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-   -   Indian cars to avoid in the used market (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian-car-scene/234064-indian-cars-avoid-used-market-2.html)

Excellent thread Eightsix. Your views on less reliable Germans and super-reliable Innova/Fortuners are spot on. But, I would rather risk reliability and buy a used German than go anywhere near a used Fortuner (let's leave Innova to taxi folks) because of ridiculous prices they demand. Let those who buy, buy. I am sure by 2025 when we get somewhere with EVs, all this resale values will evaporate. It's better to buy a good car which failed in Indian market (plenty many), for a song, than run after these successful cars whose owners not only demand ridiculous amounts but also behave like they are doing you a favour selling you their car.

Which brings me to second part of your post. If it didn't sell well new, it won't sell well used? I don't think so. I would consider it wise to buy a failed cars such as Mitsubishis, Xtrails, Koleos etc. for a song and drive them into ground. You can buy them for as low as 2-3 lakh, drive for as long as they run and then drive them into river. I am all for either buying such 2-3 lakh beater cars or brand new. I can never spend 15-20 lakhs on a used car. A guy I know bought a used Q5 in July 2020 for 18 Lakh and is facing some issues. This particular car is not as pristine as it was passed off to be. Now he regrets why he didn't buy a brand new Creta diesel AT for the same price, with all goodies and a pano-roof.

But, yes, such Mitsubishis, Xtrails, Koleos should be bought as second car, in conjunction with a brand new premium hatch or sub-4 M SUV. Spend under 15 on a new car and pick one of these dirt cheap, for rough use.

There are two flop cars that I would have LOVED to buy used after they got killed but alas, I was a kid back then.

1. Baleno Altura
2. Octavia Combi

All premium or luxury products are avoidable. They usually have some new or premium feature that commands high price during its launch, but often these features are passed on soon to cheaper variants, deeming the premium models less premium.

ATs were premium till they became common-fare in budget cars; sun-roof is another such example.

With budget cars now being filled to the gills with tech, the scales have somewhat tilted against premium products.

Before I bought my Honda City 5th Gen, did a bit of shopping around for a used car. I gave up the search soon as I lack enough knowledge of cars in general. I did look through the TBHP threads and gained knowledge, but decided to stick with new cars.

I can think of a few items that should also be checked before buying a used car:

1. Cars with body/structure modifications. I think this sunroof/moon roof fitment aftermarket is a bad thing for safety.
2. I found many cars with no airbags, and other much needed safety equipment. IMHO these should be avoided as well
3. I was also advised by my FNG mechanic to avoid any AMT vehicles in the used market. Not sure if this is a big thing, but he was insistent that these vehicles have more niggles in general.

Regards,
lsjey

In KA I would say avoid 90% of the used cars. For one they are expensive with minimal depreciation and most of them are grabbed by dealers. It's really hard to find a direct seller. Unless you are buying a flop model or depreciation disaster models(ex:luxury petrol sedan/SUV) all other cars carry hefty price tag.

Regarding VAG, used Polo GT TSi prices have actually jumped now as enthusiasts prefer the DSG over the new torque converter. We were on the edge on whether we should sell my wife's GT TSi and get a new car but held on for a while. I was offered 6.5L for my 2016 GT TSI even before bargaining by the dealer where we were buying the new car from. So obviously there is a strong demand for this car still inspite of the age of the Polo platform.

I have almost zero experience as compared to other members here, but bought a 2007 honda civic at 70k in 2017-18, 2011 Laura tdi at 130k in 2019 for friends and a 2015 registered Innova at 150k kms for self use just 3-4 months back. In my view every car is worth it at a particular price. Mostly I look at interior bits and pieces, if lost or worn out can be a pain in behind to source and indicate heavy or careless usage by first owner. Mechanically there is nothing in India that can't be fixed, you just need to do some legwork or hire someone to do on behalf of you. My XUV's leather seats were cracked and cut in some places. I got quotes of around 15-20k for artificial leather seat covers. I got all the seats replaced at cost of 11k which included powered driver seat with all airbags intact and so on. I would not be averse to any car provided price is right. Kilometres, age doesn't matter. If not anything it'll be a learning experiencelol:

Interesting thread. Agree with the point on avoiding dealer demo cars. And avoiding the Fortuner and Innova used since they retain value just too well (the purpose of buying used is to benefit from depreciation on lightly run cars). However, disagree with the idea of avoiding VW group cars or cars that were not hits when new. The fact is that VW group cars (especially petrol automatics) are depreciation disasters. Which implies that you can buy one and keep a maintenance fund in place for much less than the cost of buying cars from a Hyundai or Maruti from a lower segment. And when they work, they are great to drive (which is why I am buying my third new VW group car). So for someone who has reasonable tolerance for maintenance costs, buying a VW group car with a full service history may make immense sense.

The same applies to less popular cars - you would probably get a Jeep Compass second hand for less than the price of a Hyundai Creta. Very good value for money indeed.

My first and only non negotiable filter has been - would not buy a car with anything amiss wrt documents. I don't even check out the car unless the above is in order.
Everything else can be fixed/replaced if you love the car.

The very reason these 2 cars demand high resale value is the reliability that is associated brand. They scream reliability.

The number of kms on the odo is relative for Innova and Fortuner. 100k kms on many brands may sound considerably higher, but for Toyota's its considered cute :D

As an overall proposition for the spec it offers, I agree it may feel pricey as a used buy. But for people seeking no nonsense reliable cars there are very few brands which can hold a candle to Innova and Fortuner

Very cool thread indeed, One of the big No No's for me while buying a used car is not buying cars from discontinued brands, e.g: Chevrolet, Opel. I remember when i was researching the chevrolet Captiva (they are very cheap in the market) and found out that the engine prematurely fails and likes to bomb itself near the 60k km mark. Parts are not readily available and it's a nightmare to work on. I steered away immediately. But some cars speak to the heart more than others and if something like that pops up, i am willing to ignore all the points above and will happily put myself into financial misery lol:.

A very interesting thread. Only difference is that your list of cars are the ones I look for in the used car market :D

Two points here
General reliability of VW group cars, for that matter other Germans too, are considered lower than Japanese. It is well understood in the market. You buy based on what you like in those cars. There is no denying that the germans are much better built, and more suited highway cars. Also, the segments they generally play are the luxury segments, which rubs into the lower end cars too.

Second point
VW and any other German cars have more pre-emptive warning lights than the Japanese or Koreans have. Those doesn't mean that the car cannot be driven. You need to understand what the warnings mean. It is like someone getting driving license without learning road signs, and saying there are too may signboards on the road, which prevents me driving!

Just a matter of individual choice, and the users need. The # 1 reason for me buying used is for driving pleasure!!- not reliability.

Let's face the facts. Reliability is often overhyped. It is not true that all VW cars are breaking down every few kms, and every Maruti cars can run indefinitely. If you are buying used, you should invest time to understand the car, it's weak points, and have the plan to support.
If one is risk averse, best option would be to buy new and get extended warranty.

I disagree. Hyundai parts support is pretty good. I'd say it's supply chain is better organised than even Maruti. They can source parts from Korea in reasonable timeframe, say 2 weeks.

These cars command high premium in used car market, not only because of reliability. Over the period of last decade, their new car prices have almost doubled, which is rubbing into used prices too. Also, these cars have a strong used market- as taxis, or boss cars in smaller towns


Totally agreed!! Hence my opening line.

Pre-worshipped cars coming on sale at a cheap price are rare. Most owners wont spend even the necessary amount of money to maintain the vehicle within manufacturer`s recommendation of wear and tear replacement, let alone any preventive maintenance.

Some 10K rupees later most barely adequately maintained vehicles can be made to look like a brand new vehicle from the exterior and interior perspective enough to convince the already bedazzled buyer who is getting a large luxury sedan \ premium SUV for the price of a Brezza!

Personally I'm okay to buy popular vehicles from popular brands that have good after sales support from OEM as well as aftermarket side , parts that are made in India which are readily available and it has to be within warranty.

Nice interesting thread, but instead of listing out the " Indian cars to avoid in the used market ", most BHPians had included the general checklist to be followed while getting a pre-owned car. Let's keep the general points minimalistic on this thread and list out the cars which need to be avoided while hunting in a used car market. This thread will hence help a lot of buyers to eliminate some of the cars straight up while looking for a pre-owned one.

My To-Be-Avoided List :
TUV300 AMT - Faulty Gearbox
Merc W203 - Notorious Kid
Chevrolet Cruze & Captiva - Part Availability
Tata Aria and M&M XUV500 (1st Gen) - Too many niggles
Nissan Teana / VW Phaeton - Super Expensive to maintain & lack of part availability
Ssangyong Rexton - Unreliable / Part availability
Some of the BMWs - (List out please!)
Renault Fluence - Failed Model & A.S.S Support not guaranteed
Lineas & Puntos - Not all of them are good.
Nissan Evalia/Ashok Leyland Stile - You all know why.


At the same time, there are some ' Good but Failed ' models like the Kicks, HEXA, Marazzo, Lodgy, Civic, Accord, BRV, G.Vitara, etc which might be a good bargain.

As a corollary (i.e. Indian cars NOT to miss in the used market), "great used cars" are ones which we know are appreciable in a certain way, but the general public may not give much weightage to. Say like a Tata Hexa, Mahindra Marazzo etc.

So don't drop such cars if you come across some gems at a great price and are going to use the car for 10 years. Its simply market perception that they're flop & thereby 'bad' cars.

Everyone knows Toyota as a simple workhorse. I avoid buying a used Toyota as sellers often demand a price as high as their purchase-price.

Recently came across the sale advt of 2nd owner of a 2016 Crysta 2.8G, driven 57,000kms, demanding 17Lakhs! (viz almost the same price as the cars original sale value when brand new!). OK, maybe taxi guys would bite, but I really dunno which self-respecting individual buyer would accept such deals. Toyotas may be reliable but they're certainly aren't a non-depreciable asset!

Another thing I have noticed about a few dealers selling used-Toyotas, is that they show undue attitude. Serious turn-off when some dealers seem to think the buyers are cold-calling them to sell a credit-card :eek:, including treating them like a strolling-D2D-salesman (after having visited them at an appointed time), whereas these buyers would actually be offering top-rupee given the plethora of other options for people willing to spend 20-22 Lakhs & above for a used car. No individual seller would behave like that, but some dealers definitely do.

IMO Diesel FIATs Can be a good buy because they're well equipped, built well, VERY serviceable (shared parts) & available at very good prices!