[GTO]

Mahindra will 100% develop an SUV larger than the XUV700 & Scorpio-N. At one time, their flagship was the Scorpio. Then, the XUV500 came along & moved Mahindra upmarket. Post that, the XUV700, Scorpio-N, Thar 2-door (which tops out at 20 lakhs) and the Thar 4-door. You can see how, slowly & steadily, their flagship pricing has gone from 15 lakh rupees to 30 lakh rupees. Not to forget, they have sold the Alturas G4 at 35-40 lakhs. 1000 bucks bet that it will be called XUV900.

Mahindra is ambitious. If 10,000 people a month bought the XUV700, you can bet there are a good number of people who will pay for something bigger, plusher, more powerful at 40-lakh rupees.

With reference to exports, let us not forget that Europe & USA are developing a very "Anti-China" stance and imposing heavy duties on imports from this region. The only way to tap Europe & USA is by building factories there. The factory & brand building bill will run into billions of dollars. Not to forget, with due respect to the XUV700 & Scorpio-N, they aren't quite "global quality" yet.

Tata, on the other hand, is already present in developed markets like USA, China, Germany etc. Their overseas company is called Jaguar-Land Rover .

[Gaur]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Not soon IMHO!

Lest we forget - Mahindra has a LOT of vehicles in development and already announced that are on their plate for the medium term:

• XUV e8
• XUV e9
• Mahindra Global Pickup based on ScorpioN
• BE 05
• BE 07
• BE 09
• Thar E

My gut feel says few of these BE vehicles might get the axe, large battery electric vehicles (SUV's) somehow don't make sense, more so in India.

I feel they should let go a few of these and focus on a larger premium vehicle or a petrol-hybrid powertrain.

[ajitmoses]

Mahindra is doing something interesting in the two wheeler segment. They are bringing back extinct international brands and creating international products. BSA, Yezdi, Jawa for example are iconic brands. What Mahindra could do is the same approach for their 4 wheelers. Buy some iconic brands or struggling global brands and make a new line of products.

[VJ05]

Originally Posted by GTO

You can see how, slowly & steadily, their flagship pricing has gone from 15 lakh rupees to 30 lakh rupees. Not to forget, they have sold the Alturas G4 at 35-40 lakhs. 1000 bucks bet that it will be called XUV900.

10 years ago who would have thought Tata & Mahindra will sell 30L rupees Cars. Even today my better half looks down on these brands. Slowly but surely, in the next 5 years, they will move to the 45-50L segment.

[PreludeSH]

Originally Posted by Gaur

My gut feel says few of these BE vehicles might get the axe, large battery electric vehicles (SUV's) somehow don't make sense, more so in India.

I feel they should let go a few of these and focus on a larger premium vehicle or a petrol-hybrid powertrain.

Could be. Ford has dropped plans for large 3 row SUVs as BEVs. They see battery costs being very high and they will instead focus on hybrids at that class.

[DRPSREDDY]

Originally Posted by GTO

Mahindra will 100% develop an SUV larger than the XUV700 & Scorpio-N. At one time, their flagship was the Scorpio. Then, the XUV500 came along & moved Mahindra upmarket. Post that, the XUV700, Scorpio-N, Thar 2-door (which tops out at 20 lakhs) and the Thar 4-door. You can see how, slowly & steadily, their flagship pricing has gone from 15 lakh rupees to 30 lakh rupees. Not to forget, they have sold the Alturas G4 at 35-40 lakhs. 1000 bucks bet that it will be called XUV900.

100% Agree with you they will be selling a super luxury SUV. But it is not the company but they should be able to nurture a brand so well it should be able to grow and build it's own value. Thar is one such sub-brand that can sell a 60 lakh SUV in the next 30 years if it can sustain and evolve into a brand.

Hindustan Ambassador is one such lost brand. If they were in the right path, today the brand would have made a continued inroads into the Prime Minister and President's convoy like what the Russian Aurus brand name could evolve.

[Akash5653]

They might be on to something like this already. But the real question to be asked is, would people be comfortable spending 40-50 lakhs plus on a Mahindra? We have already seen it with the alturas and how they failed. It's always better to move one step at a time like other bhpians had mentioned.

[Mystic]

It is all about brand building and PR exercise. One needs to invest billions of dollars. Take quality control very seriously. Give a cash incentive to anybody who can show a niggle in Mahindra vehicle. Make this a PR exercise ( I worked in a German company and many of the error messages of our applications always pop up to the users in English and very rarely in a very tricky situation, the error message is spit out in German language. To close this small gap, our company gave a cash incentive to any user who can show an error message on his laptop with German language message. This commitment to make zero niggles once in a million probability of it happening like in six sigma is acheived.)

Once six sigma like quality is achieved, then introduce a very powerful diesel 6 cylinder pickup truck in USA managing all the pollution related clearances with a name that resonates with locals like Sequoia etc. Then the international crowd would notice Mahindra brand. Until then it is only the Indian patriots like us buying their stuff. Anything above 4 cylinders is not for Indian market as we are not an OPEC country and gas is very costly.

[RobotMan]

( I worked in a German company and many of the error messages of our applications always pop up to the users in English and very rarely in a very tricky situation, the error message is spit out in German language. To close this small gap, our company gave a cash incentive to any user who can show an error message on his laptop with German language message. This commitment to make zero niggles once in a million probability of it happening like in six sigma is achieved.)

Mahindra already does this. Everybody from line workers to officers are expected to contribute to continuous improvement ideas, which are rewarded accordingly. As a company, Mahindra has world class protocols developed via collaboration with Renault, Chevrolet and Ford. The bigger issue is implementation is supplier quality assurance.

I talked to a supplier for Maruti a while back. They make Class B parts (not visible to customer, but structurally significant). The overall operation was very risk prone and market conditions dependent. They had very little cash on hand to cover any problems. Financial mismanagement on the supplier's part affects the parts quality and there is very little the parent company can do.

This I think is the key to become a global player. Improve the supplier base not just from a quality perspective but also by introducing guidelines which reduces the number of individually owned businesses in the supply chain. Every critical supplier should have their finances tracked as well.

If Mahindra can achieve that, quality should improve even further. Which might eventually snowball into more sales and a better reputation.

Sales and service is a similar story. Too little cash in hand, too much leverage, talent attrition and lots of compromises.

On a different note, Mahindra's strategy to target the African market and the Australian market are turning quite successful. They have started putting decent numbers in those markets and 10-15 years down the line, they can definitely be considered one of the major players.

For now, I don't think Mahindra should bother with a 50 lac SUV.

[ambarkhan]

In 20 years, 5.5 lakhs becomes 30 lakhs with a little over 8.5% CAGR. So, a Scorpio launched in 2002 for 5.5 lakhs could become 30 lakhs in 20 years (of course, with all advancements). Ten years down the line, we might end up paying 40 lakhs for a new-generation Scorpio.

Also, I would not pay double that cost for the same 2.2L engine. Time is against Mahindra to develop a larger, new engine—perhaps a domestic V6? Or maybe a PHEV with the existing MHAwk/mStallion engines?

I don’t consider BEV as automotive products, they are consumer electronic goods (if not why Xiaomi/OLA etc are making one?)

[DicKy]

Ofcourse YES!! Though we have to see how their XUV e8, XUV e9, BE 05, BE 07, BE 09 pans out and how the Mahindra Global Pickup is received in the international market.

Kid me would always dream of a future where the Tata Safari would go against the Landcruiser, Mahindra Scorpio would go against the Prado/Pajero and Indica/Indigo would turn out to be formidable Corolla/Civic/Accord/Camry rivals.

With the chance of the mini-Fortuner being launched in India, Mahindra can pre-empt by launching a Fortuner size SUV. Only doubt would be in the engine department. Guess, Mahindra may find it easier to put twin turbochargers in the 2.2l than design a whole new larger engine.

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

Toyota and Honda too struggled to sell luxury cars despite having utmost reliability and had to launch luxury subsidaries like LEXUS and ACCURA to tap into the luxury market.

Nah. Not quite. They didn't struggle per se. The new brands were introduced so that they could export even more expensive cars to make up for the voluntary export limits for cars exported to USA from Japan. The Honda Legend, Toyota Cressida were pretty successful models worldwide. It was actually the success of the Cressida that gave Toyota the courage to go all out on the Lexus LS400.

Originally Posted by DRPSREDDY

and Tata’s Safari that is owned by Nissan in international markets.

Guess, the Safari is now owned by TATA only. Porsche couldn't name their 911 Dakar as the 911 Safari cause TATA owns the right to the Safari name. Safari (Tata Motors denied permission to Porsche for using 'Safari' name on 911 Dakar)

Nissan Patrol used to be called Nissan Safari, but now it is more like a variant for the Y61 Patrol in the GCC market.

[DRPSREDDY]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Nah. Not quite. They didn't struggle per se. The new brands were introduced so that they could export even more expensive cars to make up for the voluntary export limits for cars exported to USA from Japan. .

Didn't mean Struggle to sell. Meant people weren't ready to accept the brand as luxury. Both of us mean the same.

Originally Posted by DicKy

Guess, the Safari is now owned by TATA only. Porshce couldn't name their 911 Dakar as the 911 Safari cause TATA owns the right to the Safari name.

Didn't know it. Then this will be a step easier for Tata Motors.

Ford too used to have a sedan called Scorpio in 1980s that is no longer in production (ended in 1998). I think that name plate is discarded by Ford. So Mahindra should have a claim on the name plate too. Similarly Ford Sierra to ended production in 1993.

[funnysaltbrick]

Baby steps. They have a cave-in cut in the ANZ market (Cricket and immigration is a hell of a cultural exchange) due to the XUV700 and Scorpio N. Thar "Roxx" will go there in a bit. Mahindra has the makings to truly go global. They were a founding member in Formula E and are still in the championship. They have the base to soar. But for that to happen, they should work on their ability to cope up with niggles and errors. Address them at a production level and not let the end-user figure it out.

Another point of push should be in Hybrids. Their old partner, Ford, literally dropped the idea for a 3-row SUV BEV platform because of the RoI not justifying the costs. So, Mahindra should take note and put some finance aside for the PHEV and Hybrid platforms. Mahindra has excellent ICE engines. The MStallion and MHawk platforms have been massive boons and are definitely world class. Hybridising them for a global appeal could certainly work.

Also, observe and take points on how markets work. A hypothetical XUV900 land-barge SUV in the Land-cruiser class would work well in North America where everything is XXL but it would not work in UK and EU's small and tiny roads. Conversely, something like the 3xO would not work in the NA market due to size. So, making portfolios that cater to the needs of the market is prime targets.

Lastly, invest in global touchpoints. Exports can be done but it cannot last forever as the costs and demands could balloon up fast. Investing in a plant overseas in South-east Asia/EU/NA could make them sell to more people and also have a touchpoint where they could get ground level details. In my opinion, Mahindra has a larger appeal to go global than Tata does. What matters is that they take baby steps to it with a consistent pace.

[CARDEEP]

I believe they only need to get the XUV & Scorpio(n) brands better space efficient. They can make these marginally longer to carve put space for 3rd row passengers & for luggage with all seats folded up.
More in case of ScorpioN, which could have been the David to Fortuner if it were designed better. Indian Everest/ Endeavour IMO.
Mahindra’s game plan is to make money & brand from the SUV juggernaut (rightfully so) & product differentiation in same segments. The buyers would have multiple choices to pick up from. Add to this their vehicles are top class safety rated then the reliable “T”.
Post that Safari hitting Fortuner arising from family dispute, I would rather avoid untested Indian made & for Indian Japanese products
(sorry for this rant).

[Cliff9091]

They may not develop something that rivals the LC Series or the Patrol series, Mahindra may develop something that sits between the Fortuner and Prado but bring it at a price of a Fortuner. This will only be possible when there are good sales figures to show for, I do not think 5-6k units can be sold in India, M&M will also need to bring in a good number from overseas markets.

There has been a lot of PR push by Mahindra especially in Aus, NZ and SA. Maybe based on how the new global pick up fares in these markets mahindra will take a call on this "bigger suv". Also the all new line of BE Products and XUV e.8/e.9 is being tested extensively. Maybe they market this in overseas as well. Mahindra should focus a lot on the Canadian market where there is a lot of indian diaspora and also chinese ev's and ice vehicles have not been accepted well.

It would be a dream for me to see another turn key product from Mahindra like the Scorpio. Hopefully this new "bigger suv" does for Mahindra what Lexus did for Toyota