[Akshay1234]

Originally Posted by mobike008

Even in the US, there are tons of folks who ditched the M340i and switched to an X3M40i (Bimmer Blog has several such stories) and they find it more enjoyable as well as practical

1 CR OTR would be an ideal and awesome price for folks to enjoy this beast.

Firstly, there is no B58 40i.

If you were comparing it with an X5 50i (Naturally aspirated V8) then maybe, just maybe the buyer will be slightly confused.

My sister owns a BMW X5 50i ( V8 and Naturally Aspirated with 450 Horsepower) and I drive her car regularly and have done long distance trips as well (500 mile return trips).

It's EOL product. 2023 will be the final of GLC 43 AMG.

Yes the X3 M40i will be more practical, no doubt. But in terms of a driving experience I'm certain the 340i will be better. 1cr an ideal an awesome price? The X3M was launched for a tad bit more just a few years ago, at 1cr this will be overpriced.

The 40is are all B58s unless I'm mistaken, including the one in the X5 40i? Also the 50is you are speaking of are 4.4 N63 turbocharged V8s, the last BMW used NA V8s were in the E70 X5 and that was a 4.8l. And let me just say, a V8 is a V8.

I'm sure its gonna be a competent product, and I've got my eyes on the pricing since it would be a great replacement to the X3 30d which we've been using for a while. But if its a crore then it certainly makes sense to spend a bit more and get an X5 which would just give us so much more.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by Neelavi

Yes. The current GLC doesn’t make sense at this late stage. However the all new GLC has received far better reviews than current gen in terms of its drive quality. And the interior looks fab. Essentially most of the weaknesses of current gen GLC have been fixed. The 43 coupe is yet to reviewed but should hopefully be comparable to the 40i in terms of sportiness while offering a superior luxury experience.

Firstly, the EOL point made was specific to 43 AMG. Not the regular GLC.

Secondly, the video that you shared includes “Paid Promotion” as it says that right from the beginning.

Not sure if you have seen the video completely. The reviewer is smitten by the BMW X3 but, since the GLC is new model and he is forced to show that it’s almost on par with an X3 as it needs to come out as an unbiased review.

His conclusions- If you love to drive then get the X3 but, if you are technology baised then get the GLC. Is that even a proper conclusion? It reeks of paid promotion.

BMW X3 is the flagship (from volumes perspective) and bread and butter model for BMW in the US and they sell like crazy. Take a simple example of a regular X3 vs. GLC

X3 eats the GLC for lunch and dinner in sales. And, GLC sales have been dropping YoY.

Let’s not even compare the X3 M40i vs. the AMG 43 as it’s not even a fair competition.

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

Yes the X3 M40i will be more practical, no doubt. But in terms of a driving experience I'm certain the 340i will be better. 1cr an ideal an awesome price? The X3M was launched for a tad bit more just a few years ago, at 1cr this will be overpriced.

I will leave it for you to judge when you actually drive them both back to back.

I have several friends who own the M340i and a couple of them switched to X3M40i. Also, do take a look at BMW blogs and you will see this saga continues with owners in the US.

As for pricing. If the M340i has lot of takers for 82 Lakhs, why would BMW settle for anything less than 1 CR for the SUV version? India has lot of rich people and they would happily pay that money. The trick is to get them to test drive it.

An important point, Similar to global choices, India has jumped on to the SUV bandwagon. Sedans will slowly get phased out in next decade or so. Sad but, it's a fact.

Let’s not even bring X3M into the picture. It sells a few handful in US and might be same case in India. It’s not a practical car for daily use and is considered by hard core purists.

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

The 40is are all B58s unless I'm mistaken, including the one in the X5 40i? Also the 50is you are speaking of are 4.4 N63 turbocharged V8s, the last BMW used NA V8s were in the E70 X5 and that was a 4.8l. And let me just say, a V8 is a V8.

My bad. Yes, what you say is correct. 40i in X5 is the B58 engine. Damn, they stuffed this absolutely amazing engine into so many applications, I lost track. I love this engine so much that I don't plan to sell this for a few years (even though there is an itch to upgrade since I am approaching the 3-year mark in Jan 2024).

X3 30i is the regular 4 cylinder regular engine.

But, due to the large size of an X5, it’s not as thrilling as in an X3. Hence, I keep quoting the perfect application of the B58 are following in my view.

X3M40i
M340i
M240i

Probably the best application of a B58 is the Toyota Supra- I haven’t driven it but, I’m sure it will be super thrilling. I come across them plenty during my daily commutes. It’s fast and sounds great. Unfortunately, being a Toyota. Nobody wants to pay 70 grand for a small Toyota car which doesn't have same brand appeal as the BMW. Hence, their sales too are abysmal.

Again on the V8 topic. I drive my sister’s car regularly. It’s not as impressive as the turbo charged inline 6 B58.

X5 in comparison feels like a whale (for lack of better word..LOL) and is not nimble and thrilling as the X3.

For all my car purchases, I don’t care for any other parameters except only one parameter-how they drive. For me the decision is too simple (probably, I am a minority…haha)

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

I'm sure its gonna be a competent product, and I've got my eyes on the pricing since it would be a great replacement to the X3 30d which we've been using for a while. But if its a crore then it certainly makes sense to spend a bit more and get an X5 which would just give us so much more.

Please do consider the X3M40i and it would be a worthy successor to your 30d. It will put a smile on your face on a “daily” basis.

[robimahanta]

Originally Posted by mobike008

I have several friends who own the M340i and a couple of them switched to X3M40i. Also, do take a look at BMW blogs and you will see this saga continues with owners in the US.

This is interesting especially since road conditions are way better in US with comparatively less stress regarding ground clearance and tyre damage than in India. What exactly is the rationale behind this?
Is it because the M340i is 0.3 sec faster to 60mph, over 400lbs lighter and around 2000USD cheaper than the X3 M40i?

[itwasme]

Without even driving these two, isn’t it common knowledge that a sedan from the same stable + engine/gearbox combination will always handle better and be, more fun to drive?

As against any SUV, a sedan would enjoy:
- Lower GC, which should mean lesser body roll.
- Lesser height means lower resistance and better aerodynamics.
- Lower profile tyres and performance based tyre compound.
- Lighter, any day.
- Better seating for manoeuvrability and control.
- Stiffer suspension setup at the cost of comfort.

I really don’t believe that X3M40i would be more fun to drive. It may be more practical on bad roads and be forgiving with drivers who tend to drop them in potholes, but a sedan will always be more fun to drive.

[mobike008]

Originally Posted by robimahanta

This is interesting especially since road conditions are way better in US with comparatively less stress regarding ground clearance and tyre damage than in India. What exactly is the rationale behind this?

Simple rational. Nobody wants to drive a sedan if an SUV provides almost similar performance experience as performance and comfort needs to go hand in hand. That is why X3M40i is such a rounded product and super popular globally for performance enthusiasts who don't want to compromise on comfort and practicality.

The key word here is “almost similar performance as an M340i” as people don’t buy these cars to go racing.

It’s a daily driver for 99% of the people who buy it (Hope the miles that I clocked tells you the story. And, I work 100% from home unlike many who drive to work)

If you are familiar with US car market, Sedans are just fading away into oblivion. Their sales are dropping YoY as everyone is moving to SUV’s as people in US need lots of space (they carry family, equipment, dogs and what not). Some MFG’s have even stopped making sedans.

It’s not like India, where people buy these products to drive on weekends or a couple of long trips in a year. We use them to go grocery shopping, buy home goods, Pots, Plants and all kinds of paraphernalia which is stuffed to the brim in the boot.

My wife curses me for buying the X3 as she likes bigger cars and keeps telling me there is no space and tells me, why I didn't buy the X5.

To summarize- X3 M40i is a practical, super functional SUV that does daily duties with aplomb while not getting compromised from a performance perspective.

You are an M340i owner, I won’t be surprised if you make a switch after driving it, if you value practicality.

Originally Posted by robimahanta

Is it because the M340i is 0.3 sec faster to 60mph, over 400lbs lighter and around 2000USD cheaper than the X3 M40i?

Nobody cares for these marginal differences as they don’t matter outside of a racetrack. Real life is different.

[robimahanta]

Originally Posted by mobike008

Simple rational. Nobody wants to drive a sedan if an SUV provides almost similar performance experience as performance and comfort needs to go hand in hand..

..as people don’t buy these cars to go racing.

It’s a daily driver for 99% of the people who buy it..
..Sedans are just fading away into oblivion.

..It’s not like India, where people buy these products to drive on weekends or a couple of long trips in a year.

You are an M340i owner, I won’t be surprised if you make a switch after driving it, if you value practicality.

Nobody cares for these marginal differences as they don’t matter outside of a racetrack. Real life is different.

A lot of assumptions and generalisations there. But I do get your point. It seems as if the X5 40i/60i is an even better all rounded car going by what you mentioned.

As for me, I am happy with the M340i even with all its weaknesses. Also I don’t value practicality as much as you, so I wouldn’t have cared even if the M340i was a two door coupe. But being a CKD with a launch price of 62.9 lacs in India, it sure was great value in monetary terms. I am not sure if the X3 M40i being a CBU with a 360hp spec B58 and other marginal differences will be great value in India if it inches close to 1 cr. Might as well get the extremely impractical and ugly M2 (G87) with a manual instead.

[jfk1975]

Originally Posted by mobike008

Nobody wants to drive a sedan if an SUV provides almost similar performance experience as performance and comfort needs to go hand in hand.

"Nobody"? I can list at least one entity that disagrees with that pretty blanket assessment, and that would be <drum roll please> - BMW

[vj123]

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

Yes the X3 M40i will be more practical, no doubt. But in terms of a driving experience I'm certain the 340i will be better.

Performance SUVs have improved a lot in the recent past but i agree to the fact that they aren't better in terms of driving dynamics & performance of the equivalent sedan version as one cannot defy physics. I have driven 340i & X3M40i and would pick the sedan version any day. In fact i got the M3 over the X3M even though X3M has some impressive numbers on paper, more practicality and preferred by the masses.

Originally Posted by robimahanta

This is interesting especially since road conditions are way better in US with comparatively less stress regarding ground clearance and tyre damage than in India. What exactly is the rationale behind this?

Its just tied to overall fact that the general public prefers SUVs and sedans are a dying breed in the US irrespective of brands or variants. But if you look at the Ms, M3 outsells X3M, M5 outsells X5M and the list goes on. BMW does not provide the sales figures of every variant as their overall 3 series sales report includes (330, 340 and M3) but one can get an idea with the vehicle available in the dealer inventory.

[avira_tk]

BMW India is going to price this launch version quite competitively, but plastic seats, no heat rejection glass and sunshades is going to be miserable in the Indian summer.

Originally Posted by mobike008

Secondly, the video that you shared includes “Paid Promotion” as it says that right from the beginning.

A small clarification, I've been subscribed to autogefuehl for a long time now, they say paid promotion as the car is from the manufacturer's press fleet. This is similar to the team bhp disclaimer. The conclusions are best ignored, the reviews include the autobahn acceleration run and are very detailed.

[d3mon]

SUVs were never meant to handle well.

However, with everyone and their dog wanting to buy a SUV (pseudo or otherwise), the engineers had no choice but to try and stuff them with space age technology to make them handle somewhat close to their sedan siblings.

Pick any super SUV - they all have the following:

1) Air suspension
2) Adaptive dampers
3) Active anti roll bars

The last one is particularly interesting - it allows the anti-roll bar to be extremely soft, or to be extremely stiff. The even more advanced ones can apply torsion force via electric motors to further limit the roll! Keeping soft anti roll bars allow the suspension to remain soft and absorb bumps well - making the SUV ride well when not cornering, and allowing it to corner flat when required.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a3...oll-bars-work/

The point I'm trying to make is that while all you need to make a Sedan handle is a well tuned suspension. An SUV, because of its inherent compromises, is a completely different ball game and it's not until you throw a LOT of money & tech at the suspension that it begins to handle well.

The X3 M40i only gets adaptive dampers. So it's pointless to think that it will handle anywhere close to the M340i, on the track or in the real world. In fact, because it rides high and needs stiff suspension + anti roll bars to stop it from rolling over, I'm pretty sure that it'll ride AND handle worse than the M340i.

[Reesnat]

From a driving dynamics perspective the M340i will eat the X3M40i for breakfast, lunch and dinner. There is simply no two ways about this. Surprised this comparison was even made.

But from a practicality perspective the X3 M40i makes a lot of sense for the Indian market. Just don’t go into it thinking you are going to get the driving dynamics of a similar category sedan.

It’s a fast, practical car with acceptable levels of driving fun, depending on what your definition of this is. If straight line speed is your definition of driving fun, then the X3 M40i makes a good case for Indian conditions.

[Akshay1234]

Originally Posted by mobike008

An important point, Similar to global choices, India has jumped on to the SUV bandwagon. Sedans will slowly get phased out in next decade or so. Sad but, it's a fact.

Let’s not even bring X3M into the picture. It sells a few handful in US and might be same case in India. It’s not a practical car for daily use and is considered by hard core purists.

But, due to the large size of an X5, it’s not as thrilling as in an X3. Hence, I keep quoting the perfect application of the B58 are following in my view.

X3M40i
M340i
M240i

Again on the V8 topic. I drive my sister’s car regularly. It’s not as impressive as the turbo charged inline 6 B58.

I hope the auto companies spending billions of dollars on their R&D know that sedans are going to slowly get phased out.

How is the X3M impractical? The suspension is stiffer, and its got the S58 engine (similar to your B58 but with an injection of testosterone), but it can do pretty much everything a regular X3 can.

My list of fun applications of the B58 are completely the opposite of yours, and I would add the Z4 (Supra) between the 240i and 340i.

Would request you to drive a V8 in possibly a better chassis before you come to any conclusions.

[Speedrider75]

Originally Posted by Reesnat

From a driving dynamics perspective the M340i will eat the X3M40i for breakfast, lunch and dinner. There is simply no two ways about this. Surprised this comparison was even made.

But from a practicality perspective the X3 M40i makes a lot of sense for the Indian market. Just don’t go into it thinking you are going to get the driving dynamics of a similar category sedan.

It’s a fast, practical car with acceptable levels of driving fun, depending on what your definition of this is. If straight line speed is your definition of driving fun, then the X3 M40i makes a good case for Indian conditions.

Totally agree. They are 2 very different cars.


But both are extremely desirable due to the brilliant B58+ZF combination bunged into both + both can be daily drivers. So, comparisons are inevitable.


One way to simplify this comparison for your needs (at the 85L-1.2cr OTR price points):

1) Fast (Straightline; compared to other SUVs around corners) + Very Practical - X3M40i
2) Faster (period) + Practical (but GC/your back be damned) - M340i
3) Fastest (period) + Practical(*** is that) - New M2 *

* Only for comparing speed/fastness. S58+near impossible to use as a daily driver in India.

[Wanderers]

The X3 M40i ex-showroom price is 88 lakhs in Delhi NCR. This will be CKD but initial few may be CBU. Getting lot of goodies on booking but it’s beyond my budget. I got the details from Sales Manager as I was in touch with him for other models of X3.
I also got email to book.

[84.monsoon]

Originally Posted by Wanderers

The X3 M40i ex-showroom price is 88 lakhs in Delhi NCR. This will be CKD but initial few may be CBU. Getting lot of goodies on booking but it’s beyond my budget. I got the details from Sales Manager as I was in touch with him for other models of X3.

This is a really sweet price if true. The price will be sustainable only if the car will eventually come as a CKD unit a few months down the line.

For those who want a more spacious interior, a better suspension and more ground clearance, and are willing to forgo the special feel and handling a Sedan will provide, as well as a few fractions of a second in acceleration times, this is a great choice indeed. The OTR price will be around 25 lakh above that of the M340i (around 1.1 Cr) which could be a showstopper for some.

However, one thing to consider between the X3M40i and M340i is that the X3 is an older design (2017 global launch) versus the G20 3 series, which was launched globally in 2019. The next generation X3 is expected to launch globally by 2024 so the car may not feel as fresh a year or two down the line. One of the reasons BMW has not provided iDrive 8 in the X3 may be due to the compatibility of the large split touch screen with the currnet X3's interior architecture.