BAR F1 banned for 2 races

Abhay · 5th May 2005, 18:18

BAR have been banned for 2 races (Spanish GP and Monaco) after an appeal court found them guilty of running "underweight" cars at Imola.

This was after the stewards had accepted BAR's explanation at the race about why Button's car was 5.4kg underweight.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/moto...ne/4514569.stm

This is one of the most important and tough decision taken in the sport against what is effectively cheating and Honda will severely lose face in this !

Infact the FIA wanted to throw BAR-Honda out of F1 for 2005 but they got away with 2 race ban and a 6 month suspended ban.

Harrie · 5th May 2005, 18:44

You beat me to it dude. I just saw it on planet-f1.

any how here is the link www.planet-f1.com its the headline on the site

shravan316 · 5th May 2005, 20:10

Ouch! 2 races means a lot in F1 and worse still is the image of a "cheater".... Whether done intentionally or unintentionally, in F1 where precision is everything, its a shame on BAR Honda's part. One year makes a huge difference, last year BAR was giving Ferrari a tough fight( well, sorta..) and this year...

Dippy · 5th May 2005, 20:34

Just read the news on F1live.com. BAR have to consider themselves lucky to have just got a ban for 2 races whereas the FIA had actually asked for BAR to be thrown out of the 2005 WC on the whole. This is certainly a set back for BAR as they had just started upping their pace. On to top it all they have lost the Imola points as well.

Boy is this season getting interesting or what.

Dippy

aveek · 5th May 2005, 23:04

Ouch... yeah, that is really gonna make em lose face... though I think that throwing them out for the whole season, even as n example, would be way too much... very sad, but on the brighter side, McLaren got a (delayed) podium finish!! WHEEE!!!!

Cheers!!
Aveek

nitrous · 5th May 2005, 23:46

Quote:

Whether done intentionally or unintentionally

shrav, 5.4 kgs in a F1 car is too intentional!

Hatari · 6th May 2005, 01:41

what i understood from the various reports, was that BAR used fuel as ballast, in a secret compartment and when the FIA asked them to drain the car of its fuel there were still 8kgs of fuel still remaining

it ultimately comes down to a technicality, its not as simple as the car just being underweight

papps · 6th May 2005, 11:12

I think the FIA is being to harsh on this decision, banning for the 2 races is still understandable, but no championship points for quite some time, this is crazy...

and whether BAR did this intentionally or unintentionally, god knows, but something like this is not done unintentionally

Shan2nu · 6th May 2005, 11:46

Aren't the cars checked by the officials before every race? Somebody hasn't been doing his job right.

Shan2nu

Rtech · 6th May 2005, 12:14

The thing here is that the FIA used a pump to empty out the tanks for the first time. BAR claim that the collector tank inside the main tank has to have 6kg of fuel in it at all times or else the car will not run. That 6 kg is considered essential to the car being able to run as that 6kg, just like oil is considered essential. Therefore they argue that the car should be weighed with that 6kg in the collector. They also say that they ran the entire race and passed the post race weigh in showing that they were above the legal weight.

Its complicated. Just depends on whose stroy you prefer. BAR cheaters or BAR smarter than the rest!

SCARLET · 6th May 2005, 12:25

Lucky it was only 2 races BAN what if it was an entire season.

BAR have a point in the claim that the 6Kgs is essential for the car to run and stuff, but 6kgs is like gold dust in F1, imagine a ferrari or a renault with 6 kgs less, what a rocket we would have.

Rtech · 6th May 2005, 12:54

Yes, but the point is that at no point during the race was the BAR below the minimum weight.

Hatari · 6th May 2005, 13:59

the FIA think BAR got off lightly..
they actually wanted a full season ban + a fine of 1 million euro !!

2L8uLoose · 6th May 2005, 23:45

the ban is gonna cost Honda $10 million....makes you think is it worth the "mistake"??

Hatari · 7th May 2005, 01:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2L8uLoose

the ban is gonna cost Honda $10 million....makes you think is it worth the "mistake"??

thats the thing.. it was a technical thing
a bit like the michelin controversy...
its how the rules were interpreted

i'm sure its costing them more than that in negative publicity.. to them & their sponsors

5th May 2005, 18:18	#1
Abhay BHPian Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Pune Posts: 727 Thanked: 11 Times	BAR F1 banned for 2 races BAR have been banned for 2 races (Spanish GP and Monaco) after an appeal court found them guilty of running "underweight" cars at Imola. This was after the stewards had accepted BAR's explanation at the race about why Button's car was 5.4kg underweight. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/moto...ne/4514569.stm This is one of the most important and tough decision taken in the sport against what is effectively cheating and Honda will severely lose face in this ! Infact the FIA wanted to throw BAR-Honda out of F1 for 2005 but they got away with 2 race ban and a 6 month suspended ban.
	() Thanks

5th May 2005, 18:44	#2
Harrie BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: KA 03, KL 12, TN 38 Posts: 701 Thanked: 36 Times View My Garage	You beat me to it dude. I just saw it on planet-f1. any how here is the link www.planet-f1.com its the headline on the site
	() Thanks

5th May 2005, 20:10	#3
shravan316 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,029 Thanked: 9 Times	Ouch! 2 races means a lot in F1 and worse still is the image of a "cheater".... Whether done intentionally or unintentionally, in F1 where precision is everything, its a shame on BAR Honda's part. One year makes a huge difference, last year BAR was giving Ferrari a tough fight( well, sorta..) and this year...
	() Thanks

5th May 2005, 20:34	#4
Dippy Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Mumbai, India Posts: 7,561 Thanked: 2,470 Times	Just read the news on F1live.com. BAR have to consider themselves lucky to have just got a ban for 2 races whereas the FIA had actually asked for BAR to be thrown out of the 2005 WC on the whole. This is certainly a set back for BAR as they had just started upping their pace. On to top it all they have lost the Imola points as well. Boy is this season getting interesting or what. Dippy
	() Thanks

5th May 2005, 23:04	#5
aveek BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 294 Thanked: 2 Times	Ouch... yeah, that is really gonna make em lose face... though I think that throwing them out for the whole season, even as n example, would be way too much... very sad, but on the brighter side, McLaren got a (delayed) podium finish!! WHEEE!!!! Cheers!! Aveek
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 01:41	#7
Hatari Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Calcutta Posts: 1,872 Thanked: 874 Times	what i understood from the various reports, was that BAR used fuel as ballast, in a secret compartment and when the FIA asked them to drain the car of its fuel there were still 8kgs of fuel still remaining it ultimately comes down to a technicality, its not as simple as the car just being underweight Last edited by Hatari : 6th May 2005 at 01:49.
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 11:12	#8
papps BHPian Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Newcastle, UK Posts: 271 Thanked: 0 Times	I think the FIA is being to harsh on this decision, banning for the 2 races is still understandable, but no championship points for quite some time, this is crazy... and whether BAR did this intentionally or unintentionally, god knows, but something like this is not done unintentionally
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 11:46	#9
Shan2nu Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Hubli - Karnata Posts: 5,533 Thanked: 125 Times View My Garage	Aren't the cars checked by the officials before every race? Somebody hasn't been doing his job right. Shan2nu
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 12:14	#10
Rtech Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 5,770 Thanked: 359 Times View My Garage	The thing here is that the FIA used a pump to empty out the tanks for the first time. BAR claim that the collector tank inside the main tank has to have 6kg of fuel in it at all times or else the car will not run. That 6 kg is considered essential to the car being able to run as that 6kg, just like oil is considered essential. Therefore they argue that the car should be weighed with that 6kg in the collector. They also say that they ran the entire race and passed the post race weigh in showing that they were above the legal weight. Its complicated. Just depends on whose stroy you prefer. BAR cheaters or BAR smarter than the rest!
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 12:25	#11
SCARLET Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Bangalore Posts: 219 Thanked: 2 Times	Lucky it was only 2 races BAN what if it was an entire season. BAR have a point in the claim that the 6Kgs is essential for the car to run and stuff, but 6kgs is like gold dust in F1, imagine a ferrari or a renault with 6 kgs less, what a rocket we would have.
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 12:54	#12
Rtech Team-BHP Support Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Bombay Posts: 5,770 Thanked: 359 Times View My Garage	Yes, but the point is that at no point during the race was the BAR below the minimum weight.
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 13:59	#13
Hatari Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Calcutta Posts: 1,872 Thanked: 874 Times	the FIA think BAR got off lightly.. they actually wanted a full season ban + a fine of 1 million euro !!
	() Thanks

6th May 2005, 23:45	#14
2L8uLoose BANNED Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bombay Posts: 628 Thanked: 6 Times View My Garage	the ban is gonna cost Honda $10 million....makes you think is it worth the "mistake"??
	() Thanks