[Redex]

Hi,
I agree with changing all fluids, typically every 50,000 miles (80,000kms) or every 5 years, whichever comes first. If you have the AC topped up periodically I wouldn't bother changing the compressor oil as that should be part of the top up.

I don't agree with the "sealed for life" statement. I work in my son's garage and we get many high mileage older vehicles to work on. When there is a very small leak from parts like the differential it can often go unnoticed as the residue gets washed away or soaked up by dirt. It often goes unnoticed and then we find very low levels of lubricant, just like you did.
For those parts that do not have a drain plug a vacuum pump is a must, or at least a large syringe style pump. As long as you can remove most of the old lubricant and any contaminants.

Regards Neil

My current daily runabout has covered over 300,000kms and the only non service items that have been replaced due to failure/wear are the injection pump (electronics fault). Both front driveshafts. Alternator and battery. Both front anti roll bar links. Water pump and thermostat (still working) but changed during cambelt replacement.
Still on original clutch.

[Jeroen]

I could feel a major change in the performance. Car is much smoother now

I hate to point it out, but if that is true you left a few things too late! All of this is preventive maintenance. So if done correctly and on time you should not notice any difference at all!

Jeroen

[Chethan B G]

Originally Posted by Redex

Hi,
I agree with changing all fluids, typically every 50,000 miles (80,000kms) or every 5 years, whichever comes first. If you have the AC topped up periodically I wouldn't bother changing the compressor oil as that should be part of the top up.

AC refrigerant pressure was good all the while and was never topped up. Therefore I thought of changing compressor oil.

German compressors are expensive to replace and are usually susceptible to failures in hot climate. Changing compressor oil once in 5 years helps.

Originally Posted by Jeroen

I hate to point it out,

You are most welcome to point out anything you feel worthy. Please don't worry!

Originally Posted by Jeroen

but if that is true you left a few things too late! All of this is preventive maintenance. So if done correctly and on time you should not notice any difference at all!

Jeroen

My car was five and a half year old and had about 40k Kms on the ODO when I changed the fluids. Honestly, I would not have replaced these "sealed for life" fluids before that by any standard.

But YES. There was a much perceivable difference before and after the work was done. "Major" was probably an exaggeration, I agree.

Even with a manual transmission I have seen that the shifts becomes much smoother after the fluid is replaced. I had replaced transmission fluid on my Jetta which had a manual GB at around 75k Kms (approximately). It does work.

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by Chethan B G

Update: Even though the recommended maintenance schedule does not ask us to change the transmission / drive train fluids

> Transmission fluid replacement

A little debris in the old oil helps lock gears and therefore, completely flushing out the transmission fluid is not required. Old oil was just drained through the drain plug and the new oil was filled. This will not drain the oil from the torque converter which is not necessary as it is a common sump.

Even I'm planning to change the automatic gearbox transmission oil for BMW X1 F48 sDrive 20d.

So in all total cost be for
ATF 6 Rs 5491 + 18% GST
Labour Rs 12,500 + 18% GST.

Roughly Rs 21,000 or lesser since xDrive oil change wont be part of labour.

Is this correct cost for F48 X1 sDrive ATF replacement?

[Chethan B G]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Is this correct cost for F48 X1 sDrive ATF replacement?

Hi el lobo, in my case the consumables were billed as per actual requirement. But I negotiated on the service cost and got a reduced rate as a package. Since you have only transmission fluid to be replaced, I am not sure how that will be treated.

There are two ways to drain the oil from the transmission unit.

1. Lower the entire transmission assembly and drain through the sump cover. This way, even the oil from the TC housing will be drained.

2. Drain the oil through the drain plug without lowering the assembly. In this case, oil in the TC housing will not be drained.

Once the fresh oil is refilled, the transmission / gear shifts may require calibration using the diagnostic tool.

I went with the second option, as the cleaning agent which is part of the fresh oil, is enough to keep things clean IMO. Little debris is sometimes better that super clean oil in case of the transmission which is in service.

Your decision can also depend on the car mileage. If you have run more than 80k Kms, I would suggest option two. If the mileage is less than 40k Kms, you can choose either of the two.

Since BMW service charges depends on the man-hour spent for the job, you may be able to bargain based on the exact work.

All the best!

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by Chethan B G

Update: Even though the recommended maintenance schedule does not ask us to change the transmission

> Transmission fluid replacement

I asked for a Transmission Oil change estimate from BMW Workshop for F48 X1 sDrive.

They quoted the parts ATF6 Qty at 7 Pcs. Rate was same as your bill at 2745.76 +18% GST.

Whereas your bill showed ATF6 Qty at 2 Pcs.

I'm surprised at such difference in oil quantity between two workshops.

How much is the capacity of oil for transmission oil change?
One bottle of ATF6 is how much ML?

[DRIV3R]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

I asked for a Transmission Oil change estimate from BMW Workshop for F48 X1 sDrive.

They quoted the parts ATF6 Qty at 7 Pcs. Rate was same as your bill at 2745.76 +18% GST.

Whereas your bill showed ATF6 Qty at 2 Pcs.

I'm surprised at such difference in oil quantity between two workshops.

How much is the capacity of oil for transmission oil change?
One bottle of ATF6 is how much ML?

7L of fluid is needed for a full change. Full change entails dropping the Trans Sump and bringing almost all the fluid out and replacing the sump+filter too. Each bottle is 1L usually.

In case of partial replacement, the drain plug in the Trans Sump is undone, and I believe same quantity (as drained) of fresh fluid is added without any sump+filter replacement.

[Chethan B G]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

How much is the capacity of oil for transmission oil change?
One bottle of ATF6 is how much ML?

As I had mentioned in my previous post, if you opt for just the drain and refill method, instead of lowering the entire transmission and draining through the sump cover, you require approximately about 3.5 ltrs.

Total capacity of the transmission including the TC section is 7L.

Each bottle contains 1L.

Originally Posted by DRIV3R

7L of fluid is needed for a full change. Full change entails dropping the Trans Sump and bringing almost all the fluid out and replacing the sump+filter too. Each bottle is 1L usually.

In case of partial replacement, the drain plug in the Trans Sump is undone, and I believe same quantity (as drained) of fresh fluid is added without any sump+filter replacement.

Yes. In case of partial replacement, only the drained quality is refilled. One can repeat the process if required, to dilute the old oil further.

Filter is attached to the sump cover since it is not needed to be replaced. As I understand, idea here is not to completely clean the transmission but to replace some of the old oil with the new one, which has fresh cleaning agents in it.

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by Chethan B G

As I had mentioned in my previous post, if you opt for just the drain and refill method, instead of lowering the entire transmission and draining through the sump cover, you require approximately about 3.5 ltrs.

Total capacity of the transmission including the TC section is 7L.

Each bottle contains 1L.

Was any programming done for gearbox after filling in new oil?

[Chethan B G]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Was any programming done for gearbox after filling in new oil?

A calibration was performed using diagnostic software. I think this is the usual procedure.

[DRIV3R]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Was any programming done for gearbox after filling in new oil?

The scan tool would be used to monitor final fill quantity as it is to be done between 40-50 degree C, with the engine running.

The adaptations are taken care of automatically I presume, in older BMWs there was a procedure you could do to reset adaptation values for transmission at any point of time using diagnostic menu in cluster and A pedal.

This video from FCP Euro has entire procedure in detail.

https://youtu.be/kXKhZievmSI?si=cs6YD_gI15NWOXgj

[adi58]

Originally Posted by el lobo 6061

Even I'm planning to change the automatic gearbox transmission oil for BMW X1 F48 sDrive 20d.

So in all total cost be for
ATF 6 Rs 5491 + 18% GST
Labour Rs 12,500 + 18% GST.

Roughly Rs 21,000 or lesser since xDrive oil change wont be part of labour.

Is this correct cost for F48 X1 sDrive ATF replacement?

Trust the manufacturer's assurance on sealed transmissions, they understand their product best and wouldn't miss a chance to profit from transmission oil changes, so rest assured, there's no need to worry about it. Adding a link to an article that will help.

https://carfromjapan.com/article/car...hensive-guide/

[vishy76]

Originally Posted by adi58

Trust the manufacturer's assurance on sealed transmissions, they understand their product best and wouldn't miss a chance to profit from transmission oil changes, so rest assured, there's no need to worry about it. Adding a link to an article that will help.

https://carfromjapan.com/article/car...hensive-guide/

Sorry to say this, but most of what is written in the article is pure rubbish. The article doesn't provide any proof (qualitative or quantitative) that the so called 'modern' oils it mentions being used in sealed for life transmissions are so superior that they need not be changed forever.

Fluid will always go through heat cycles and pick up metallic debris as it circulates through a gearbox, unless a gearbox which is perfectly rigid and has no internal friction can be built. This means it is being subjected to wear and tear and it will need to be changed. Coming to ease of change, yes I agree it has become tricker to change tranny oils these days. Older ATs had dipsticks to check and even top up oil which newer gearboxes lack.

However, most newer transmissions still have drain plugs and with the correct equipment, it's easy enough to fill oil back up too. Well worth the hassle considering you are prolonging the life of a gearbox here.

Lastly, 'trusting' car manufacturers these days just because they have built the car is highly subject to risks. Would I trust a manufacturer when it comes to oil specs? Yes. Would I trust a manufacturer when it comes to this "sealed for life" theory? Absolutely not. If the fluid is sealed for life, why not give me lifetime warranty on the same gearbox instead of the usual 3 or 5 years? Secondly, what exactly is the 'life' of the transmission? If you are coining the term, might as well also specify how long the 'life' is. This is a grey area car makers love to take advantage of. Claim that it is sealed for life, and when the box fails out of warranty 5-7 years into service, push for full replacement with a huge bill. (Which I believe would be even more profitable than simple oil changes)

[adi58]

Originally Posted by vishy76

However, most newer transmissions still have drain plugs and with the correct equipment, it's easy enough to fill oil back up too. Well worth the hassle considering you are prolonging the life of a gearbox here.

Well, I'd love to see some hard evidence or data backing up your claim that sealed transmissions benefit from regular oil changes in terms of longevity.

[vishy76]

Originally Posted by adi58

Well, I'd love to see some hard evidence or data backing up your claim that sealed transmissions benefit from regular oil changes in terms of longevity.

I already gave you the theory behind such changes. Also please watch the video below. I don't advocate watching this youtuber, but when he asked the dealer what the life of the transmission is, they said 60,000 miles or close to 1,00,000 km

And I again ask the same question, if a manufacturer says the fluid is "sealed for life" (whatever life even means), why not also guarantee or warranty the transmission for life? The only maintenance item I believe on an AT is the fluid. If the fluid is lifetime, then give it a lifetime warranty? Else if it isn't, maybe tell me what 'lifetime' is? It's a transmission after all. Not a cheap part by any means.

I don't need to elaborate more. You can watch videos on YT about this all day. I don't think all mechanics who work on cars would bluff about it.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hi4nzS...eSBraWxtZXI%3D

Another joke, BMW says the ZF8HP used in majority of their cars is sealed for life. However, ZF which builds the gearbox advices change every 50,000 to 75,000 miles or as low as 5 years.

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