[sgiitk]

I am not surprised. It is a nice conservative design (as are GM, Ford and Chrysler) and offers good creature comforts and VFM. It may not have the best economy or power then who really cares.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by honeybee

To quote from the same book, when Toyota launched the Lexus brand in the US, it outsold the top three Mercedes models in the US in the first year itself. Remember that Lexus had just one model/variant initially, and till that point Toyota was known as the manufacturer of VFM cars, not luxury cars. The luxury car market was dominated by Mercedes, Audi and such.

I remember the time when the Acura, Lexus, Infiniti etc came out. Engineers at the German companies said outright that we cannot even make this car at the price they are selling it at.

Even before they went into the luxury car business, Toyota changed the way auto manufacturing is done. Till then it was the Henry Ford way with some modifications by GM. Toyota brought concepts like SMED, Taguchi principle, JIT etc to manufacturing which was then adopted the world over.

[honeybee]

At every point in the book "The Toyota Way", the author keeps reminding you that merely implementing the systems and procedures that Toyota employs does not mean a company is following The Toyota Way. The reason why it's successful at Toyota is years and years of discipline and following of some basic underlying principles.

For e.g. take the principle of Genchi Genbutsu (sp?) which means see the problem yourself. Even a vice president would take a walk through the workshop regularly to see how things are functioning. How many of us see the CEOs or other top managers of our companies spending time with the line workers to see how things are moving?

One of the managers who switched jobs from an American auto manufacturer to Toyota notes he was surprised to see a senior manager from Toyota UNHAPPY when he said the assembly line hadn't been stopped for several days. Why? The senior manager from Toyota said, "If you haven't stopped the assembly line in so many days, it's very likely there's a problem you are not seeing."

The Toyota Way encourages a line worker to stop the assembly line if he/she notices something wrong (for e.g. a defective part or a workmanship defect). Stopping an assembly line is a cardinal sin for most other manufacturers, and the worker would be quickly shown the door. However he knows the senior management will respect his decision and focus on solving the root cause. This is how the senior management can instill the sense of quality in the workforce.

I remember reading from The Maruti Story when the Suzuki management decided to have common lunch facilities and toilets for the workers and managers, where everyone from the line worker to the president wore the same uniform. This was unheard of in the Indian manufacturing industry (is so even today). This goes a long way towards establishing a better work culture.

[Equus]

Nice thread, indeed! In 1997 in the US, a Hyundai was considered like how we consider Ambassador cars today in India. Imagine that

In India - they arent cheap, but offer tremendous value proposition at the reasonably higher cost..

[Jignesh]

Originally Posted by Equus

Nice thread, indeed! In 1997 in the US, a Hyundai was considered like how we consider Ambassador cars today in India. Imagine that

Yes. That is exactly what the article is all about - How Hyundai went from a Joke to Contender in USA.

Infact the article gives really good insights on the following:
1. Building Foundation of Quality & Customer Trust (10 year Warranty)
2. Taking Risks (10 year Warranty)
3. Courage & Willingness to take Risks
4. Market Research - Not just couple of question, but understanding how a customer lives his life around the Car.
5. Customer use Car as personal living space (You cannot just rely on your Engineers views)
6. Constant (on-going) Quality Control. Knowing that one small mistake can derail all the good work of last few years

Thanks,

[elantracrdi05]

Originally Posted by honeybee

Someone mentioned the Santro being #2 reliable, behind a M800. I would rate my Santro to be #1, ahead of the earlier M800, in terms of reliability. Why, the Santro is still selling, which talks volumes about its VFM proposition. And the biggest factor in any VFM is the quality has to be top-notch!

I completely agree! I owned and drove a Santro XP 2004 for 6 years over 126,000 km. Not a single component failed me other than a few brake lights and a headlight. I am not joking - it still was on its original battery when I gave the car to my FIL.

Other than brake pads, tires, a timing belt change at 70,000 km, a front bumper and condenser (due to a shunt), the car was all original! Big bow down to these guys for making it so reliable. That is why I guess a 100,000 mi warranty is doable without going bankrupt.

[k_nitin_r]

While Hyundai and Skoda have managed to maintain their quality in India, the same is not true in other parts of the world. In UAE, Hyundai and Skoda vehicles are known for their defects - when on a budget, folks would buy a Toyota Corolla or Honda Civic with a loan rather than turn to the Korean or the Czech brand. It costs more to have to take (or tow) the car to the service center, get a rental, and lose a day's pay even with a warranty-covered repair.

[praveen_n]

Originally Posted by k_nitin_r

While Hyundai and Skoda have managed to maintain their quality in India, the same is not true in other parts of the world. In UAE, Hyundai and Skoda vehicles are known for their defects - when on a budget, folks would buy a Toyota Corolla or Honda Civic with a loan rather than turn to the Korean or the Czech brand. It costs more to have to take (or tow) the car to the service center, get a rental, and lose a day's pay even with a warranty-covered repair.

I beg to disgree.After 2007 hyundai sales have increased a lot and are not known have much defects.
Even now none of the manufacturers offers as much warranty in middle east as the koreans.I myself had a hyndai, Toyota and Kia (still has one) and I never had any issues with any of these cars but overall the service costs I spent on toyota was higher than hyundai or kia.

[pgsagar]

Has Hyundai really improved its ranking in US OR has the most Americans' standard of living gone down to a point where they can only afford a Korean brand?

In Indian market however, Hyundai is fast losing its reputation. Threre are threads elsewhere on Teambhp about low fuel efficiency, high maintenance costs of Hyundai cars and unfair trade practices by Hyundai delaers. As also serious steering issues on their small cars.

[Jignesh]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Has Hyundai really improved its ranking in US OR has the most Americans' standard of living gone down to a point where they can only afford a Korean brand?

Hyundai Motors is really doing well in American Market. This has nothing to do with falling or rising American Standards of living.

Kindly go through the below facts & figures:
In 2010, a Consumer Reports reliability survey ranked Hyundai (including Kia) as the fourth-best automaker. The ratings reflect the performance, comfort, utility and reliability of more than 280 vehicles that the magazine recently tested.

In January 2012, the Hyundai Elantra was named the North American Car of the Year at the North American International Auto Show, selling more than 200,000 cars since the model's redesigned debut.

Source: Hyundai Motor Company - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thanks,

[chevelle]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Has Hyundai really improved its ranking in US OR has the most Americans' standard of living gone down to a point where they can only afford a Korean brand?

This is the most weird statement i have heard in a while.

There are many factors that affect standard of living. Buying a car and that too a Hyundai is certainly not at top of the list.

Please do go through Hyundai's USA history to see how they rose from poor car image to one of the leading auto brand that most people are now willing to buy due to its reliability, driving experience, features, resale, buying and after sales experience.

Car makers like Honda, Toyota and Nissan has time and again made a statement stating the most feared rival is Hyundai. Not any other company.

Hyundai Sonata caused Nissan to reassess 2013 Altima development

P.S: I don't own a Hyundai in USA.

[NinadJoshi]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

Has Hyundai really improved its ranking in US OR has the most Americans' standard of living gone down to a point where they can only afford a Korean brand?

On a lighter note, no, Americans' standards of living still pretty much the same....they earn 1, borrow 1 and spend 2 like they have always been doing.

On a serious note, Hyundai had achieved what is considered most difficult for an Auto company - it has changed its perception. Thanks to its relentless spirit, it has come of age from its shaggy beginnings some 25 years ago and is finally a 'made' brand (in mafia parlance). Good for Hyundai, because they seem to have overcome what is usually regarded the hardest challenge for a foreign brand.

As for affordability, prices for all vehicles within a segment generally remain more or less the same, per simple market economics. A base trim Hyundai Sonata comes at about the same price as a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry or a Chevy Malibu, give or take a few. People buying a Sonata are no worse off (or better) than those buying other similar vehicles.

[chevelle]

Originally Posted by NinadJoshi

As for affordability, prices for all vehicles within a segment generally remain more or less the same, per simple market economics. A base trim Hyundai Sonata comes at about the same price as a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry or a Chevy Malibu, give or take a few. People buying a Sonata are no worse off (or better) than those buying other similar vehicles.

Also if one considers the percentage of these vehicles going into fleet accord and sonata's number do come out better as their %age is less compared to malibu and camry. What finally matters is the consumer's green signal to such cars and seems they have now agreed that sonata is a good competitor to accord and camry looking at the numbers it does.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by chevelle

Also if one considers the percentage of these vehicles going into fleet accord and sonata's number do come out better as their %age is less compared to malibu and camry. What finally matters is the consumer's green signal to such cars and seems they have now agreed that sonata is a good competitor to accord and camry looking at the numbers it does.

If you are talking about fleet sales to rental companies, I don't think Accord does much of it. Honda as compared to other manufacturers do much less any sales to rental companies.

EDIT: I re-read your post, and it looks like you are also saying the same thing about Accord :-)

Anyway, I don't see why this is good. Fleet sales are good. They increase volumes for the company which essentially brings down the cost.
I am pretty sure, few years from now, Sonata's fleet sales will improve.

[chevelle]

Originally Posted by carboy

EDIT: I re-read your post, and it looks like you are also saying the same thing about Accord :-)

Anyway, I don't see why this is good. Fleet sales are good. They increase volumes for the company which essentially brings down the cost.
I am pretty sure, few years from now, Sonata's fleet sales will improve.

I did mean that accord sales to fleet is very less compared to other cars. Sonata does have good fleet share (~5-7% or so), but others tops it easily. As such most rental companies put their fleets on sale once its done 20k-30k miles but at higher price than normal. Doesn't really go down well with pre-owned buyers.

Yes, numbers are good, but i feel what consumers lap up is more important than fleet sales. The true indicator is if consumers agree. Not fleet sales. That is where CR-V and accord are true sales leader in their segments. Civic use to be one, but has lost it with new civic. It will regain as 2013 is launched.



Its just my opinion. You may not necessarily feel the same.