[RahulNagaraj]

With fuel prices increasing ever so steadily, it makes sense to shift to electric vehicles. However, with EVs still facing their own set of problems like charging infrastructure and range anxiety, many customers still seem to be on the fence.

A recent survey in the USA confirmed that if the fuel prices continue to increase at the current rate it could lead to faster adoption of EVs.



However, the survey more specifically asked its participants as to what the price point would be, post which they would become more willing to consider purchasing EVs.



According to the results, 26% of the participants agreed to $4 per gallon of fuel being the cut off price. This number though doubled to 57% when fuel prices were increased to $5 per gallon.



The survey also stated that the rising fuel prices would be especially influential on people who are already considering the purchase of an electric vehicle. A separate graph showed that 54% of participants who are 'on-the-fence' would own an EV in the next decade if the fuel prices were to reach $5 per gallon.

Prices of both petrol and diesel in the USA are currently a little over $3 per gallon.

Source: CarGurus

Link to Team-BHP news

[prajwalmr62]

oh no!

Our government will now justify the fuel price taxes as the pioneering move to improve EV sales.

[Turbohead]

Originally Posted by prajwalmr62

oh no!

Our government will now justify the fuel price taxes as the pioneering move to improve EV sales.

Not only will claim the credit for pushing EVs, they'll also increases taxes on electricity to bring in the dough. The only thing that's constant with the govt is it's unquenchable thirst for taxes.

I wonder how OPEC will respond to this- increase supply to reduce further price rise and maintain demand or let prices rise as much as possible to extract every penny they can since EVs are deemed to be the future.

Off topic but that red abomination in the picture is absolutely repulsive.

[AZT]

I think we need a small disclaimer next to the $5 a gallon price *Assuming 500 kms on a single charge and charging infra every available on all highways*

The US is pretty much there on the infra side so there's that.

[jithin23]

Heck, we're already paying $5 a gallon and more than $5 a gallon for petrol in some states of India. Diesel is also getting closer to Rs 90 ($1.2) Fuel prices directly contribute to the cost of commodities.

Though our choices are very limited in terms of EV due to range and budget constraints and of course taxes!

Hope a major shift happens soon and if all items are transported through an EV, that's a win-win.

Only question is how will the batteries be recycled?

[Indian2003]

5 dollars will be a dream for me. I pay $7,50 a gallon and if the so called environmentalists get their way, will be paying $9 dollars a gallon by the end of the year. It looks like it will come by the end of the year.

Norway has only .002% of the worlds population but the worlds highest taxes for consumers. VAT is 25% and 85% of the petrol and diesel price are taxes to the government.

They subsidize EVs with billions a year. Most of these EVs are owned by people as their second car which they drive wothout toll charges in cities to feel "clean".

These are the first people who cry when toll charges are applied to EVs to the tune of 10% compared to diesel and petrol cars.

[vredesbyrd]

I'll leave this here just in case some stupid idiot from the govt. or an environmentalist reads this:

[rahulskumar]

EV adoption will be directly proportional with charging infrastructure and cost of the vehicle. With rising fuel prices, people will multiple cars at home will start checking EV as an option, but for the masses who are buying their car for the first time, they will hardly check out EV's. I checked the current charging infrastructure in Kerala and Mumbai from Tata website and I am quite surprised to find out the manner in which the charging stations are spread out, people from these states can consider EV as an option. With petrol touching 100, I've dropped my plan to buy Compass ( its purely psychological reason) Moreover due to lockdown, I'm losing interest to drive cars and I do not even remember the last time I visited a petrol bunk

[ZenMaster]

Originally Posted by Turbohead

Not only will claim the credit for pushing EVs, they'll also increases taxes on electricity to bring in the dough. The only thing that's constant with the govt is it's unquenchable thirst for taxes.

I wonder how OPEC will respond to this- increase supply to reduce further price rise and maintain demand or let prices rise as much as possible to extract every penny they can since EVs are deemed to be the future.

Off topic but that red abomination in the picture is absolutely repulsive.

OPEC countries are diversifying and investing in other technologies/businesses to secure their future, while we are walking blind into unknown economic consequences encouraged by our stratospheric fuel prices, unemployment, loss of life, loss of business due to COVID and erratic decisions from a Bipolar Govt machinery which entrepreneurs and normal bussimessmen cannot predict.

I believe there will come a time soon, when we will all be driving boring Indian EVs in real life and will have to depends on Simulators or games to drive some IC cars and have the experience.

[RedTerrano]

Interesting poll results. Will OPEC countries drop their prices to kill the eVehicle industry (and later hike them)?

On the topic of green, though it is obvious eVehicles are less polluting at the tail pipe, I find very few people even consider the carbon footprint resulting from producing electricity (especially coal based generation). Has anyone done a study on this? How much electricity will be required to keep say 1,000,000 eVehicles running? Will there be any noticeable change in messing up the environment?

I understand certain countries (e.g. Germany) are heavily investing in Solar/Wind power. I think India also has taken baby steps in that direction. However, considering the red tape in our country, I suppose it will be decades before we can claim to have substantial green power.

Coincidently just the other day I read an article where solar panels are being installed on top of irrigation canals in India.
✓ Lessens losses due to evaporation
✓ No additional land required for installation
✓ Clean energy


I hope, GoI does a similar thing on highways.
Then, all of us can drive in the shade. That would mean less A/c resulting in better FE.
Overall, a huge win.

[carthick1000]

Originally Posted by RedTerrano

On the topic of green, though it is obvious eVehicles are less polluting at the tail pipe, I find very few people even consider the carbon footprint resulting from producing electricity (especially coal based generation). Has anyone done a study on this? How much electricity will be required to keep say 1,000,000 eVehicles running? Will there be any noticeable change in messing up the environment?

May be you should check this out:

https://youtu.be/mk-LnUYEXuM

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by vredesbyrd

I'll leave this here just in case some stupid idiot from the govt. or an environmentalist reads this:

Attachment 2159973

As much stupid they may seem, they do not consider personal opinions(from 2008) of random people on internet. Battery factories are coming in every continent, GM, Ford, Tesla, LG and many battery companies are building their factories in US or Europe.

Originally Posted by RedTerrano

On the topic of green, though it is obvious eVehicles are less polluting at the tail pipe, I find very few people even consider the carbon footprint resulting from producing electricity (especially coal based generation). Has anyone done a study on this? How much electricity will be required to keep say 1,000,000 eVehicles running? Will there be any noticeable change in messing up the environment?

I understand certain countries (e.g. Germany) are heavily investing in Solar/Wind power. I think India also has taken baby steps in that direction. However, considering the red tape in our country, I suppose it will be decades before we can claim to have substantial green power.

The whole world economy is moving towards zero emissions, EVs are part of the solution, the other items are renewable electricity, zero emissions from industry(making of steel, aluminium etc). We will definitely move to renewable energy, recent solar energy prices have come to 0.78rs/kWh, existing coal plants ( forget about new) cannot compete at these prices with solar or wind.

The problem with ICE cars are, it is far more difficult and costlier to make the drilling, refining of oil and the cars exhaust zero emissions, we need to largely depend on Carbon capture tech , which is still in nascent stages of development.

EVs are greener than ICE even if they are run on largely coal based grid, also remember that you can run EVs from your home solar energy, and it is cleaner to run a Nexon EV of 2020 in 2025 as the grid becomes cleaner. I do not understand what you meant by 'messing up the environment', if the global warming is happening at this rate, the whole of bangladesh will be under sea in another 30 years, imagine we feeding 20 crore refugees. The numerous floods we are seeing and 80% of immature deaths linked to the pollution are the direct result of messing with the environment, are these not good reasons.

[agrawalyash11]

Originally Posted by vredesbyrd

I'll leave this here just in case some stupid idiot from the govt. or an environmentalist reads this:

Attachment 2159973

What do you mean by this?

A random screenshot cannot be considered as facts.

The study which claimed an ev is cleaner than a petrol car only after 50000 Miles was bogus and funded by Aston Martin. The study co-commissioned by the company that cast doubt on the green credentials of electric vehicles was found to have been attributed to a PR company registered to the wife of a director at the luxury carmaker. - The Guardian https://www.theguardian.com/business...-vehicle-study

The study, utilizing marketing tactics, covers internal combustion engine (ICE) emissions, EV emissions, and biofuel emissions while underestimating ICE emissions by a bit less than 50% by “substituting reality with laboratory tests and forgetting fuel production.” - Auke Hoekstra
https://t.co/eTFclCVBlZ

He claims that using a vehicle like Polestar 2 as a reference, it becomes cleaner than a volvo XC40 not after 78000 km but 25000 km using UK Electircity mix.

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attac...1&d=1621843924

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EoNtuXfX...jpg&name=large
The same graph can be viewed using the twitter thread link linked above. Kindly expand the thread to look at the full discussion.

Using the same graph as a reference and comparing the XC40 Actual graph with Global Electricity Mix (closer to India's Electricity mix i.e. 63% production of electricity using fossil fuels), the break even point is still about 40000km.

This data is still bound to improve as we shift more and more to renewable energy sources.

While I do not condone the harmful mining practices of lithium, I still think a shift towards EVs is a step in the right direction while we research and invest towards cleaner ways of generating electricity and mining raw materials.

[SASproject]

Originally Posted by vredesbyrd

I'll leave this here just in case some stupid idiot from the govt. or an environmentalist reads this:

Attachment 2159973

IC engine automotive supply chains are equally complex if not worse.

Plus I am guessing extracting and shipping all the fossil fuels from the middle east to the rest of the world isn't exactly the model efficiency either right?

In terms of the main topic at hand though, I have clearly seen this play out in my circle.

- Most of the people I know are in tech in the bay area and typically bought the traditional German luxury cars in the past - Mercedes, Audi, BMW, etc. with some Range Rover, Maseratis, etc. thrown in.
- With these cars you can expect a real world efficiency of anywhere from 13-17 miles per gallon.
- At an average price of $4.5 per gallon and driving about 1000 miles a month you typically spent $300 on fuel every month.
- Most folks realized they could get a model 3 for a price similar to the Germans and save that $300 a month or they could use that and buy a higher end vehicle like the Model S or Model X instead.

Because of this I have seen that the proportion of non Tesla luxury cars went from maybe 80% of my circle to 30% of my circle. And its likely to go down even further with more compelling EVs coming to the market in the near future.

I do not have the specific numbers but I am guessing it the average person in India drives 1000 Kms per month and gets an average of 12kmpl, that's about Rs. 7,500 a month (assuming cost of Rs 90/litre). People would probably be happy to add that in EMI and buy a slightly more expensive car or pay a slight premium and save some money every month.

Not a bad deal at all.

[Living2Drive]

Venting my sorrow here. Request to delete if its inappropriate.
Considering the fuel cost and my medical condition prohibiting usage of 2 wheeler, I had planned to get a small budget EV and charge with my existing solar panel, hoping my regular city runs would be covered with this.
Dividing the roof space equally among all the houses, the 8 foot by 9 foot terrace space allotted to me in my apartment can accommodate only up to 1KV (320 watt x3) solar panel with the best possible dimensions I could source in and around Chennai, since there is surplus heat and light in the output is good.

For trial basis the Mahindra e2o P4 variant I borrowed from my friend, with all possible efforts I am not able to yield more than 85 kms per charge.
Averaging 8 ish hours of good solar output, it still takes to 3 days to charge just with solar.

The electricity charges in Chennai are crazy, a nominal price up to 500 units of consumption (bi-monthly) and the cost multiplies to 3, 4 or 5 times depending on how much you consume beyond that.

Considering the efficiency of the e2o, I have to charge 3 times in 2 weeks (minus the charging time), 2 days of use and 3 days of charge. The calculated yearly average of total electricity cost will be equal to my present EB and fuel bill put together. Till the fuel price crosses 125 per ltr i'll I wont save with EV, hoping TNEB does not raise their tariffs. Else i'll be under loss again.

Guess my dream of affordable local transport will continue to be a dream I guess.
Also made me realize that metros are running out of roof space too.