Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP Worldwide > The International Automotive Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 17th May 2019, 17:58   #1
Senior - BHPian
 
blackwasp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Navi Mumbai
Posts: 1,916
Thanked: 12,176 Times
Default NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) has released a preliminary report on a fatal Tesla crash that happened in Delray Beach, Palm Beach County, Florida.

The incident occurred on March 1, 2019 at 6:17 am when the Tesla Model 3 was on the southbound right through lane of State Highway 441. The car collided with a semi-trailer that was crossing the highway to make a left turn and join the northbound lanes. The footage from nearby surveillance cameras and Tesla’s front camera reportedly shows the semi-trailer slow down in front of the Tesla, blocking its path. The car underrode the trailer after striking the left side and came to a halt 488 m from the crash site. The 50-year old male driver died due to the crash. The driver of the semi-trailer was uninjured.

The NTSB report also states that the Autopilot (autonomous system) on the Tesla was active at the time of the crash. The driver had engaged the system 10 seconds before the impact and in the last 8 seconds, the driver's hands were not detected on the steering wheel. There was no attempt to avoid the crash by the driver or the Autopilot system. The vehicle was travelling at 109 km/h when the accident occurred.

This is just the preliminary report and investigation on other factors like the actions of the driver of the tractor-trailer, highway conditions, survival factors amongst others will continue. NTSB further added that probable cause has not been determined. The cause which will help issue safety recommendations to prevent similar crashes.

In 2017, the NTSB revealed that over-reliance of technology lead to a crash that killed a Tesla driver on May 7, 2016. A second fatal accident occurred on March 2018, which involved a Model X in Autopilot mode in Mountain View, California.

NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident-hwy19fh008fig1.jpg

Name:  HWY19FH008fig2.jpg
Views: 1133
Size:  208.1 KB

Link to the Team-BHP News

Last edited by blackwasp : 17th May 2019 at 18:12.
blackwasp is online now   (4) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2019, 18:56   #2
BHPian
 
katchkamalesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Chennai
Posts: 207
Thanked: 200 Times
Default Re: NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) has released a preliminary report on a fatal Tesla crash that happened in Delray Beach, Palm Beach County, Florida.
[/url][/b]
I have said this before and I will say this again – Offering level 2.5 and 3 Autonomous technology to the general public is a big mistake. No automakers should offer this technology at this level. This is not because of the technology but because of the people using it. Current level of automation requires constant monitoring and taking over the control.

Despite several warnings from automakers that this current technology is an assistive one and people still have to keep monitoring the operation of the vehicle and take control as and when necessary, people still and will continue to misuse this technology. For eg. People handing over the control to the vehicle and doing other activities (sleeping, looking at phone or even having intercourse, yes, people do it)

Already there are numerous hurdles (especially legislative) for autonomous tech and more such accidents will only increase the fear among the public and delay launch of this tech or may even prove a death knell.

Last edited by katchkamalesh : 17th May 2019 at 19:15.
katchkamalesh is offline   (7) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2019, 21:48   #3
Team-BHP Support
 
SmartCat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 4,004
Thanked: 19,830 Times
Default Re: NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
The cause which will help issue safety recommendations to prevent similar crashes.
One very effective solution is to limit speeds (say 60 kmph) when the vehicle is on Autopilot.
SmartCat is online now   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th May 2019, 21:55   #4
Newbie
 
mpp19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 19
Thanked: 26 Times
Default

Sad, this will be a major hurdle for Tesla. It's unfortunate that people do not realise that these are assistive technologies and not auto pilot.

Maybe they should stop calling them 'auto pilot' for starters.
mpp19 is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 18th May 2019, 11:23   #5
BHPian
 
padmrajravi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Kozhikode
Posts: 34
Thanked: 32 Times
Default Re: NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

Quote:
Originally Posted by katchkamalesh View Post
I have said this before and I will say this again – Offering level 2.5 and 3 Autonomous technology to the general public is a big mistake. No automakers should offer this technology at this level.
While I understand the point that they should not offer it at the current level , I think they will do so, simply because there is no way they can get access to the amount of data that is needed to get to the next level. I think Tesla is collecting the driving data and using it to train their systems to improve it. Without community/ crowd sourced data , it would take ages for manufactures to collect the required data , if they do it only through their test runs. But it is a fair point. The technology at current levels is not for common people.
padmrajravi is online now   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20th May 2019, 10:19   #6
Senior - BHPian
 
blackwasp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Navi Mumbai
Posts: 1,916
Thanked: 12,176 Times
Default Re: NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

Quote:
Originally Posted by katchkamalesh View Post
Offering level 2.5 and 3 Autonomous technology to the general public is a big mistake. No automakers should offer this technology at this level... Current level of automation requires constant monitoring and taking over the control.
I agree, but at the same time, there is only so much testing and simulation one can do right? Not only is it time consuming, it will be really tricky to come up with all the situations encountered on a day to day basis on a closed off track / area.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmartCat View Post
One very effective solution is to limit speeds (say 60 kmph) when the vehicle is on Autopilot.
That will probably mitigate some dangers, but won't reduce them right? Further, interpolating slow speed date x times to get high speed behaviour won't work as systems work differently / need different inputs at faster speeds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpp19 View Post
Maybe they should stop calling them 'auto pilot' for starters.
Yes, the Autopilot name itself is misleading and is over engineered to some extent - eg even if it asks driver to keep hands on wheels after some time, the car will maintain the lane / speed even if driver fails to do so. People are just taking advantage of this fact to do other things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by padmrajravi View Post
I think Tesla is collecting the driving data and using it to train their systems to improve it. Without community/ crowd sourced data , it would take ages for manufactures to collect the required data , if they do it only through their test runs. But it is a fair point.
Thats the way to go. Imagine the time, effort and resources needed to recreate all possible scenarios in labs.

Quote:
The technology at current levels is not for common people.
I will disagree. A potential Tesla buyer is not your average 'common people'. That said I get the intent of your post and there should be better driver awareness, training etc. but we humans are bunch of impatient folks who will try to skip to the end of the training as fast as possible.

Last edited by blackwasp : 20th May 2019 at 10:21.
blackwasp is online now   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20th May 2019, 15:05   #7
BHPian
 
katchkamalesh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Chennai
Posts: 207
Thanked: 200 Times
Default Re: NTSB links Tesla crash to Autopilot; 3rd such fatal accident

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
I agree, but at the same time, there is only so much testing and simulation one can do right? Not only is it time consuming, it will be really tricky to come up with all the situations encountered on a day to day basis on a closed off track / area.
I agree with the testing and validation part but at what cost? Many OEMs (BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, Ford etc) are skipping level 3 for this very reason.

Quoting a study published by Deloitte on Consumers’ appetite for self-driving vehicles:
“A series of high-profile incidents may have contributed to the plateau in consumer trust in this year’s study, but there will likely be a longer-term trend toward gradual acceptance,”

https://www2.deloitte.com/global/en/...-adoption.html

If consumers lose confidence in autonomous technology then no one will ever be interested even in sitting in one, forget buying one. To gain consumer confidence, it is imperative that autonomous technology should be able to eliminate all type of accidents.

In Europe, over 90% of accident is due to human error.

To put it in a number perspective, of 100 accidents 90 is cause by driver. Let’s say autonomous tech is able to reduce 98.89% of accidents which means that there will still be an (1) accident.

As a consumer I wouldn’t be willing to take that chance. Simply because I do not want to be that the guy who got killed or injured in car that I have no control over.
katchkamalesh is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Off-Road Videos / Links Thread - Post all 4x4 videos & links here! ramkya1 4x4 Excursions 196 25th January 2019 01:01
Tesla owner switches on Autopilot and chills in passenger seat; court suspends his driving licence blackwasp Drive Safe 23 5th May 2018 11:28
3rd J&K Bank Mughal Rally. EDIT : Passiontodrive suffers fatal accident Passiontodrive Indian Motorsport 37 4th July 2012 21:57
PICS : FATAL Lancer 1.8 Invex Crash GTO Street Experiences 45 24th November 2005 23:29
Fatal Bike Crash normally_crazy Street Experiences 23 17th November 2005 23:05


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 11:03.

Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks