population and the pace at which mega public works happen, when every city would get a metro like delhi would it really be enough? If it was enough why do people still drive cars in the cities of the first world?

I agree with the idea that better technology should come from the private sector. Infact, manufacturers like maruti and tata have already display few hybrid models at the auto expo. It just has to get enough public acceptance for them to put it into production.

[RS_DEL]

Originally Posted by carboy

In other news, Toyota drops plan for electric cars
I think the Indian Govt is inspired by the Environment related Scams of the Obama Govt (eg. http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics...yndra-scandal/) and trying to duplicate them here.



What's the problem with the Petrol and Diesel sold here?

I will just respond to your comment about the electric vehicles.

Toyota is NOT the final arbiter of technological developments in the automotive industry. Yes, they make very reliable vehicles that last a long time and give near trouble free service. However development of new technologies, path breaking work is certainly not their forte. Case in point the engine technologies pioneered by VAG i.e. TSI. So kindly do not think this is something that is "make or break" for electric vehicle tech.

When you refer to Fiskar that company look like it is more into doling out equity to VCs' than manufacturing cars.

There are enough and more tinkerers/diy types who have electric vehicles up and running in the U.S. and Europe. I have posted one such link of a chap who has converted a VW Passat and uses it as daily driver. He is one of the many who do this. Here is the Link to this gentleman's website.

[ST7677]

It would help much more if government can reduce build up at traffic lights - reducing fuel consumption and also cut atrocious excise duty on import of hybrid vehicles.

[SedatedDrive]

One day, we will run out of crude oil. It would be better if we and our Government is prepared for it. I see this as a positive step in the right direction.

Please do not respond to every government decision with pessimism. Corruption is a social issue widely discussed on this forum in many threads. I suggest we limit this thread discussion to technicalities and operational requirements of EV infrastructure.

[acroback]

Why doesn't govt abolish import duties on Hybrids?
It can be the first step in the right direction.

It is high time we accept that Hybrid vehicles are the way ahead for us. Practical and sensible.
Complete electric vehicles are not practical.

[DReddy]

Originally Posted by acroback

Why doesn't govt abolish import duties on Hybrids?
It can be the first step in the right direction.

It is high time we accept that Hybrid vehicles are the way ahead for us. Practical and sensible.
Complete electric vehicles are not practical.

Exactly, this is what I was talking about earlier. Hybrids themselves are not a permanent solution but a step in the direction of achieving non-dependence on fossil fuels.

I have nothing against the IC engine, infact I love every bit about it and that is what made me an automobile engineer today. It is just that the fuel itself is too precious to use for mundane commuting needs, and it is time we found a cleaner alternative to get around.

There must come a day when we use IC engine powered machines just for the joy of driving and clean electricity powered ones for the rest of the commuting needs. I am sure that any bhpian would echo my thoughts in this regard.

These things can only happen if we demand that such technology should be made available. If anyone understands and cares about automotive industry in the country, it has to have bhpians in the lead.

I completely agree with you that this discussion should be limited to the technology related issues rather than the social implications. Even if a few misconceptions are cleared and a couple of bhpians are convinced about buying and supporting these vehicles, the purpose of this thread will be served.

[RS_DEL]

Originally Posted by DReddy

Exactly, this is what I was talking about earlier. Hybrids themselves are not a permanent solution but a step in the direction this regard.
misconceptions are cleared and a couple of bhpians are convinced about buying and supporting these vehicles, the purpose of this thread will be served.

That is a revelation indeed!!!!!

Maybe the naysayers should pay heed to the fact that an automotive engineer to boot is saying the ICE age (not a geographical reference) does not have solutions for our automotive future.

But then, proactive thinking is not the forte of the masses - and I am aware I will be flamed and that too with gusto for my indiscretion in making this remark. But then so be it.

[faustus77]

Hi everybody.
First and foremost the govenment should reduce the bottlenecks whether they are the toll plazas or the checkposts or the octroi points.
A truck driving,say from Bombay to Delhi has to face a lot of points where there speed reduces to a crawl.The overall average is less than 20 kmph.
Here is a link to the Times of India report on 31st may 2012.The headline states that India loses 60000 crores a year

http://articles.timesofindia.indiati...space-stoppage
Regards

[SedatedDrive]

Originally Posted by faustus77

Hi everybody.
First and foremost the govenment should reduce the bottlenecks whether they are the toll plazas or the checkposts or the octroi points.
A truck driving,say from Bombay to Delhi has to face a lot of points where there speed reduces to a crawl.The overall average is less than 20 kmph.
Here is a link to the Times of India report on 31st may 2012.The headline states that India loses 60000 crores a year

http://articles.timesofindia.indiati...space-stoppage
Regards

This a different problem and slightly OT. But doing away with toll booths is not the solution. It actually removes return of investment or income to maintain the infrastructure or build new ones. An actual solution would be use of photo magnetic IDs affixed to vehicles like this.