[ashwin489]

Originally Posted by Nitrous Power

Some high end cars have auto hold feature where upon activated, brake will be applied on its own and you just press accelerator once you want to move forward.

My Sonata does the exact opposite. In D-mode, its always on the move when the brake is not pressed. I just have to take my foot off the brake for the car to move and I love that especially in B2B traffic.

[greenhorn]

three reasons
1. like to be in absolute control - clutch plays a huge part
2. tried an automatic (ImmortalZ knows the story) and didnt quite work out
3. not worth it imo. I dont do much city traffic

[Nitrous Power]

Originally Posted by ashwin489

My Sonata does the exact opposite. In D-mode, its always on the move when the brake is not pressed. I just have to take my foot off the brake for the car to move and I love that especially in B2B traffic.

Off topic but let me explain: Sonata does not have auto hold feature and that's how most basic automatics are. What I said was that some cars have auto break hold function that keeps the break pressed when activated. So when at red light, you just have to hit break, come to complete standstill, activate Auto Hold and take the foot off break. Once ready to move, just press accelerator little bit and auto hold is deactivated.

[civic-sense]

I would like to know, how many of the so-called manual lovers would still stay likewise if the manuals cost 1L more than the automatics and gave 10% less mileage? The same people would say: "Why should I pay 1L more just to move a stick up and down?". Point is, most people buy manuals because it is cheaper and give better FE.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by civic-sense

I would like to know, how many of the so-called manual lovers would still stay likewise if the manuals cost 1L more than the automatics and gave 10% less mileage? The same people would say: "Why should I pay 1L more just to move a stick up and down?". Point is, most people buy manuals because it is cheaper and give better FE.

Very true. Also, this thread appears to have been hijacked by some die-hard MT lovers whose posts appear to be nearly ridiculing AT cars. And many seem to be commenting without even driving one.

[Hayek]

Originally Posted by .anshuman

Most people i meet have a mind block against the Automatics. Once they spend some time with a good Automatic, they discover what all they have been missing. Believe me the conversion ratio is very very high. It's like saying i hate Bugatti Veyron!! How can this be possible? I have never spent time with one.

Originally Posted by noopster

GTO missed one reason: "Because I am stupid and can't see a good value proposition if it came and bit me in the hindquarters"
I sincerely think Indians hate ATs for all the wrong reasons. I know people who are AWFUL drivers who think they are better than me just because they drive a manual. Do I get all offended and try to prove 'em wrong? Hell no! I just hand 'em the keys to my baby. In 10 minutes of peak suburban city traffic they're blubbering on about how much they love the fact they don't have to keep pressing the clutch all the time. Battle won!

Well said. I was shocked to see "I love manuals" dominate the poll, and went through the whole thread to find a very large proportion of these respondents saying that they love manuals without having ever driven an automatic. Frankly in Indian traffic conditions, automatics are a must for anyone who drives himself. I have driven over 200,000 km in various cars, 90% of which has been in manuals. But after having gotten used to my AT Superb, I can state without hesitation that I never will want to drive a manual again. ( I may be forced to buy one though, to replace my Getz, due to the lack of a Jazz auto, but that's another story).

While buying my Superb (my first automatic), I too was taken in by the manual = fun to drive logic, and the presence of paddle shifts + tiptronic certainly helped tilt the Superb vs Accord battle in its favour. But in over 16,000 kms since then, I have used the paddle shifts may be 5 times, and never used the tiptronic. The intelligence in the DSG gearbox clearly senses what I want to do from what my right foot is doing, and delivers the power I need when I need it. Frankly, even S mode is not really needed. My recent experience testing the C 250 CDi only confirmed this view.

Would it be very different in a low end automatic? Perhaps. But if that's the case, the answer to be chosen is "A good automatic is not available in my segment", not "Automatics are not fun to drive"

[Guna]

Originally Posted by Hayek

Well said. I was shocked to see "I love manuals" dominate the poll, and went through the whole thread to find a very large proportion of these respondents saying that they love manuals without having ever driven an automatic.

Those who are used to the manuals may not like the AT if they just drive it once or even occasionally. There is a 'muscle memory' at work when you drive a manual, and it is common for new AT drivers to search for a clutch and a gear lever out of habit/reflex.
Another factor is that drivers have a good mental mapping of what power/ability is available in each gear and this becomes somewhat fuzzy/non-transparent in an AT.
IMO, driving an AT requires a slightly different approach and perspective to enjoy it.

[nukeblitz]

To those people who say this thread has been hijacked by die hard manual fans.

I am one of those. Yet, like I said in my previous post, I will make it clear that I have nothing against automatics or those who drive them. In fact, I do recommend them to people who I think would like them better, which is actually quite a lot of people.

But on a personal level, I simply don't like them. Whether it's a traditional planetary gearbox, dual clutch automated manual, cvt, with or without paddle shifts or a tiptonic mode. The clutch is the most important pedal for me. It keeps me engaged in the drive and that's something I personally value, even after driving for extended periods in both hyderabad and bangalore and multiple frequent trips between mysore and hyderabad, in a car with a heavy clutch like my vista tdi. It's the same reason I will always pick a car with a heavier hydraulic steering over a car with a car with a light, exceptionally accurate electric steeting but with little feedback. This is in spite of the fact that a.dual clutch gearbox with manually shiftable gears will give better performance and possibly better fuel economy. And I will pick a car with hydraulic steering even though I know that electric power steering cars give better fuel economy give better fuel economy.

But do note that this is my personal opinion. For the vast majority of people, automatics are definitely a better option. The only thing that's slowing down their adoption is their lack of availability. However, the poll, by its very nature, is asking for a personal opinion and I have given mine. This is, after all, a community of car enthusiasts. So, it doesn't surprise me that a large number of people voted for "i love manuals". It's not necessarily representative of the general public. For example, run a poll asking "is the tachometer useful" and compare those results with here and those from poll from the general public.

And yes, I would still buy a manual even if they cost 1 lakh more and have lesser fuel economy than a modern automatic. But that would be my personal choice. Nothing more nothing less

PS please, I don't want to start a flame war or anything of that sorts. I just felt it was unfair to say that the thread was hijacked or that it was unfair to imply that those who preferred manuals were giving a biased opinion. Factual errors may and should be corrected but opinions, are by their very nature may not be very agreeable. I assumed that a forum is where everyone gives their opinion with no judgement on someone else's opinion unless their was a factual error is present.

PS2 note to mods. Please delete this post right away if this post is against the rules or otherwise detrimental to the general health of the forum. Thank you.

[samigo]

Originally Posted by abhjain

Agreed, however how often do we really take our cars on the highways? I am also a fan of manual transmission however bangalore traffic has made me think otherwise.

My driving is more on the highways and I drive Pune-Mumbai on weekends. I love manual shifting anytime when zipping through the Khandala ghat.

Though, I agree with you on AT when it comes to traffic choke up. But you should be fine. You have Swift with one of the best and precisely smooth gear shifts. I'm having hard time with my new Punto with gear shifts.

Regards,
Sameer.

[Tommie]

Originally Posted by civic-sense

I would like to know, how many of the so-called manual lovers would still stay likewise if the manuals cost 1L more than the automatics and gave 10% less mileage? The same people would say: "Why should I pay 1L more just to move a stick up and down?". Point is, most people buy manuals because it is cheaper and give better FE.

+1

As a matter of fact, the AT version is only 50K more than the MT for small cars and the fuel average is nearly 30% lesser for small petrol AT cars in comparison to the MT. See my blog which has the detailed analysis.

If the mass public prefered power & MT Vs comfort & fuel average, then most of them would have bought Polo 1.6 or Palio 1.6 petrol versions.

Originally Posted by Tommie

I have done an independent market research for the diesel AT version. If anyone from automobile manufacturer is interested, they may send me a personal message to get the information.

The summary of the survey results are published on my blog

[pgsagar]

Trouble is with the title of the thread itself. It says, "why you don't buy an AT?" Not, "why you buy an AT?" So, this thread is not the place for AT lovers. They need to start a new thread which says, "why I bought AT?".

[n:CorE]

Okay I have caught up with this thread a little late. So I haven't yet gone over all the posts.

But I'd like to share the scenario in my household with the A/T's

The last time there was a M/T sedan at my place was a 2005 Honda City which was replaced by an A/T Civic in 2007 which I currently drive.

Reason: First C+ segment sedan to offer Paddle Shifts as a part of the Automatic, which gave us the feeling that it could replicate/fulfill the requirement of personal control over gear shifts while driving enthusiastically. Revolutionary looks, way ahead of its time. All the Pro's of the A/T box put a big smile on dad's face as we had a 2004 Corolla A/T with which he was just too happy. There has been more of A/T history in the family, we've had the Toyota Corsa *jap import* which was A/T way back in '99.

We've always have had an MUV for weekend trips to our Panchgani bungalow. List starts of with a Qualis, 2x Innova's (Currently in the garage: The 2009 mildly facelifted innova)

And thus was the death of the M/T in my household! Apart from our MUV (Innova now). All our other cars have always been A/T and its going to stay that way. Sisters & Mum just adore the automatics and cannot even think of rolling back to M/T.

Even if the enthusiast within me cries for a Manual. I am over powered by family for Automatics now and all I'm left with is my Innova to fulfill my manual desires which in the last word is 'slick' and that too will be gone for an A/T SUV soon too :(

Performance wise... The DSG's & the double-clutch systems are astonishing but you don't get the mechanical and immediate feel as the slick manual stick.

[architect]

I voted for "I love Manual transmissions". Have sat alongside AT drivers for hundreds of kilometers and always felt the urge to grab the stick and shift! This is especially in the hills.

That said, a short drive in .Anshuman's Laura DSG confirmed that this was the closest one could get to a manual, probably, but still not THE thing!

[blackasta]

According to the voting trend still now - 36 to 37% of customers opting for M/T would have opted for a A/T if it was available in their choice of car, and we all know maximum of these users talk about diesel cars as there is no diesel A/T available on the south side of 10 lakhs - is this enough of an eye opener for the auto industry for Diesel A/T hatches? Is anyone listening?

[jesal]

after the civic, im stuck with what car to buy in automatic, hopeless options in automatics. cruze in bombay costs 1725. i told them to buzz off. all these normal cars cost over double in india for nothing, only because people here have money and no brains.