Team-BHP - So, why don't you buy an Automatic?

Quote:

Originally Posted by condor (Post 3604968)

I think a mix of manual & AT would be the right spread. An AT hatch would be the right car for city driving & for the wife too. Parking, frequent gear changes etc - all get taken care of.

And you didn't mention inconvenience of two feet and three pedals which women often complain about. When I taught my wife to drive on an M800, she would often say why do these cars have 3 pedals when we only have two feet. Well, now with AT, she gets to use only one foot. Left hand and left foot resting all the way.

I always was averse to AT. Whenever I drove them I had this strange feeling that my mind and the car weren't in sync. That is I always was uneasy with them. Plus I didn't like the jerks of gear shifts. They were never at the time I would change the gears in MT :-). But since last 1 year I have been driving my X3. My first suv, first diesel and first automatic. The gear shift jerks aren't as prominent as in other cars thanks to the BMW engineering. But now am comfortable with ATs. But I still am not 100% in sync with the car especially during braking and accelerating again and with moments when the gear shifts aren't decisive both upwards and downwards due to traffics conditions. I guess I will be 100% with ATs with some more time with my car.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTO (Post 2582761)

Equally, I wouldn't mind an Automatic transmission as a local runabout. We use the Tata Indigo for that purpose. It's time to replace the Indigo and, unfortunately, there isn't any diesel automatic hatchback / sedan in the price range we are looking at. A 7 lakh rupee diesel AT would be just perfect for the local errands that the Indigo is used for. I even created a thread on why I think Tata is one of the few manufacturers who can bring a well-priced diesel Automatic to the market : Link to thread.

GTO, great prediction with launch of Zest Diesel AMT and probably the Bolt AMT which might come sometime in 2015 and TATA at the forefront of Diesel AMT.

I voted for "I dont like Automatics" based on my experience with Bikes (Manual gears with Auto-gears). I had not driven an automatic car yet, but am quite confident that it will not be to my liking. Probably spending enough miles on an automatic might change my preference.

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Originally Posted by tj123 (Post 3604892)

Resurrecting an old thread , I believe if we take a poll now the statistics would be different as the road condition, choice of model available, price and peoples exposure to automatics cars have changed the perception over time.

I agree, it might be a good time to do this poll again now with AMT's being the flavour of every budget carmaker.

Good that this thread came alive at the right time, that is when India started adapting to automatics. Now we have quite a few options of AT/AMT's across multiple segments most importantly with both diesel and petrol fuel options. To name few Alto, Celerio, i10, Brio, Zest, Xcent, Micra, Polo, City, Vento, Rapid etc. We were having very few options few years back and now AT's list is abundent clap:. I think both technology and maturity of Indian auto industry helped us to achieve this(affordable AT's/AMT's). Previous generations of AT's used to return very bad FE, but now with the advent of technology we have completely overcome this (example: DSG's gives equal or better FE than MT). Of course we need to improve on reliability front. Need of the AT's is imminent with ever growing traffic congestion (already pretty bad situation in metro's). The stress/pain (both mental and physical) I get by driving in a city like Bangalore for 4 hours(I know distance is immaterial here, still say 60 kms) is more than the stress I get for a day long highway drive. You can save quite a bit of energy by using AT, which can be utilized later at home or work :D

I have voted for "My next car will be AT". I think for city driving AT and for highway driving MT will be the best, this is what exactly offered by AMT. I drive my wife's Celerio over weekends and started liking it. Once you are used to those small jerks during the gearshifts, driving an AMT is pretty stress free.

MT all the way, my machine, my rules. I may want to drive at 70 in second gear just for the heck of it and would be disappointed if my machine decided that 4th is the smarter choice. Smart, I agree, but not my choice and I have every right to make my dumb choices on the machine I paid for. I consider the AT to be an annoying proactive patronizer, employee of the month - but should be fired for taking the fun off from the boss.

The pain of crawling in traffic is the price to pay for the thrill I seek. It makes no sense to whine over the inevitable. I cannot claim to love cycling and then gripe on how the legs hurts after a few kilometers on the road. So I am fine with the inconvenience to the legs in slow traffic, it will soon pass.

It is my personal choice and has no reflection on the AT's capabilities or advancements. I have driven the Impala, Charger, Mustang and the Malibu, all of them with excess 250 HP of power and goes awesome on the road. At 75 miles per hour on an incline, step on the pedal and the Impala effortlessly surges ahead to execute the overtaking. Sweet, there is no shortage of power, ever. At 75 kilometers per hour downshift to 4th, the humble Maruti Alto shudders ever so lightly and growls. Step on it and it growls even more, slingshots the lorry and returns to its labored grind on the road. Sweeter for me because I told it what it should do and how to do it, it did my bidding. When driving ATs I preferred using the paddle shifts with the ATs till it is time for cruise controls.

Oh yeah, it requires more skill to drive a stick shift. Not everyone can claim that they haven't stalled their vehicle in the last 25,000 km!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sun_king (Post 3605143)

MT all the way, my machine, my rules. I may want to drive at 70 in second gear just for the heck of it and would be disappointed if my machine decided that 4th is the smarter choice.

You can do all that, and much much more, with modern AT's which allow you to manually control the gearing once in a while (or all the while). With modern dual clutch boxes, you can make shifts way faster than what you could do manually. Automatics will allow you to reach the red-line in every gear, before they cut in to prevent engine damage.
What you say may have been appropriate a few years back, but not any longer. :)
Try it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by condor (Post 3605009)

Depends on how you practice. I have heard of people who do left foot braking in AT's .. but they drive AT's only

Yes, two pedals and two feet is the logic. I for one rely on the right foot only. Remember I have had an AT since 1999 and am on both AT cars for coming on the two years.

For me, it is MT all the way. Changing gears manually, for me is a part of driving. And a part of the pleasure of driving. Also, driving an MT in a correct gear in accordance to conditions around is a skill which differentiates drivers with different techniques. Good ones, despite clocking greater average speeds can still extract best possible FE from a manual car and vice versa is also possible.

MT makes a drive more involving and with a manual drivetrain, I feel that the communication is two way - between the driver and the car:) And to top it, if the car has a steering with a great feedback, then man, it is like talking to your car while driving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by roy_libran (Post 3605164)

Have done it! The cars I mentioned were 2013 models, not ancient yet by car aging standards.

Putting an AT in manual mode, using the paddles to go to 2nd and then redlining it is something different. You are actually converting the AT into a clutch-less manual and I am not sure if that configuration qualifies for Team AT. And we are not sure if we want it in Team MT either. For the sake of discussion, can we define AT in this context, as a machine that does not require driver input (other than throttle control) to shift gears? With that definition, does your statement still hold true?

For me, the Automatic with its Manual mode is akin to the DOS Command prompt in Windows. It is a confession that the AT leaves something to be desired!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sun_king (Post 3605211)

For the sake of discussion, can we define AT in this context, as a machine that does not require driver input (other than throttle control) to shift gears? With that definition, does your statement still hold true?

For me, the Automatic with its Manual mode is akin to the DOS Command prompt in Windows. It is a confession that the AT leaves something to be desired!

Hahaha, I veered off both, DOS and Windows, a long time back.
I am more of a Linux (Ubuntu and Arch), iOS and zOS guy. :)
Now, if you were to equate the 'AT with Manual' with the 'Terminal' in Linux, then it leaves absolutely nothing to be desired. It is the very best one can work with and you can control everything!

However, coming back to the definition of AT, I don't agree that the definition should be limited to the feature-set of the older boxes. When we discuss AT's we should do that w.r.t the current set of capabilities they offer. In that respect, I see the manual clutch as a legacy item, fit to be made redundant for most applications, as the AT boxes rightly do. With the modern boxes, the quicker shift times, driving comfort, lower fatigue, and clutch-less manual control (when desired) all add to the fun-to-drive factor, and not take away from it.