I seem to have drawn quite a few reactions!
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Originally Posted by MileCruncher How the heck did I miss such an engrossing debate. Damn! |
Der Aaye, Durust Aaye The more the merrier.
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Originally Posted by blackbeast We all know that in the present times, technology in diesel engines have replaced the petrols in terms of FE... If you price the petrol and diesel same, the very purpose of saving the money for someone who commutes 60km+ a day defeats. |
blackbeast, diesels have superior FE as well as almost comparable power to petrol. Add to it the superior torque which makes them suitable for heavier vehicles. The suitability of diesel engines was never being debated here. It was the pricing.
In many EU nations, diesel is more expensive then petrol, but people still buy diesels. Why? Because of efficiency and (now) lesser pollution.
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 So many people get subsidies, so under what criteria should I not get a subsidy. |
Both you and I drive diesel vehicles, Tanveer, and enjoy the subsidy. The point is *IF* it is withdrawn and a suitable alternative provided, then would we buy it at market price?
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Originally Posted by shankar.balan Boss - Railways should simply be "electrified" the way they are the world over. |
Apart from substantial infrastructural costs in electrifying the entire Railways, will it actually reduce pollution or consumption of fossil fuels? Since Milecruncher just mentioned this:
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Originally Posted by MileCruncher The pollution of electricity may not be visible but thermal power generation has a much higher carbon foot print than diesel engines. |
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Originally Posted by shankar.balan And if we now plan to start a debate on Power Generation, I think some of my hard earned and paid Tax Money needs to go into creating Thermo-Nuclear/Nuclear Power Plants to serve our country's ever increasing demand for electricity. |
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Originally Posted by MileCruncher And as you said Nuclear Power is the way to go! |
Nuclear Power is hardly the perfect solution. An interesting debate on this is here:
Debate: Does the world need nuclear energy? | Video on TED.com Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan but we dont even have proper roads, proper street lights, proper safety for citizens, decent law and order and bah! the list is endless as no doubt you would have surmised by now! |
Absolutely and totally agree with you. But there are so many things wrong in our country. I wonder if it will help at all to not try and take an initiative to support something that is right (if at all).
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Originally Posted by amitoj Industries generate employment at a large scale, that is why they get tax breaks. |
Similarly, public transport operates at huge economy of scale. Railways need subsidised diesel. State transport buses (and private interstate transport buses too) deserve subsidised diesel. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, a bus transports 50-100 persons at 3 kpl of diesel, while an SUV transports 7 persons at 12 kpl. Isn't that reason enough to subsidise such a frugal fossil-fuel burning solution? CNG pricing is an excellent example. Despite the queues, would a CNG taxi / auto-wallah switch to diesel? Never, as long as the pricing structure remains the same?
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Originally Posted by smrsraja Why are diesel cars more expensive than their petrol counter parts?
Is that just because of the technology? Or because the tax charged by the govt for using the subsidized fuel? |
Both reasons partly. Higher taxes by government for buyers, as well as higher initial costs for a more complex engine, I believe. However, I suspect the auto manufacturers add too much premium for the second reason. Once diesel is no longer cheap, we may see a correction in the difference, because of a reduction in demand for diesel.
In 2004, the Octavia 1.9TDI and the 2.0 petrol cost the same right down to the rupee. No longer, though.
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Originally Posted by Sn1p3r For high mileage Diesel is economic due to subsidy if that is gone it will make no sense for many. Cheers! |
I think the diesel will still be economical after market pricing because a diesel will be at least 30% more efficient for an SUV than a petrol which should almost cover the additional maintenance costs.
At the risk of getting flamed for changing my initial statement, let me add that apart from setting up the appropriate distribution system, the high initial taxation on diesels should be removed before expecting anyone to pay market price for diesel.
I also strongly believe that the automobile lobby will be able to influence the government to remove the high initial taxes on diesel vehicles if fuel subsidy is removed. However, let me also add that I strongly think that the same automobile lobby are a major reason why the diesel subsidy is still being enjoyed by many of us today.
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Originally Posted by blackbeast Why is there a debate for something which can never happen in india. |
That's the whole idea of a forum like this, I think. Without such forums, I wouldn't even have guessed SO MANY people are willing to pay the market price for diesel (and so many are not!).